Ableton Forum

scott nathaniel wrote:
Yes, I know, but I picture you more as a Roy Batty type of Droid.

Yeah but I also choose that pic for the expression on his face, like "woah did that dude just shout out his love for Dick all over the internet?"

Roy Batty, thanks! I love that character. He was played really well in the movie too.

Android Bishop wrote:

leisuremuffin wrote:

Geezus wrote:
edit: whoops forgot to update my user name on the damn Linux box. this is android

wow, a racist and a multi-accounter. what a great guy you are.



.lm.

a) you're just proving my point that when you establish institutions that only benefit certain races (i.e. racist institutions) and one argues against them, people will call that person a racist. Furthermore, people argue that its necessary for now, but with attitudes like this its clear that nobody will EVER get rid of them no matter where society is at. Its hypocritical beyond belief.

b) Oh big deal, I finally decided on a producer name for myself and I created a new account here to reflect that to keep some continuity in my online persona. Firefox stores my usernames and passwords on my linux laptop and I forgot to update it to reflect the new user name. Sorry. I think the fact that I admitted to it right away kinda defeats any wrongdoing on my part.

What a huge load of bullshit. I'm not calling you a racist because you're arguing against affirmative action. It's the nature of your arguments that make you appear racist to me.

then there's this:

Geezus wrote:thank you
Stereotypes exist for a reason. That reason is that over (at minimum) 50% of the people it targets falls under these stereotypes in one way or another. Its a rare case that a stereotype just popped up out of thin air with no overall cultural pattern to back it up.

what is this bullshit? and why are you switching logins to post this sort of shit. Oh yeah, you forgot and your passwords were stored in your linux box. horseshit. you've been actively posting as both logins at the same time since april.



.lm.

leisuremuffin wrote:
What a huge load of bullshit. I'm not calling you a racist because you're arguing against affirmative action. It's the nature of your arguments that make you appear racist to me.

then there's this:

Geezus wrote:thank you
Stereotypes exist for a reason. That reason is that over (at minimum) 50% of the people it targets falls under these stereotypes in one way or another. Its a rare case that a stereotype just popped up out of thin air with no overall cultural pattern to back it up.

what is this bullshit? and why are you switching logins to post this sort of shit. Oh yeah, you forgot and your passwords were stored in your linux box. horseshit. you've been actively posting as both logins at the same time since april.



.lm.

a) the NATURE of my arguments? care to elaborate or are you just gonna keep throwing bullshit ad hominem attacks my way?

b) that post was made in response to an assertation that ghetto thugs are nothing but trouble, which I concurred to. nowhere was it evident, either in my post or in the post it was referring to, was race even brought up. You're just making assumptions to justify your personal attacks and quite frankly, I dont fucking appreciate it. I even clarified my position later in the thread, but of course you would choose to ignore that and take the quote out of context.

And, again, how exactly are my "double account" shifty purposes served when I OPENLY ADMIT to being the same person? Face it, I'm just lazy and never bothered to update my firefox settings on my other laptop.

Android Bishop wrote:

leisuremuffin wrote:
What a huge load of bullshit. I'm not calling you a racist because you're arguing against affirmative action. It's the nature of your arguments that make you appear racist to me.

then there's this:

Geezus wrote:thank you
Stereotypes exist for a reason. That reason is that over (at minimum) 50% of the people it targets falls under these stereotypes in one way or another. Its a rare case that a stereotype just popped up out of thin air with no overall cultural pattern to back it up.

what is this bullshit? and why are you switching logins to post this sort of shit. Oh yeah, you forgot and your passwords were stored in your linux box. horseshit. you've been actively posting as both logins at the same time since april.



.lm.

a) the NATURE of my arguments? care to elaborate or are you just gonna keep throwing bullshit ad hominem attacks my way?

b) that post was made in response to an assertation that ghetto thugs are nothing but trouble, which I concurred to. nowhere was it evident, either in my post or in the post it was referring to, was race even brought up. You're just making assumptions to justify your personal attacks and quite frankly, I dont fucking appreciate it. I even clarified my position later in the thread, but of course you would choose to ignore that and take the quote out of context.

And, again, how exactly are my "double account" shifty purposes served when I OPENLY ADMIT to being the same person? Face it, I'm just lazy and never bothered to update my firefox settings on my other laptop.

Look buddy, at best you're incredibly naive, more likely you're a racist.



and BTW, would you care to tell me what a "ghetto thug" is?

just for your reference, here's the definition of ghetto:
A ghetto is described as a "portion of a city in which members of a minority group live especially because of social, legal, or economic pressure."

so tell me again how that doesn't have to do with race?

and how you've come to the conclusion that at least 50% of any population that is stereotyped exhibits that stereotype?



at any rate, i'll give you the benefit of the doubt on the multi-account issue at this point, but it still seems fishy.


.lm.

leisuremuffin wrote:
Look buddy, at best you're incredibly naive, more likely you're a racist.



and BTW, would you care to tell me what a "ghetto thug" is?

just for your reference, here's the definition of ghetto:
A ghetto is described as a "portion of a city in which members of a minority group live especially because of social, legal, or economic pressure."

so tell me again how that doesn't have to do with race?

and how you've come to the conclusion that at least 50% of any population that is stereotyped exhibits that stereotype?



at any rate, i'll give you the benefit of the doubt on the multi-account issue at this point, but it still seems fishy.


.lm.

Again, I'm not going around calling you an ignorant motherfucker for your baseless personal attacks so the least you can do is take your useless bullshit and stick it up your ass where it belongs. You want to have an argument, argue the point and leave the insults to yourself.

Now to your points:
*I was not the one who originally used the phrase "ghetto" in the thread. Obviously it was not meant in the literal sense of the word but the more commonly used slang. I believe the original poster even clarified himself later in the thread.

*Oh please, really? Do you actually believe that stereotypes are just fabrications that were made up out of thin air and managed to stick around in the minds of millions of people? No doubt a FEW are, but these can't last long because there is no direct experience to back them up. People do fall under stereotypes, myself included. We are a race of social beings and as such we adopt many of the characteristics of those around us. It is possible to categorize a broad set of shared characteristics among any group of people one chooses, and that doesn't necessarily mean race either. There are exceptions of course, but even then the exceptions tend to fall under their own stereotypes as well. To pretend like stereotypes are pure falsehoods is dishonest in my opinion. Its like snowflakes: look at an individual snowflake and its unique. Put a bunch of snowflakes together and what you have is just a bunch of snow.

...

The facts given by every college on earth are racist?

Chang wrote:



The facts given by every college on earth are racist?

That chart is racist!!

Chang wrote:



The facts given by every college on earth are racist?

What the hell does that chart mean? Do you even know what Hispanic means. Tell me the difference between white and Hispanic, genius. Your chart is a crock. Which Asians, the Hans, the Burmese, the friggin' Mongolians? Which Whites--the tards from Appalachia, or the ones from France, Spain.

well I guess it's beyond obvious where you droidgeezus and chang are coming from, it saddens me really cause you android kind of sounded like someone who I could become friends with and unfortunately I just lost alot of respect I had for you chang, I'd always appreciated your post but it seems that you're not in
as right a mind as I gave you credit for. I do hope things work out in your moms favour android and I hope
that one day you and your family see that the values you espouse are the very same that she's experiencing
at work, I wouldn't wish anyone to have to experience or be victomized by racism and that is what's happening to her. appreciate the honesty guys but I am very glad that everybody who looks like you does not hold the same views as you, what it comes down to is that we are really in the same family and you just don't understand that.

so it's no suprise to anyone I'm sure that the trick in the question was the 'reverse racism' part since the notion is ludicrous and there is no such thing
whatever I'm done here.

starving student wrote:well I guess it's beyond obvious where you droidgeezus and chang are coming from, it saddens me really cause you android kind of sounded like someone who I could become friends with and unfortunately I just lost alot of respect I had for you chang, I'd always appreciated your post but it seems that you're not in
as right a mind as I gave you credit for. I do hope things work out in your moms favour android and I hope
that one day you and your family see that the values you espouse are the very same that she's experiencing
at work, I wouldn't wish anyone to have to experience or be victomized by racism and that is what's happening to her. appreciate the honesty guys but I am very glad that everybody who looks like you does not hold the same views as you, what it comes down to is that we are really in the same family and you just don't understand that.

so it's no suprise to anyone I'm sure that the trick in the question was the 'reverse racism' part since the notion is ludicrous and there is no such thing
whatever I'm done here.

Lets remember I didn't post that graph. Nowhere did I assert, nor do I believe, that any race or group is better than another. I do believe that certain groups share certain characteristics, and to think otherwise is extremely dishonest in my opinion. Thats what makes them a group, they share characteristics. And again, that doesn't necessarily include race either. If you stuck a black family in the middle of rural white corn farmers and left them there for a generation or two, they would probably start to fit certain stereotypes shared by the rural white corn farmers. Furthermore, that "we're in the same family" idea is exactly what I mean by stereotypes. People are people, everyone is the same to a certain extent. And when you break it down into groups, those groups tend to share certain characteristics as a whole as well. That's just how it works, our minds adapt to the culture we find ourselves in and we start to adopt those characteristics.

you think I stereotyped you by calling you family man you have no idea what i'm talking about, btw i wasn't saying that you and chang said the same thing i know you didn't but anyways I hear ya and I heard ya.

It depends on whether you're backwards or not. Geddit?

Android Bishop wrote: Again, I'm not going around calling you an ignorant motherfucker for your baseless personal attacks so the least you can do is take your useless bullshit and stick it up your ass where it belongs. You want to have an argument, argue the point and leave the insults to yourself.

If my attacks were baseless you might have a point. If one person is calling you an asshole it's probably a baseless personal attack. When one out of ten people you meet are calling you an asshole, you might be an asshole.

Android Bishop wrote: Now to your points:
*I was not the one who originally used the phrase "ghetto" in the thread. Obviously it was not meant in the literal sense of the word but the more commonly used slang. I believe the original poster even clarified himself later in the thread.

Very well, and would you care to explain to me how the "more commonly used slang" has nothing to do with race?

Android Bishop wrote: *Oh please, really? Do you actually believe that stereotypes are just fabrications that were made up out of thin air and managed to stick around in the minds of millions of people? No doubt a FEW are, but these can't last long because there is no direct experience to back them up. People do fall under stereotypes, myself included. We are a race of social beings and as such we adopt many of the characteristics of those around us. It is possible to categorize a broad set of shared characteristics among any group of people one chooses, and that doesn't necessarily mean race either. There are exceptions of course, but even then the exceptions tend to fall under their own stereotypes as well. To pretend like stereotypes are pure falsehoods is dishonest in my opinion. Its like snowflakes: look at an individual snowflake and its unique. Put a bunch of snowflakes together and what you have is just a bunch of snow.

What you fail to see is the fact that stereotypes are made by the observer, not the observed. The generalized first impression that is made of someone based on their membership to a race, class, religion, social faction, gender, whatever comes from the person who is having he first impression. There are as many stereotypes as there are people who have them, it is a device used by our nervous system so that we don't expend the energy to evaluate every individual we come across. When you make a statement like this:

Geezus wrote: thank you
Stereotypes exist for a reason. That reason is that over (at minimum) 50% of the people it targets falls under these stereotypes in one way or another. Its a rare case that a stereotype just popped up out of thin air with no overall cultural pattern to back it up.

You are exposing an inherently racist point of view. You've taken the stereotype, which exists in the head of the observer, and placed it as a reality upon the observed.




.lm.

leisuremuffin wrote:
If my attacks were baseless you might have a point. If one person is calling you an asshole it's probably a baseless personal attack. When one out of ten people you meet are calling you an asshole, you might be an asshole.

Probably. What I resent, however, is ad hominem attacks in a debate.

Very well, and would you care to explain to me how the "more commonly used slang" has nothing to do with race?

Its difficult to define a lot of slang down to a specific definition as its use changes depending on the situation and the person using it. "ghetto" as a slang word, in the context used in that other conversation, probably means low quality, poor (not saying both are mutually inclusive, as not everybody/thing poor is of low quality). Things and places can be called "ghetto" too ("man that pizza joint is ghetto"). One doesnt have to be a minority to be referred to as ghetto, any low class sleazebucket will do (whether they be white, black, vietnamese, or whatever). Again it depends on the person using it and what its referring to, its slang so its not a static term.

What you fail to see is the fact that stereotypes are made by the observer, not the observed. The generalized first impression that is made of someone based on their membership to a race, class, religion, social faction, gender, whatever comes from the person who is having he first impression. There are as many stereotypes as there are people who have them, it is a device used by our nervous system so that we don't expend the energy to evaluate every individual we come across.

That is not something I have failed to observe, of course stereotypes are made by the observer. That is the very nature of a stereotype, or any other quality for that matter. One can ever stereotype themselves by viewing themselves in the third person perspective. For example, someone pointed me to http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/ and I thought to myself "wow that site really nailed me!" The very nature of a "quality" or "characteristic" is a construct invented by the human mind. Because it is a device used by the mind to qualify behavior in others, it is also used to adapt to the people around oneself over time. The mind's plasticity develops a person's characteristics based on their observations of other people's characteristics that person is surrounded by during their lifespan. Its why we have different cultures and subcultures, and why differences are almost always regional based.

Geezus wrote: thank you
Stereotypes exist for a reason. That reason is that over (at minimum) 50% of the people it targets falls under these stereotypes in one way or another. Its a rare case that a stereotype just popped up out of thin air with no overall cultural pattern to back it up.

You are exposing an inherently racist point of view. You've taken the stereotype, which exists in the head of the observer, and placed it as a reality upon the observed.

[/quote]

I'm not going to argue again how that statement wasn't referring to race at all, but I'll go where you want to go and argue that point.

If you define a "racist" as someone who, through their own observation, categorizes a broad set of shared similarities between race-based groups of people, then yes I am a racist. I think its dishonest to think otherwise. People of the same race have grown up with other members of the same race for generations, therefore they adopt shared characteristics with other members of that culture. I guess its more accurate to say I'm a "culturalist", because there can be distinctly different cultures to the same general "race" of people. For instance, all of the Nigerian americans I have met share absolutely zero characteristics in common with black people "native" to the U.S. (not native but you know, come from a long line of multiple generations living here). However, there are certain characteristics that are shared by the Nigerian americans themselves. Its the same with ANY group of people that grow up or spend significant amounts of time with other members of that particular group. Sometimes that includes race, sometimes it doesnt. Of course individuals stand out as unique but we're talking about broad characteristics of multiple people here, so overall patterns one observes with continued exposure to different members of that group. Everybody's mind works like that, I think if you say your mind doesnt form broad categories of characteristics to particular groups of people one encounters I'd call you a liar.
The very ACKNOWLEDGMENT that there are different races for one to be racist towards is racist in and of itself. If you acknowledge that black people have black skin, you are being racist. You are forming a stereotype characteristic shared by a broad group of individuals.