Sidechaining for dance kick drums

mholloway · Post by **mholloway** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:25 am

I'm interested in using compression with side-chaining for keeping the kick drum track punchy within mixes containing lots of other bass-heavy sources. The ableton manual talks briefly about this technique being the dance producers "secret weapon" -- but I'm still not thoroughly understanding both the concept and the functionality.

If you put a compressor in the master channel with the kick channel as a side-chain input (as mentioned in the manual) this would compress the master mix as triggered by the input of the kick, but wouldn't this also compress the kick itself, since it will be a part of the master mix -- and thereby eliminate the ducking effect you'd be going for in the first place? Or am I not thinking about this quite right...

Anybody out there who is doing sidechain compression using heavy kick drums as the trigger, please point me to available resources or (better yet) shoot me some advice on when, why & how exactly you do it.

greatly appreciated,
-Michael

jeffplaysmoog · Post by **jeffplaysmoog** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:35 am

well, you are correct using it on the main track is not the way to go. Using the side chain can be pretty easy. let's just say you have a kick and a keyboard pad sound and you want to use the kick to compress the pad. Just put the Ableton compressor on the pad, select the kick as the input for the side chain and adjust the compressor until you get the sound you desire (use the gain on the side chain as well as threshold and the attack and release settings). You can also make sub mixes if you have more than 1 item you want to use the kick to compress... so play around a bit and ask if you have any more questions... I'm sure there are people lurking around here who are much better than I at answering these questions. Also, I think are there about a million Youtube vids dealing with this exact subject since it is pretty popular.

CHARLIE! · Post by **CHARLIE!** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 4:51 am

I usually put the compressor on my bass channel because it directly competes with the kick for room usually. You can also compress pads or any sound.

http://sonictransfer.com/side-chain-com ... rial.shtml

That tutorial will serve you well.

teknobryan · Post by **teknobryan** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:04 am

while we're on this topic, what compressor model do yall use the most for sidechaining for the pumping effect? I like the opto with a little attack and no release and full ratio, and model 1 with no attack and a little release and like a 2.0 ratio.

Stace · Post by **Stace** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:15 am

As long as your on the one of the latest updates of live you should be able to do the inbuilt lesson on sidechaining. You'll find it very helpful. The Sonic-transfer lesson is good for if your on an earlier version of Live, if not, then the sonic transfer way of doing things is slower, its a lot easier and quicker to do it Lives way (sonic transfer is how I learned to do it in the first place so it did help but now Lives sorted it out

)

CHARLIE! wrote:I usually put the compressor on my bass channel because it directly competes with the kick for room usually.

+1

Chang · Post by **Chang** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:38 am

This is going to be my most westernized crass post I ever make. I cannot WAIT for the subject of side chaining kick bass, italio boring shit house, daft punk and unplugged justice to go away. A party should be thrown around the globe when it all disappear.

ollyb303 · Post by **ollyb303** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:40 am

Chang wrote:This is going to be my most westernized crass post I ever make. I cannot WAIT for the subject of side chaining kick bass, italio boring shit house, daft punk and unplugged justice to go away. A party should be thrown around the globe when it all disappear.

Side chaining compression on the bass to the kick drum is a perfectly valid production technique.

Yes, the artists you mention do so in a pretty obvious (and perhaps extereme?) way and have created their signature sound by doing so (I'd like to point out here that I am NOT a fan of the French "pumping house" sound).

However, if the technique is used more subtly, it can create more space for both elements in the mix and result in a better sounding final product without the "pumping".

Before you start slating a production technique, maybe you should try and understand it, rather than deciding it's shite because a couple of artists you don't like use it.

"Eewww, snare drums? Sash uses snare drums, so fuck that shit!"