Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Pasha
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Pasha » Fri May 07, 2021 3:45 pm

Tested on :

Live 11.02

iMac 2013 - 2,9 Ghz Quad Core i5 8 GB RAM 512 GB SSD - paid version Live Suite
Dynabook Tecra X40-F (i7 1.9 Ghz, Quad Core 16 GB RAM 256 GB SDD ** evaluation version
Macbook Pro 2012 2.5 Ghz Dual core, 16 GB RAM 256 GB SSD - paid version Live Suite

On all three machines I observe continuos spikes in many disparate conditions and it gets worse with the minimum movement in the GUI as drag and drop, deleting a Drum rack of placing a VST.

I do not get audio artfacts but let me say that this close to maximum CPU counter really gets me so anxious that I am still using L10 on the two Macs.
I have also pinned this during beta. Twice. I prefer not to be distracted during composition / improvisation and that CPU indicator is really distracting.
You always seem close to doom your computer. Even the Live 11 demo Liveset is not stable and at times goes very close to 80%. My machines are not new but powerful enough according to specs. With L10 they worked fine, now my Macbook Pro struggles. Can this be related to MPE? It's the newest engine novelty I can think of putting stress to CPU (more data , more work)
Last edited by Pasha on Mon May 10, 2021 8:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Apple iMac 2013 / Macbook Late 2012
Live 10 Suite,Zebra ,Guitar, Bass, VG99, JV1010 and some controllers
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Machinesworking
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Machinesworking » Fri May 07, 2021 8:51 pm

Around the fiasco that was Live 8 I realized that the open beta wasn't working. Too many people were too happy about M4L coming that they seemingly ignored the amount of bugs that were left in the app. It was the first time I did not upgrade Live straight away and ever since then it's been my experience that it's just best to wait until the inevitable Xmas sale the next year to upgrade.

This isn't any different with other DAWs, some bugs seep through the cracks, most of the time they work for most people but if you upgrade a few times inevitably you will get stuck with a buggy version. As someone whose jumped around between DAWs for fun and collaboration reasons every DAW I've used has at least one buggy for me .0 upgrade release.

So personally it's not gaslighting, it's pretty normal, no one should be surprised if Live 11 isn't running perfectly in Rosetta on M1 macs, and some people will experience bugs for months after the release of a new version of a DAW. The best thing to do is keep an older version around, and wait until Live 11 is native on M1 macs. Oh, and report bugs, send in every crash report, and detail your system specs on forums when venting.

Nate Holt
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Nate Holt » Sat May 08, 2021 5:36 am

Machinesworking wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 8:51 pm
no one should be surprised if Live 11 isn't running perfectly in Rosetta on M1 macs, and some people will experience bugs for months after the release of a new version of a DAW. The best thing to do is keep an older version around, and wait until Live 11 is native on M1 macs. Oh, and report bugs, send in every crash report, and detail your system specs on forums when venting.
Their compatibility documentation states M1 macs aren't supported but other specs posted here have been for newer (non-M1s) and older Macs and PCs - Pasha's post for example, that run/ran previous versions of Live no problem. Software acting up every now and then is par for the course, I've been in recording sessions and seen mixing tutorials with different DAWs that have hiccups or glitches, this goes beyond that though. For sure reporting bugs and crash reports as they occur.

hdrpbx
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by hdrpbx » Sat May 08, 2021 2:56 pm

I think the real problem is the new CPU meter showing short and fast transients, which I think it's distracting and not real useful information for the user, I'd rather see an average over a larger window of time.

[jur]
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by [jur] » Sat May 08, 2021 3:02 pm

Pasha wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 3:45 pm
Can this be related to MPE?
Yes there's a known issue that can be really bad, from my post above:
there's an issue (that's fixed now in the latest L11.0.5b2) that can definitely kill your CPU.
To check if this is your problem: click the edit button on any of the M4L device in your set, and once Max is open go to Debug menu and make sure that the "Event probe" option is tunred off. If it's on this might be the source of your problems.
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[jur]
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by [jur] » Sat May 08, 2021 3:05 pm

hdrpbx wrote:
Sat May 08, 2021 2:56 pm
I think the real problem is the new CPU meter showing short and fast transients, which I think it's distracting and not real useful information for the user, I'd rather see an average over a larger window of time.
This is true and many people are actually just experiencing this, visual distraction; no audio impact whatsoever.
You can right-click the cpu/disk overload indicator and deactivate it btw.

There's also known issue (that weren't present in L10) with some cracked plugins. Of course, this is everyone's own business but you can't expect Ableton to bother about this.
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Pasha
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Pasha » Sat May 08, 2021 5:30 pm

[jur] wrote:
Sat May 08, 2021 3:02 pm
Pasha wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 3:45 pm
Can this be related to MPE?
Yes there's a known issue that can be really bad, from my post above:
there's an issue (that's fixed now in the latest L11.0.5b2) that can definitely kill your CPU.
To check if this is your problem: click the edit button on any of the M4L device in your set, and once Max is open go to Debug menu and make sure that the "Event probe" option is tunred off. If it's on this might be the source of your problems.
Thanks. Checked. No Max 4 Live devices in my set. Event probe was turned off anyway.
Apple iMac 2013 / Macbook Late 2012
Live 10 Suite,Zebra ,Guitar, Bass, VG99, JV1010 and some controllers
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Nate Holt
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Nate Holt » Sat May 08, 2021 10:21 pm

[jur] wrote:
Sat May 08, 2021 3:05 pm

This is true and many people are actually just experiencing this, visual distraction; no audio impact whatsoever.
You can right-click the cpu/disk overload indicator and deactivate it btw.

There's also known issue (that weren't present in L10) with some cracked plugins. Of course, this is everyone's own business but you can't expect Ableton to bother about this.
I don't doubt some people may get distracted by the CPU indicator, but that's a moot point with people who are talking about audio problems, crashes, freezes etc isn't it? I have no idea what issues there were/are with cracked plugins and if someone's using them they don't really have any business raising issues until they go legit or clean their system to rule that out first. Any support offered would likely end if the user admitted to using or was found to be using them, wouldn't it? I can assure you this has absolutely nothing to do with cracked plugins.

[jur]
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by [jur] » Sat May 08, 2021 11:25 pm

I didn't imagine you're using cracked plugins, I was mentionning them because they cause problems with L11. And yes, quite some people are using cracked plugins and complain about CPU issues to support.
The new CPU metering is creating a huge disturbance for many users, and months after L11's release we still have tons of users that aren't aware; and I can assure you that this represents a way bigger bag of users VS users facing unfortunate problems like yours (and I don't think my sources can be challenged!)

I understand that you're facing real performance issues Nate, but I think the discussion is now in loop mode and there's really not any more useful info to be provided here: i.e your situation have to be managed with support@ableton.com (and I hope you'll get this sort out asap).
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Nate Holt
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Nate Holt » Sun May 09, 2021 2:28 am

I understand and agree.

It's too bad this new feature seems to be creating more issues than it is solving.

Definitely hope it can be resolved asap. Thank you for helping out on here.

Machinesworking
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Machinesworking » Sun May 09, 2021 6:30 pm

Nate Holt wrote:
Sat May 08, 2021 5:36 am
Software acting up every now and then is par for the course, I've been in recording sessions and seen mixing tutorials with different DAWs that have hiccups or glitches, this goes beyond that though.
Upgraded software, .0 releases having bugs is what I'm talking about though. If a DAW has a three year cycle of major upgrades, the first year of that upgrade will be more buggy. This isn't that hard to figure out, but we all get fooled when most releases aren't that buggy and we don't get affected by the bugs for whatever reason.

The cycle also seems to be the occasional more buggy at .0 release version every few versions. I'm talking pretty much every DAW I've ever used will have 3-4 solid not too buggy upgrade cycles, and one dog that takes the wind out of your sails. because of the nature of bugs and how poeple work, some people will not be affected.

It's not just a matter of money and time thrown at a DAW either, Apple have all the money in the world to throw at Logic, and Logic 7 was a crash fest mess for a large group of us.

Pasha
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Pasha » Mon May 10, 2021 1:16 pm

I think I have reached a reproducible scenario with my tests and investigations.
Can a video be uploaded here?
If not is it legit to post on youtube and linking it?

Cheers
Thanks
Pasha
Apple iMac 2013 / Macbook Late 2012
Live 10 Suite,Zebra ,Guitar, Bass, VG99, JV1010 and some controllers
______________________________________
Music : http://alonetone.com/pasha

Tarekith
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Tarekith » Mon May 10, 2021 1:41 pm

You can post it here but you’d be better off sending it to support@ableton.com if you’re looking for help.
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Pasha
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by Pasha » Mon May 10, 2021 2:21 pm

Tarekith wrote:
Mon May 10, 2021 1:41 pm
You can post it here but you’d be better off sending it to support@ableton.com if you’re looking for help.
Thanks Man!
Apple iMac 2013 / Macbook Late 2012
Live 10 Suite,Zebra ,Guitar, Bass, VG99, JV1010 and some controllers
______________________________________
Music : http://alonetone.com/pasha

slow.robot
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Re: Stop gaslighting and fix your cpu issues

Post by slow.robot » Mon May 10, 2021 3:08 pm

could be useful for others to have it posted here, too. if you’re able to reproduce it, maybe others are doing something similar and can see how it’s being caused.

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