Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Grappadura
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by Grappadura » Tue Apr 07, 2009 9:47 am

condra wrote:The Dance Music Manual by Rick Snoman
+1 for this, its my bible.

jngpng
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by jngpng » Tue Apr 07, 2009 12:54 pm

I'm surprised to see so many recommendations for the Dance Music Manual. I picked it up a while ago, and was really disappointed. It's riddled with errors, both on technical topics and in the descriptions of genres. I ended up thinking that the author didn't really know the subject that well. It was like a crappy Computer Music tutorial but with less pictures.

Here's a little snippet from his section on house-music:
For house kicks, the Roland TR909 is the most frequently used drum machine, but the
Simmons SDS-5, Roland CR and E-Mu Drumulator are also used to produce the timbres. To my
knowledge, however, only the TR909 has ever been emulated in software form, so unless
you’re willing to synthesize your own kick, sample another house record, use a sample CD or
source and pay for one of these archaic machines, then you’ll have little option but to use a 909.
What? I'm not sure there's a single true sentence in this entire paragraph, apart from the first (which might have been true in 1992).
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noisetonepause
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by noisetonepause » Tue Apr 07, 2009 1:30 pm

I think he's right you're not going to find a Simmons SDS-5 emulator, but yeah... err, what? That paragraph should've said "Samples of classic machines make for great house kicks".
Suit #1: I mean, have you got any insight as to why a bright boy like this would jeopardize the lives of millions?
Suit #2: No, sir, he says he does this sort of thing for fun.

jngpng
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by jngpng » Tue Apr 07, 2009 1:50 pm

Maybe he was just trying to fill up space? I dunno. There's some other classic stuff from a few pages above where he says "nearly all house producers will not use software sequencers". I guess the guy just likes his exaggerated generalizations.

Anyway, so that I have a positive contribution to this thread - I recommend this book wholeheartedly. It's pretty dry and academic in some places, but its got some incredible rhythm analysis stuff. I felt like my beat programming had improved 10x after reading it.
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Grappadura
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by Grappadura » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:17 pm

well the book is not totally recent, but the guy certainly knows what he´s talking about. And one thing that is good about the fact that it is a bit aged: Most of it (aside the genre descriptions, which you can nevertheless learn something from, and the newest software) still applies, and from this you learn that its really still all about saw-, square and sinewaves etc, the laws of panning and eqing are still the same. He really knows his stuff and explains it excellently, and sometimes with a nice subtle humor, but nevertheless always focused.

jngpng
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by jngpng » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:43 pm

Well, its pretty recent. 2004 for the edition I have. I wasn't complaining about the info that is inaccurate due to age anyway, its more basic than that.

Glad you got something out of the book anyway. Different strokes for different folks I guess vOv
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socketghost
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by socketghost » Tue Apr 07, 2009 5:48 pm

I thought I'd check this out and had a quick look on Amazon (at the Snoman book). You can do a bit of 'look inside' at the contents and a few pages, and I have to say it didn't look much use to me - pretty dated and basic. The selection of dance styles offered is pretty limited, surely? (good to see that he kicks off with tarnce).

pulsoc
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by pulsoc » Tue Apr 07, 2009 5:59 pm

Stick with the tried and true.

Image

continuous
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by continuous » Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:11 pm

@ UnCLONED

Deadlines... you're talking about deadlines.

I agree they can really make you grow. That's what's so good about school... you've got these deadlines and you're taking in all this new info and it feels like you're head will explode but really it's growth that you're feeling!

Anyhow, yah, doing a CD would be transformative but I can honestly say I'm not there. I think if I take a dive into some of the recommended reading and a course or two it'll really help me grow and maybe another year or two down the line that'll be a good exercise.

cheers!
Last edited by continuous on Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

the_antagonist
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by the_antagonist » Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:20 pm

Nick the Zombie wrote:This continues to be one of my favorites, and really helped get me going when I was just starting out with composition. It's in a new edition now: http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Idiots-G ... 1592574033

- Nick
i think there is some fundimentally wrong with idiots guides. not from experiance (from seeing my dad stuggling with idiots guide to business)


although being seen holding one would have comic value.

Nick the Zombie
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by Nick the Zombie » Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:24 pm

the_antagonist wrote:
Nick the Zombie wrote:This continues to be one of my favorites, and really helped get me going when I was just starting out with composition. It's in a new edition now: http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Idiots-G ... 1592574033

- Nick
i think there is some fundimentally wrong with idiots guides. not from experiance (from seeing my dad stuggling with idiots guide to business)


although being seen holding one would have comic value.
Fair enough, but I stand by my good experience with the guide to composition.

the_antagonist
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by the_antagonist » Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:44 pm

Nick the Zombie wrote:
the_antagonist wrote:
Nick the Zombie wrote:This continues to be one of my favorites, and really helped get me going when I was just starting out with composition. It's in a new edition now: http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Idiots-G ... 1592574033

- Nick
i think there is some fundimentally wrong with idiots guides. not from experiance (from seeing my dad stuggling with idiots guide to business)


although being seen holding one would have comic value.
Fair enough, but I stand by my good experience with the guide to composition.
word!

hense why i just bought it

tw1nstates
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by tw1nstates » Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:01 pm

jngpng wrote:Maybe he was just trying to fill up space? I dunno. There's some other classic stuff from a few pages above where he says "nearly all house producers will not use software sequencers". I guess the guy just likes his exaggerated generalizations.

Anyway, so that I have a positive contribution to this thread - I recommend this book wholeheartedly. It's pretty dry and academic in some places, but its got some incredible rhythm analysis stuff. I felt like my beat programming had improved 10x after reading it.

YEs yes,

Unlocking he groove is wicked, although it's pretty full on.

It's basically an extended music degree thesis paper, on Techno :)
I love it, still working my way through it, thanks for the reminder.
Although I would second the stuff sbout it being dry. But then nothing good comes easy. . .

The Rick Snoman book it pretty awful i reckon however you might get something good from it. . .

Tarekiths guide to arranging is good by the way. I'd actually start there, that and graph paper.
The same thing keeps popping up really which is musical analysis, I didn't do that when i was starting out and to be honest I reckon I could have saved myself about 2 years of making stuff yhat wasn't quite right (either the rhythms or the arrangement). . . The best way is to try to assimilate as much stuff you like, compare and contrast etc
.
I slipped into a daze, whilst I was there I heard the most startling music, it was at once familiar and alien, reassuring and unsettling.
https://soundcloud.com/fearoftherave

continuous
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by continuous » Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:29 pm

Unlocking the Groove does look good. As far as the Snoman book being basic, if that's the case, basic is good. I'm trying to avoid spazzing out on a bunch of stuff and spinning my wheels. Need to start working harder on the basics. I've spent quite a bit of time getting my "gear" in line. Good lappy, soundcard, midi keyboard, DAW and softs etc.... building a laboratory and that has definitely helped improve my overall work flow and sound but something tells me there is more to get off on as one starts applying this knowledge to compositions.

Anyhow thanks much for the suggestions... I know it's smarmy, but I swear the community here is a big part of what I love about Live. It makes already rad software even better. OK now it's time to get kicked in the teeth again I'm sure. :mrgreen:

Tarekith, I'm gonna check out that tut... thanks. seems like Live 8's new collab features might be put to use in the education process?

cheers all

terragong
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Re: Basic Composition Book Recommends?

Post by terragong » Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:14 pm

lots of classic knowhow you find here.

http://www.youngcomposers.com/forum/

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