quick message about disappointment

[sdfak1234]

I've been using Live for a long time, many years since the early versions... I'm a semi-pro musician and I bought an APC40 a few months back, been practising with it and love the POSSIBILITIES of it... but I just had to write for the first time about my absolute frustration at Ableton 7 and especially 8... I know I'm gonna get flamed, but I don't care... I did a big gig the other night and I had to stop mid set because Ableton crashed on me no less than 5 times.... and I know what people are gonna say, blame someone else, 3rd party plugins, bad system, user error, electricity, whatever... like I said I know my stuff, I'm a pretty decent developer myself and I KNOW it's ableton's fault. Legit copy, I even tested the cpu registers and the memory of my machine, stress tested and everything.

More and more bugs have crept in and even in the studio I've had literally hundreds of crashes over every possible thing. I stripped down my set, frozen everything, tested everything multiple times over, cut no corners whatsoever and it still crashed...

The worst thing was that I hyped up the APC and ableton to a bunch of big name artists backstage, and I basically looked like a fool, ableton looked like a joke... and now even though I desperately want to play out with my APC and Live 8, I just cant because it is nowhere near ready for prime time... and apparently no matter what I do I cant make it stable and I like I said I had to write this because it breaks my heart that I cant trust Ableton anymore.. I worry you guys are going the way of Steinberg.... if it's for live use it should be stable.

Live didn't used to be like this. If this isnt sorted out soon, I'm gonna ask for a refund and never use live again... you cant even enjoy using anymore... there is nothing that saps my creative energy more than a crash. No need for replies, I just had to say something, because I dont want other professionals being fooled into thinking this app is stable anymore.

[hurlingdervish]

live 8 is getting bugs from some people but


good luck making live sets with cubase

submit a proper report in the support section

[Tone Deft]

that sucks, but why did you upgrade?

use a Live 7 version with the APC.

[sdfak1234]

hurlingdervish.. I didn't say anything about using Cubase, I quit using that years ago for the same reason. I want to use ableton, of course its the only thing that has the POSSIBILITY of doing what I need it to do, but now it's so unreliable it just cant be used LIVE.

Tone Deft: why didnt I use Live 7? why did I upgrade? because Ableton didnt tell me it was practically a beta version... and when you pay for something you're supposed to get it... also, I want to use the new features, I mean is that crazy?

[sdfak1234]

if you bought a new car and it broke down on you the day you bought it, would the car salesman say "why didn't you use your old car?"

[Tone Deft]

Tone Deft: why didnt I use Live 7? why did I upgrade? because Ableton didnt tell me it was practically a beta version... and when you pay for something you're supposed to get it... also, I want to use the new features, I mean is that crazy?

if you're a developer you should know better.

sorry you're pissed off.

make bug reports, you're a developer you should be able to write good ones.

lessons learned.
- try demos before spending hundreds of dollars.
- beat the shit out of your set before you play in front of people.

[Tone Deft]

if you bought a new car and it broke down on you the day you bought it, would the car salesman say "why didn't you use your old car?"

yeah, software and cars are the same thing.

cars come with warranties and wear out over time. there's no such thing as bug free software and they don't wear out over time, nor do they come with warranties. there are also 'lemon laws' in place to protect consumers.



I don't mean to be a patent fan boy, I just read a lot of these kinds of complaints and read the replies, which are generally to be careful about upgrading and playing out.

best of luck with Live 7, please do make some bug reports, they help us all out.

don't worry, some day I'll get screwed with a bad update and I'll be up in here screaming 'WTF!?!?!'

[hurlingdervish]

i know you said cubase sucks my point was there isnt a better way to do what you want to do, and you know that

its a bit of monopoly yes, but until a competitor comes around (maschine maybe?) you are out of luck, i would revert to 7 for live and save 8 for the studio

[hurlingdervish]

i was having problems with 8 until i put my laptop on the highest performance, i used to never have to do that with live 7 but once i did all the popping and crashing stopped

[sdfak1234]

this is just part of worrying new trend of hardware and software manufacturers selling unfinished, untested stuff because they want the money now and foolishly believe they'll fix it later, whilst we all do the testing for them like fools... if the governments were more computer literate, they wouldn't even be allowed to sell this stuff as finished products, it would be against trading standards.

Tone Deft: "if you're a developer"? why is it forums always question peoples occupations? it's bad manners dude. I'm paid to write code and bug reports for my own software, it is not my job to fix Ableton's bugs, that's what I paid them for... and if I had to write bug reports for all the bugs I've experienced, it'd be a full time job... plus, the nature of these bugs are intermittent, hence the use of the "unstable".. its also a sign of very badly written code.

I appreciate your comments, but I've already learned how to make records and play live... and like I said before the shit had been beaten out of that set and it still crashed, they're intermittent bugs which I blame ABLETON for... and I knew i'd just get flames saying it was my fault not theirs.. I guess I'm just putting this out as a warning for people that choose to believe me.

[sdfak1234]

I'm sorry, but I just cant believe you guys are saying use 7 live, use 8 in the studio, don't you realise you're just admitting that live 8 is a lemon? and don't you realise that when you buy a product that is called "live" and you cant use it live, there's something terribly wrong with that? ... plus 8 is worse than 7, 7 is worse than 6 and so on... all software has bugs, but there is a big difference between a minor inconvenient bug and a bug that prevents the software from doing its job, that's called critical and software is not supposed to be released under those conditions.

[Tone Deft]

Tone Deft: "if you're a developer"? why is it forums always question peoples occupations? it's bad manners dude

true, sorry. the spirit of what I meant was that developers can appreciate a good bug report. short, to the point, all the relevant info and instructions on how to reproduce the bug. surely you've seen bad bug reports, totally worthless. plus you're a seasoned gear user, you could be of great help. BUT should users have to bug test? many many many many people have posted "hell no" to that idea. I'm just a hobbyist, so I take it as it comes. I like tinkering with things so some bug exploration doesn't put me out.

you're totally not alone with your sentiments.

best of luck, sucks that you were put into that position.

[Tone Deft]

I'm sorry, but I just cant believe you guys are saying use 7 live, use 8 in the studio, don't you realise you're just admitting that live 8 is a lemon? and don't you realise that when you buy a product that is called "live" and you cant use it live, there's something terribly wrong with that? ... plus 8 is worse than 7, 7 is worse than 6 and so on... all software has bugs, but there is a big difference between a minor inconvenient bug and a bug that prevents the software from doing its job, that's called critical and software is not supposed to be released under those conditions.

Live 8 is as stable as any other version of Live has been for me. I believe you when you say it's unusable for YOU, I'm not pushing my experience onto you.

did you practice with 8 before you played out? I don't play out but man I'd beat the hell out of my set before going up on stage.

[sdfak1234]

Tone, sorry man, but I thought I'd already answered this clearly... I BEAT THE HELL OUT OF IT, I cant talk about the gig or my work, but I thought 40hrs+ of practice for 1 night was enough practice to see if everything was sound.... that's why I'm disappointed, I CUT NO CORNERS AT ALL, it was a serious gig.

When you say "Live 8 is as stable as any other version of Live has been for me", maybe I'm reading between the lines, but I'm assuming that means it does crash on you.

[sdfak1234]

I mean, why even let a 3rd party program or system fault crash your program?? even that's bad coding.