What software were you looking to purchase for $8K?gjm wrote:I have spent just on $15K on software in the last 6 years. I trialed some of the software via cracks and discovered that the sales person from 1 company trying to convince me to part with $8K was not telling me the whole picture.........
CAD Drafting and Solid Modeling Software. I ended up with a great product by Ashlar Vellum called Xenon, which I paid $4500 in 2005, combined with MaxSurf, a 3D Marine Hydrostatic Hull design package for $4500. All legal and paid for.e.maynard wrote:What software were you looking to purchase for $8K?gjm wrote:I have spent just on $15K on software in the last 6 years. I trialed some of the software via cracks and discovered that the sales person from 1 company trying to convince me to part with $8K was not telling me the whole picture.........
Curious.
The original post inspired me to go off on some kind of ill-advised diatribe, but then I read Angstrom's post and it summed my view up quite nicely without all the ranting I was prepared to doAngstrom wrote:"why buy it?"
It's a similar question to "why recycle?" The earth is fucked and covered with nasty people and their rubbish, so why should I invest my time and effort sorting out my plastics?
Why recycle when my high street is not spotlessly clean?
Equally - why buy Live if it is not perfect?
Firstly, on a general point: because a purchase is a vote for that item as your preferred way of doing something. By voting on individual items you adjust the whole world to be slightly more as you would like it. Effectively acting with others as a large unmediated group we alter the concensus. Large amounts of purchases influence other producers to produce similar products and thereby a social or operational shift is made.
EG: I did not like the way that Cubase made me make music, and I preferred the way that Live made me make music. I liked it enough to buy it. I consider this my vote and I hope that my vote (in concert with others) influences other music software producers to adjust their software to address the expressed market need/demand.
If I don't use it then I don't pay money for it. If I don't pay money for it then it makes no difference for the developers wether I use a cracked version or no version at all, in both cases they don't get money. They may be pissed at me and sue me legally once they get to know about me using a crack though. But in the end it really doesn't help them much, they may get money if I have any at all, but they still wont get my support then. Dillemma, dilemma.hereschenes wrote:How about... you don't use it, if you hate it so much?
Wrong! Once I pay money Ableton does owe me everything they promised to deliver! If they deliver less than that and don't fix it in reasonable time (less than a year for sure) then either I get a partly refund for having to work with less than was promised for the price or a full refund for stopping to work with it, which leads to them getting no money at all again. Paying for a software licence (you only own the right to use it) is like setting up a contract that binds both parties into responsibilities.Ableton don't owe you anything.
I paid for my legitimate Windows Vista Ultimate, Live does not run properly on Vista. I am running Live on Windows XP, I do not own a legitimate version of Windows XP anymore.leedsquietman wrote:And I have also NEVER used cracked software and never will, so while I accept that kids who can't afford it and so on might try that route, there are alternatives.
I use a legitimate version of Live 7 and crashed my PC well over a hundred times. It took until .12 until one of the crash reasons was fixed, another one is still not being fixed. Where is the difference between the crack and my legitimate version in relation to stability and service?Marx wrote:I used a cracked version of Live 5 like 3 years ago and it crashed my iBook G4
Sorry (I agree to disagreeleedsquietman wrote:You get your crack and you take your chances - most of this stuff is ridden with bugs, and sometimes spyware/viruses and at best is never 100% functional.
), but in my experience that's mostly myth in order to keep people from using cracks. Did I use cracks? Hell yes, lots and lots and lots, in order to "Try before you Buy". Most trial-periods are a joke for the complexity that is modern software, especially considering that you usually can only try it in your spare free time.You mean Live is not ridden with bugs on my legit copy?Go legit from the start and save yourself these problems.
Cubase is a very special case. It's protection-mechanism is so much embedded into every functionality of the program that one could start to consider it a copy-protection software with audio functionality rather than the other way around. Probably the one reason why crackers don't care to waste their own free time on cracking Cubase is that they noticed how Cubase is not "the one" DAW anymore and simply leave it to users to go for the equally well delivering competition.Another friend had a copy of Cubase SX3 and noticed that some of the features, including track inserts wasn't working, but every time he tried to change samplerate, BOOM, a disaster leading to 2 HD reformats.
Yes, but I wouldn't want to be a Waves customer either knowing how they spent my money on sending out agents with cameras and threatening kids with legal suits. Fortunately there are good alternatives on the market and hopefully I wont ever need any piece of their otherwise good software.There is always a better way and you don't have to always be looking over your shoulder. Look at Waves. Sending out agents with cameras and threatening crack users with legal suits unless they pay 75000 dollars. I wouldn't want that to be me ....
Crash wrote: Sorry (I agree to disagree
That sort of argument is exactly what I meant when I mentioned "ethical gymnastics" in my previous post. With respect, you're just diverting around my actual point, which I stated twice: just because you can has nothing to do with whether you should.Crash wrote:If I don't use it then I don't pay money for it. If I don't pay money for it then it makes no difference for the developers wether I use a cracked version or no version at all, in both cases they don't get money.hereschenes wrote:How about... you don't use it, if you hate it so much?
Right. And what they promise to deliver is a copy of Ableton Live, for your use only, under their commercial terms (assuming the terms they issue are legally enforcible where you were sold the product, I guess.)Crash wrote:Wrong! Once I pay money Ableton does owe me everything they promised to deliver!Ableton don't owe you anything.
Absolutely it is. If they don't and Live goes to pieces, then they'll lose their customers eventually. This has nothing to do with whether or not you should steal their software.Crash wrote: It is in Ableton's very interest to fix issues in order to keep generating income.
A little dash of this, a little splash of that.j2j wrote:Either you are lying to yourself, or you honestly don't know.Crash wrote: Sorry (I agree to disagree