Ban Timur/Crash?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live

Should Timur/Crash be banned?

No, he should not be banned.
58
59%
Ableton, please ban Timur/Crash - the forum is better without him.
40
41%
 
Total votes: 98

8O
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Post by 8O » Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:59 am

Again, for those that missed it: Another view of Timur/Crash's attitude towards Ableton Support: http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php? ... ht=#790263
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Crash
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Post by Crash » Thu Dec 04, 2008 10:29 am

crumhorn wrote:To contradict the OP I've never seen him hijack anybody else's thread, but I've seen plenty of other people hijack his threads, or any thread if they spot an opportunity to go crash bashing. In fact the majority of his posts are on topic.
Thanks alot for the advocacy! :)

Writing hate mails often seems alot easier than the opposite. I already told the Rant-a-lots that they are not necessarily part of the community I am seeking on this forum. Only Ableton owns this forum and not any of us loudmouths who constantly quarrel with each other. Albeit I begin to question wether it is good to have the main source of Ableton discussions happen in a corporate forum. When discussions among users about issues with Live and Ableton is taken as a personal insults by Ableton employees then it seems to be better to commit those user discussions elsewhere.

I do have to admit though that sometimes I happen to hijack threads by writing too many answers once an argument starts eventhough these arguments may not be on topic of the original thread anymore. I tried to keep that down with threads originally posted by the less testosteroned forum members (sometimes even specifically writing "we are just hijacking this thread, let's discuss this elsewhere). Nobody's perfect though, not even me. DOH! 8O 8)

But generally you wont find me posting vomit pictures and immature misogyny on other people's thread like we have experienced from other people. I don't think that Ableton decided to part-time moderate the forum just because of me, they never deleted or locked any of my threads. But even if they did then I am not too unhappy with some reasonable and obviously needed moderation!
At least he doesn't think that his own opinion is so important and definitive that he has to post it in 18pt text to make make sure nobody overlooks it.
Again I do have to admit that the sheer number of my posts may counterbalance the 18pt text thing. ;)

But I often repeat stuff (like Vista and Midi related issues) because someone in a thread asks about it and it's mostly more convinient to just post an answer instead of linking to another thread that is burried somewhere deep down the forum.
So far the only people bothering to post here are those that voted against a ban.
Although many of those who voted against a ban did not necessarily vote in sympathy for me (you are one of the few exceptions), but only against the method of banning as being ineffective or inadequate. ;)

Thanks again for the support. :D
HAL: I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.

chrysalis33rpm
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Post by chrysalis33rpm » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:29 am

How can we possibly talking about banning Timur after all the shit that goes down on this forum?! Call him what you want- annoying, narcissistic, pain-in-the-ass, stubborn to the point of not listening. He's certainly not the first or the only.

He also means well and genuinely has made some good contributions, which is more than I can say for some.

You can ignore him, or use the trollkiller script- what's your problem? He insults the Abes? I think they can can make that call- we're not their vigilante protectors, and frankly they're adults and they don't need it!

Anyway, with all the nutheads on the internet, it disgusts me when one person gets singled out to get cut out of the herd.

Crash
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Post by Crash » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:39 am

I can subscribe to everything Chrysalis wrote! Thanks for the to the point words. :wink:

Dmnt, I have too much time for posting during the last couple of days. But installing the MBP and checking out a custom RME Windows driver leaves alot of time while you're waiting for the computers to finish their work. Besides that I also got a cold and luckily have only be called out to customers for a few hours this week.
HAL: I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.

Macrostructure
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2004 2:51 pm

Post by Macrostructure » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:43 am

banning doesn't work. people just get back on again.

just lead by example with good contributions to the forum, and ignore the stuff you don't want to be involved with.

chrysalis33rpm
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Location: San Francisco

Post by chrysalis33rpm » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:45 am

Look Timur, I think you need to chill the fuck out...I just don't agree with banning on principle, especially on this crazy forum.

Crash
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Location: Nowhereland

Post by Crash » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:54 am

chrysalis33rpm wrote:Look Timur, I think you need to chill the fuck out...I just don't agree with banning on principle, especially on this crazy forum.
Don't worry, I am chilling over this whole mess all the time. Parts of this is so ridiculous that I should be upset maybe, but I'm mostly amused and maybe somewhat bewildered. I'm not so much amused about my experience with Ableton Support, but that's not the essence or even basis of this "discussion" here anymore anyway.

One could speculate wether I had anticipated the recent trend given the signatures I am using since shortly before the board wars started to escalate. This gives the overal disaster a nice ironic twist.

You see I really subscribe to everything you wrote. Eventhough I have to underline that at least parts the of misunderstandings happens because of the language barrier and my choice of writing style as well. ;)
HAL: I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.

UKRuss
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Post by UKRuss » Thu Dec 04, 2008 12:33 pm

Troll kiiiilllleeerrrr
it's the cure to the poison pen
But don't fall in!
To it's web of siiiiiiiiiin
Troll Kiiillleerrrr.

(to the tune of Goldfinger)

Ban? No, come on.

I am amazed, confused and possibly slightly disturbed by the Timur obsession with Abes support but then we all have obsessions.

I like to shout "arse!" in public. It's a kind of therapy.

Crash
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Location: Nowhereland

Post by Crash » Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:50 pm

UKRuss wrote:I am amazed, confused and possibly slightly disturbed by the Timur obsession with Abes support but then we all have obsessions.
Well, I feel like currently they are making my work unnecessarily less pleasant but harder, likely just as much as they feel me making their work less pleasant but harder. But the difference is that I pay them and not vice versa.

It's really strange how some people cannot accept when a customer is dissatisfied with the service of a well beloved company while it seems absolutely normal today to rant against well hated companies even without particular reasons. Black and White, Jekyll and Hyde, Ableton and Zorg.
HAL: I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.

UKRuss
Posts: 5044
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:32 am

Post by UKRuss » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:43 pm

I respect you're right to decent service wherever ye may shop, and I suppose spreading the word about your experiences is only natural too.

Hence the existence of consumer programs on our tellies like Watchdog here in the UK. In a way people like to see corporations grovel and say sorry, it's a kind of entertainment. It's so necessary for them to do it even though we know watching, it's so against human nature for peopel to behave apologetically like that. we rub our hands with glee at them having to genuflect in public. Heh hehhh, theres another fat cat saying he's sorry!

I dunno...

Maybe there is a fine line between seeking justification for poor service in a way that others sympathise with and stepping over that line into perhaps hounding an organisation continually due to one bad experience.

If they have shown true remorse and compensated you for your poor experience isn't that in itself a good experience and one which you would also share with the community to whom you previously announced your bad experience?

It is a complex juxtaposition of consumer and supplier as well as ego and pride.

Personally i would make a terrible supplier because i hate confrontation and just start swearing straight away...my business would be ruined in days. :D

Crash
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Post by Crash » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:47 pm

UKRuss wrote:If they have shown true remorse and compensated you for your poor experience isn't that in itself a good experience and one which you would also share with the community to whom you previously announced your bad experience?
You are likely right, but I don't know about that yet. So when is it coming? :wink:
Personally i would make a terrible supplier because i hate confrontation and just start swearing straight away...my business would be ruined in days. :D
I'm the opposite, all of my clients feel very much cared for. At least they keep coming back despite the many alternatives. Unfortunately there ain't (m)any alternatives for Session-Mode. :roll:
HAL: I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.

SubFunk
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Post by SubFunk » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:48 pm

banning is lame, send a hitman :lol:
*** Image GAFM ***

UKRuss
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Post by UKRuss » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:51 pm

here is a question thats worth consideration:

Is the customer always right?

Consider the customer who has a justifiable complaint and writes a letter saying.

"i recently purchased x, it is broken. please could you let me know when it will be fixed or replaced."

I'd hope he woudl receiove swift and couteous attention and apology.

But consider the same guy who launches in with:

" I bought x the other day, it is broken! How can you possibly expect peopel to come to your store again if you can't even sell goods in a decent order! What are you going to do about it? I expect you to get back to me before 3pm today!"

Now that is instantly confrontational and aggressive and while i respect that he has a point i would hope that the problem is still solved but could i expect the supplier to show the same level of interest in assisting that person?

Does buying the goods also buy the right to forego manners and decency and also buy the right to aggressiveness and then perhaps violence?

of course not.

Complainer and complainee shoud resolve the issue rationally and with good manners.

Some people complain to allow them to buy the right to aggression against a set of people whom they know in advance cannot fight back.

It is a fine line between complaining in a way that people sympathise with and one where you run the risk of being perceived like my theoretical bully.

S'all I'm saying.

nebulae
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Post by nebulae » Thu Dec 04, 2008 3:24 pm

Last night, on Keith Olbermann, there was yet another Sarah Palin segment. I commented on it by *sigh*ing, saying, "When will she go away??!?!" Mrs. Neb, in her eternal wisdom, said simply, "She goes away when people stop talking about her."
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leisuremuffin
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Post by leisuremuffin » Thu Dec 04, 2008 3:29 pm

man, Timur/crash isn't even in the top 10 worst douchebags who has posted here.


unless he is also DJ Retard, 16BIT, squigglefunk uk, TITBAG, radeon, supster, DJWILDSTYLE, keyser soze, leisuremuffin, etc. etc...



.lm.
TimeableFloat ???S?e?n?d?I?n?f?o

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