Bass question!

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
Beattender
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Bass question!

Post by Beattender » Tue Feb 03, 2009 11:03 am

Hi, I have a bass line in one of my tracks; the problem is that the high notes are much louder than the low notes (It's a high to low arpeggio bass line).

There are two options that I'm aware of:

1) Compress the bass so that it brings the volume in line.

2) Automate the volume of the higher notes.

The problem with compressing the bass is that I don't want to lose the shape of the sound. Compression in my experience could make it 'blocky'.

Any thoughts? Have you had the same issue?

Cheers!

Meef Chaloin
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Post by Meef Chaloin » Tue Feb 03, 2009 12:15 pm

you could try eqing the specific frequencies

Warminstrel
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Post by Warminstrel » Tue Feb 03, 2009 12:19 pm

I personaly use little volume envelopes in preference to using compression where ever possibe for the exact reason you gave.

sporkles
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Post by sporkles » Tue Feb 03, 2009 1:01 pm

Is it a MIDI track with a software instrument of some kind, so that adjusting
the velocity settings on the instrument might be an option? If so, my preferred
way of doing this is to set velocity modulation to 100%, select all the notes in
the relevant clip and adjust the velocity to 127, and then, finally, turn down
the velocity to on the notes that are too loud :)

4ace
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Post by 4ace » Tue Feb 03, 2009 1:51 pm

Warminstrel wrote:I personaly use little volume envelopes in preference to using compression where ever possibe for the exact reason you gave.
+ 1 Volume automation
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kaffein
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Post by kaffein » Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:53 pm

Yeap, edit the velocity of the offending notes...

Or LPF @ 6, 10, or 15kHz. (preference)

mdk
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Post by mdk » Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:15 pm

if its a virtual instrument of some sort can you map the note (key) to volume?
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Beattender
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Post by Beattender » Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:55 pm

Thank you for all of those answers. Much appreciated!! :D

j2j
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Post by j2j » Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:59 pm

kaffein wrote:Yeap, edit the velocity of the offending notes...

Or LPF @ 6, 10, or 15kHz. (preference)

+1

It is a velocity issue. Higher frequencies have more energy than lower frequencies, so you higher bass notes will always be a little louder than your lower ones.
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xherv
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Post by xherv » Tue Feb 03, 2009 7:03 pm

It's a pretty common problem I think, as things just behave a little differently in lower frequencies than upper frequencies. I'd recommend figuring out if it's lows, mids, highs that are getting out of line because different solutions will work better in each case. Or the right solution will be sort of multiband with a few different techniques.

This is idiosyncratic but how I tend to think about things:

If it's in the lows, velocity or volume automation or using a second synth (Operator is godly for this) that's subtly adding smoother lows are what I like to use. Since this synth can be layered underneath, a trick I like is limiting this sub synth to a one octave range or so with a MIDI rack, bumping notes out of this range up or down an octave. Compression down here has to be really carefully applied IMO, although it can do some cool things.

If it's sort of mid-range, EQ (cutting mostly) can help, like 400-1k range is usually a good place to look for some pretty severe cuts. 120-350 is a lot more demanding of finer precision but also is a range where some cuts could be made.

In the highs (over 1k? or so) I think compression works well, as well as shelf EQ'ing, additionally any kind of stereo effect can work well in this range.

One thing to watch out for is filter resonance in the low frequencies, this can be impossible to tame - it sounds good sometimes but I just think it's too unmanageable to try and use it until everything else in a mix is set. Took me a long time to figure that out.
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Beattender
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Post by Beattender » Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:20 pm

I think EQ'ing could be the answer.

With regards to the velocity issue; does anyone know how to edit velocity within Massive?

Moody
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Post by Moody » Tue Feb 03, 2009 10:12 pm

Have you tried using a limiter?
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nbinder
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Post by nbinder » Tue Feb 03, 2009 10:36 pm

Moody wrote:Have you tried using a limiter?
See above, same problems as with the compressor.

Volume envelope oder EQing, you'll have to find out which sounds better in your case.

Superchibisan
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Post by Superchibisan » Wed Feb 04, 2009 12:29 am

the issue here can be resolved by simple EQ. shelve the offending frequencies, compress, and viola!


regarding massive issue.

you waveform envelope is under 4env where you can change the volume shape of the noise, and then if you attach the yellow velocity mod from the bottom right, to the amp knob of an osc, you have velocity control of the oscs independently.
Last edited by Superchibisan on Wed Feb 04, 2009 3:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

Machinate
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Post by Machinate » Wed Feb 04, 2009 12:33 am

Ableton instruments: vol<key - at least in Operator there's a dial for doing just this; adjusting the relative volume of playing up the keyboard.

Super simple, and any VA or similar equivalent or superior to Operator should be able to do this in a heartbeat.

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