Do you prefere Live suite instruments or 3rd Party VST's?

[xh9o]

operator works for specific tasks, but it an´t create really plastic strings or smoothness in general. for instance. but its fine for something clinical, something very weird and far away. not so much the usual synth standards.

and compared to the newer synth additions like analog, tension or collision operator has been a masterpiece. maybe ableton should care about their quality image before they destroy it with adding bullshit over bullshit to their heartpiece called live.

[synnack]

I cant speak for the newest version of operator but i used to have the old operator from live 6. I spent soooo much time trying to find the right sounds and thinking that it was just me that sucked because I couldnt get the right sounds but once i got ahold of a few ridiculously amazing VSTs (Blue, Predator, minimoog vst) I found out operator is a joke.

It may be ok for people who just use synths as a backround in their music but in the style I produce (house, electro) using vst's is vital to getting a professional sound. I now look back fondly and innocently on my days of using operator, no offense to the developers of it but IMO it cannot touch Rob Papen's synths with a 10 ft pole.

because those synths have all the usual doodads connected to them aswell. builtin reverbs, delays, silly trancegates and whatnots. operator does not. operators isnt all that exciting until you rack it up with the rest of the live devices. then it gets interesting.

very interesting, at that.

Actually im just talking without even any effects, i use the synths built in effects sparingly because i like having more control outside of it. All I can say is that after using other vst's operator's quality is glaringly lower in quality and what it offers. Again this is not coming from someone who has never used operator- I have used it. I would not even pay $50 for it, there are freeware synths that are just as good or better than OP.

Apples and oranges. You can't compare them other than they are both fruit.

The strength of Operator is not to make the kinds of sounds Albino/blue/predator are about.

If you don't try and fit a square peg in a round hole you'll see how cool that round hole is.

(huh huh, i said hole)

[leedsquietman]

I'm not a fan of Papen's synths.

ALbino was OK on first release, but really, Sylenth, Massive or Zebra beat the crap out of it.

Blue - A weak FM synth, Operator, Sytrus and FM8 are all better IMHO.

Predator - One trick pony synth for tarnce, again any number of other analog subtractives beat it.

Operator's preset library was weak in Live 6.

In Live 8, it is massively updated with many more useable sounds. Programming FM is difficult, so if you're not into FM programming, it helps to have good presets which you can just go in and tweak a bit for your own use. FM8 excels at this and Operator, in spite of it's power was not.

But Live 8 will address this quite a bit with many more Operator presets (most of which are useable) and then there's always 3rd party sounds from puremagnetik, covert operators, track team audio etc.

If you want bread and butter house/tarnce sounds though, then stick with your Albino and go and buy Vanguard and Nexus and you're all set to be pigeon holed with your 10000 'epic lead' sounds, etc....

[glitchrock-buddha]

I'm not a fan of Papen's synths.

ALbino was OK on first release, but really, Sylenth, Massive or Zebra beat the crap out of it.

Blue - A weak FM synth, Operator, Sytrus and FM8 are all better IMHO.

Predator - One trick pony synth for tarnce, again any number of other analog subtractives beat it.

Operator's preset library was weak in Live 6.

In Live 8, it is massively updated with many more useable sounds. Programming FM is difficult, so if you're not into FM programming, it helps to have good presets which you can just go in and tweak a bit for your own use. FM8 excels at this and Operator, in spite of it's power was not.

But Live 8 will address this quite a bit with many more Operator presets (most of which are useable) and then there's always 3rd party sounds from puremagnetik, covert operators, track team audio etc.

If you want bread and butter house/tarnce sounds though, then stick with your Albino and go and buy Vanguard and Nexus and you're all set to be pigeon holed with your 10000 'epic lead' sounds, etc....

Actually Blue is quite a powerful FM synth. And quite beautiful filters as well. I can totally understand when someone doesn't like the sound of Operator. It's not that operator isn't versatile. It is extremely versatile. It just sounds rather unique. I think that's a good thing whenever any synth sounds unique. The thing with operator is that although it can do so much, it absolutely can NOT sound like the VSTs out there that people love like the ones mentioned above (minimoog, blue, predator). It just doesn't go that way in terms of "warmth" or whatever you want to call it. I call the arturia synths and the papen synth "warm" and "smooth" personally. I that's a good thing. But there are other qualities which are also good. I htink of GForce synths and Zebra and Massive as more "Punchy" or "biting" and they generally just have more balls than those previous ones. Operator would fit more into this second category. You can make go really nasty and metallic and also some nice chill fm timbres but it never really does that really warm sound that some synths do. But I find synths usually excel at one side or the other. The warm and smooth, or the punchy and biting. I love them both personally.

[Chang]

Do you like using the suite instruments or 3rd party VST's?.

Is this a joke trick question? It has to be.

[leedsquietman]

It's all subjective. But there are definately some 'warmer' sounds in Operator in Live 8 and with some of the new parameters, although I agree that some are smoother, FM8 for example has nicer sounding pads. I only heard Blue once, but wasn't impressed, maybe if I spent more time with it, etc.

I have 3 of Arturia's softsynths and love those for vintage emulation, great sounds but at a high CPU hit. 2 of them also require a dongle.

There are also some sweeter sounding pads in Sampler in Live 8 than previously. I also still like my Korg Legacy digital, the Wavestation emulations are cool.

[Machinesworking]

Do you like using the suite instruments or 3rd party VST's?.

Is this a joke trick question? It has to be.

You would be surprised how many people here prefer the embedded synths. Personally I think it's a combination of brand loyalty, liking the fact that it's a "single package", and a feeling that it will be stable and easier to use that way. Not that any of that is really true.

Personally I'm moving back towards hardware, though the suite is dammed cheap these days. Sampler is the only thing I really want from it, but I think the price difference between Live 8 and Sampler VS Live 8 and the suite is maybe $50.

[glitchrock-buddha]

Do you like using the suite instruments or 3rd party VST's?.

Is this a joke trick question? It has to be.

You would be surprised how many people here prefer the embedded synths. Personally I think it's a combination of brand loyalty, liking the fact that it's a "single package", and a feeling that it will be stable and easier to use that way. Not that any of that is really true.

Personally I'm moving back towards hardware, though the suite is dammed cheap these days. Sampler is the only thing I really want from it, but I think the price difference between Live 8 and Sampler VS Live 8 and the suite is maybe $50.

That's just it. If you're going to buy one instrument, you might as well buy the suite. And although individually the ableton instruments are overpriced, the suite cost is totally worth it. Funny thing is, you'd think a benefit of embedded instruments would be lower cpu usage. However, cpu use is one of the main things driving me to use plug-ins instead most of the time. It's too bad the ableton instruments weren't ultra efficient like the Logic instruments are. Although I like the whole physical modeling angle from AAS, I sometimes wish ableton had partnered wish more cpu friendly software makers. MaxforLive maybe?... I dunno...

[aizo]

I have L8beta and it's my first experience with operator. First impression of it after a few hours was not that good. But most of the things I love I h8(derp) at first and I have to force myself to dig deeper. I have a shit load of AU's because I came from Digital Performer. I have gone through a lot and found that I use certain synths for certain tasks. I love live's built in fx's so I'm interested in seeing where all the love is coming from. I need more time with it. One thing I'm sure of is that the suite is two much unuseful(for me) stuff in there. I just want Operator and Sampler. But I already own great synths and Kontakt(which I never use). I don't why I should shell out $300 more for something I already have.

[Machinesworking]

Is this a joke trick question? It has to be.

You would be surprised how many people here prefer the embedded synths. Personally I think it's a combination of brand loyalty, liking the fact that it's a "single package", and a feeling that it will be stable and easier to use that way. Not that any of that is really true.

Personally I'm moving back towards hardware, though the suite is dammed cheap these days. Sampler is the only thing I really want from it, but I think the price difference between Live 8 and Sampler VS Live 8 and the suite is maybe $50.

That's just it. If you're going to buy one instrument, you might as well buy the suite. And although individually the ableton instruments are overpriced, the suite cost is totally worth it. Funny thing is, you'd think a benefit of embedded instruments would be lower cpu usage. However, cpu use is one of the main things driving me to use plug-ins instead most of the time. It's too bad the ableton instruments weren't ultra efficient like the Logic instruments are. Although I like the whole physical modeling angle from AAS, I sometimes wish ableton had partnered wish more cpu friendly software makers. MaxforLive maybe?... I dunno...

AAS stuff does sound great though.
Personally I'll probably only use regularly Sampler and Collision, but the price difference is $190. So looking at it that way, I get Two instruments I will use for $50 apiece, and
Essential Instrument Collection 2
Session Drums
Operator
Analog
Tension
Electric
Drum Machines
Latin Percussion

For $90

I'm a sucker for bundles, Waldorf Edition, Komplete, Nomad factory Vintage, All All Ohm force, Spectral Shapers, Pluggo. Shit between those 6, there's over 150 plug ins!
I'm seriously considering pruning out the portions of the bundles I do have down to what I use. For instance I only use certain Nomad plug ins, and about half of the Pluggo stuff....

[Machinesworking]

Is this a joke trick question? It has to be.

You would be surprised how many people here prefer the embedded synths. Personally I think it's a combination of brand loyalty, liking the fact that it's a "single package", and a feeling that it will be stable and easier to use that way. Not that any of that is really true.

Personally I'm moving back towards hardware, though the suite is dammed cheap these days. Sampler is the only thing I really want from it, but I think the price difference between Live 8 and Sampler VS Live 8 and the suite is maybe $50.

That's just it. If you're going to buy one instrument, you might as well buy the suite. And although individually the ableton instruments are overpriced, the suite cost is totally worth it. Funny thing is, you'd think a benefit of embedded instruments would be lower cpu usage. However, cpu use is one of the main things driving me to use plug-ins instead most of the time. It's too bad the ableton instruments weren't ultra efficient like the Logic instruments are. Although I like the whole physical modeling angle from AAS, I sometimes wish ableton had partnered wish more cpu friendly software makers. MaxforLive maybe?... I dunno...

AAS stuff does sound great though.
Personally I'll probably only use regularly Sampler and Collision, but the price difference is $190. So looking at it that way, I get Two instruments I will use for $50 apiece, and
Essential Instrument Collection 2
Session Drums
Operator
Analog
Tension
Electric
Drum Machines
Latin Percussion

For $90

I'm a sucker for bundles, Waldorf Edition, Komplete, Nomad factory Vintage, All All Ohm force, Spectral Shapers, Pluggo. Shit between those 6, there's over 150 plug ins!
I'm seriously considering pruning out the portions of the bundles I do have down to what I use. For instance I only use certain Nomad plug ins, and about half of the Pluggo stuff....

[doremifa]

bfd 2 with jazz&funk exp for drums
scarbee basses for bass (black, etc) with ik multimedia ampeg svx
aas mostly lounge lizard (electric) and tassman (collision) for mallets
ni b4 and linplug organ 3 - organs
4front truepiano
absynth, fm8, massive, sylenth, minimonsta and some other shit - synth
kontakt and lot's of sample libraries for it
lot's of 3-rd party fx, though I do like to use Ableton stuff (specially 7th side-chain compressor).