Recording without tempo, let Ableton calculate the BPM

[Zyko1]

Dear Ableton friends

I have Ableton and Push and also an MPC Renaissance (running as Plugin in Ableton).
When I have a beat/drumpattern in my mind, i can easily play it on the pads live without problem. My problem is that when i record it and play it back, it sounds completely different because of timing-issues. Main problem for this is that I can't really decide what BPM the beat is beforehand, and therefore it gets messed up when recording and playing back.
Why can't i just record a midi-clip and "tell" Ableton after i hit stop-record that this clip is now "1 bar" long in "4/4", and then ableton can easily calculate (from the clip-length (talking about time, miliseconds) the BPM and set the master-tempo accordingly. Why is that not possible? Is this such a crazy idea? Or am I overseeing the obvious? It would be so much easier this way.

thanks for any advices and helpful comments

Marco

PS: I know about quantize settings, so i usually record without quantization.

[yur2die4]

You could record a 'reference' loop in Looper first. Record the beat as audio in Looper, then record it again as midi after.

[Zyko1]

Thanks for your reply. I have to test that out, but as far as I know the looper is also bound to the bpm, so basically the same issues as with a midi-clip. But I will play around with it and see if I can figure it out.
Meanwhile other suggestions are very welcome

I also wouldn't mind using a max4live device as i have the m4l license.

[yur2die4]

Someone Does have a m4l device which makes one midi clip the length of a loop that you make. It then makes all new clips similarly sized in relation to that clip. The clip itself might have an odd length like 1:3:2 or something but the clip loops properly. It does not change the actual bpm.

Looper does work, you see it so that it sets Live's tempo. Make sure Live is not playing yet, trigger the looper at exactly the same time as you'd trigger the downbeat, maybe even use the same hand as you hit the bassdrum with. There is more detailed info on its functionality in the manual.

[lapieuvre]

Before recording your first clip :

turn the click on
Arm the track you want to record to
Hit Master record, then immediately space bar
Hit Tap button 4 times, the recording will start at the tempo you tapped.

I know it's not exactly what you need, but it can be a workaround

[Stromkraft]

Why can't i just record a midi-clip and "tell" Ableton after i hit stop-record that this clip is now "1 bar" long in "4/4", and then ableton can easily calculate (from the clip-length (talking about time, miliseconds) the BPM and set the master-tempo accordingly. Why is that not possible? Is this such a crazy idea? Or am I overseeing the obvious? It would be so much easier this way.

Using the recording as a Master tempo track in Arrangement might work out. Any tempo changes will be retained.

The Manual:
9.2.1 Tempo Master/Slave

Where I picked this up from chapelier fou (third post from top) here in the discussion
How to transfer subtle tempo changes from classical piece

Even if you don't have tempo changes per se Live should still pick up the tempo.

[bosonHavoc]

if you have the clock stop looper will set the tempo based on the first loop.

you don't even need to record an actual sound you could set up a dummy looper to set the tempo based on what you are playing.

foot pedal helps for this but if you can 1 hand finger drum then you could use your other hand.

so basically stop the clock
play a beat
start recording the looper on the 1
and then record a 1 bar loop of silence
then play with the click track and record away

I do this with a drummer.. we can jam. i can loop and record clips,
i stop the clock while we are playing and set new tempo
its fun

another thing to not over look is practice playing with a click
so many people look for all these ways to not have to play with a click track
because it doesn't feel natural.
just like anything, it something that needs to be practiced.
so spend some time just playing with a click too.

[Stromkraft]

if you have the clock stop looper will set the tempo based on the first loop.

you don't even need to record an actual sound you could set up a dummy looper to set the tempo based on what you are playing.

foot pedal helps for this but if you can 1 hand finger drum then you could use your other hand.

so basically stop the clock
play a beat
start recording the looper on the 1
and then record a 1 bar loop of silence
then play with the click track and record away

Great tip!