Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
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rozling
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Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by rozling » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:40 am

http://www.thomann.de/ie/american_audio_ttd_2400.htm

I figure for 100 brick you can't go wrong.

I'm looking to incorporate vinyl (both audio and control) into my set and I want something at home to practise on and also rip my modest collection, so I'll probably augment this with a decent stylus, and I figure the phono input of my E-MU 1820m should do the job for recording.

This is nothing to do with this morning's press release by the way :D

Thoughts? Too cheap?

Da hand
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by Da hand » Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:39 am

Hard to say without trying them out, but from the description some things stand out that you should take into consideration:

1. The pitch control is much shorter than most turntables out there. This will be a huge disadvantage in beatmatching as you will have less precision in controlling the speed of the platter (less distance on the pitch control to adjust the same BMP/speed change).

2. Torque - it says greater than 1 kg-cm - but that is a little vague. 1kg-cm is a bit low. Technics are 1.5 kg-cm. Numarks are higher at around 1.7 km-cm. The higher the torque, the faster the turntable will react to launching records and scratching, and will feel smoother when changing speeds.

3. No dust cover - very useful in keeping your decks clean for use.

4. No cue light - useful in dropping the needle on the record in dark conditions (this is not crucial, but useful)


On the plus side, it is a direct-drive - which is essential for DJing.

djsynchro
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by djsynchro » Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:53 am

Hard to say without trying it out. A friend of mine had imitation Sl's and the pitch slider worked the wrong way round. By the way Technics themselves made pichable CD plyers (really expensive ones, oly ever saw them in a radio studio) where the pitch slider worked the wron way round too.

You got 30 days to send it back I think.

rozling
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by rozling » Mon Oct 05, 2009 12:07 pm

Da hand wrote:Hard to say without trying them out, but from the description some things stand out that you should take into consideration:

1. The pitch control is much shorter than most turntables out there. This will be a huge disadvantage in beatmatching as you will have less precision in controlling the speed of the platter (less distance on the pitch control to adjust the same BMP/speed change).

2. Torque - it says greater than 1 kg-cm - but that is a little vague. 1kg-cm is a bit low. Technics are 1.5 kg-cm. Numarks are higher at around 1.7 km-cm. The higher the torque, the faster the turntable will react to launching records and scratching, and will feel smoother when changing speeds.

3. No dust cover - very useful in keeping your decks clean for use.

4. No cue light - useful in dropping the needle on the record in dark conditions (this is not crucial, but useful)


On the plus side, it is a direct-drive - which is essential for DJing.
That's great info, thanks a lot! I wouldn't have realised that about the torque & pitch control, & it's high time I learned to beatmatch properly.

It occurs to me that the clubs I'll be playing at will probably have at least halfway decent decks, so the specs that you mention will probably be good on those machines. Probably better to be familiar with something closer to what I'll be using rather than get a surprise in terms of difference in feel etc.
djsynchro wrote:Hard to say without trying it out. A friend of mine had imitation Sl's and the pitch slider worked the wrong way round. By the way Technics themselves made pichable CD plyers (really expensive ones, oly ever saw them in a radio studio) where the pitch slider worked the wron way round too.

You got 30 days to send it back I think.
I hadn't considered a test drive! Could be expensive from Ireland, but I might check out local dealers. I like the pitch slider set up so you move away from you to pitch up - that's the standard right? I can't understand why e.g. Traktor has it the other way round and won't let you invert it...

Anyway cheers for the tips - I'm off to check this out some more...

MrShine
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by MrShine » Mon Oct 05, 2009 12:22 pm

rozling wrote:
I like the pitch slider set up so you move away from you to pitch up - that's the standard right?
No.

Typically decks have the pitch slider moving towards the front for ' pitching up '....tbh i've never come across it in any other way on DJ equipment, whether Turntables or CD players and i've been using them for many many years with different manufacturers.

If your looking to learn to DJ, these are fine, gear isn't always dependant on your skill...learn the basics then move on to other more stable gear.

When you start, you're going to be learning pitch control, track structure etc before worrying about other stuff, but what has been said here already is good information to have.

What style of music are you looking to DJ with? If you're going along a R&B/Hip Hop route then these are pretty much useless for what you want, basic spin back/crossover tricks when mixing just won't work very well, but a house standard 4/4 beat match will prove fairly straight forward after a while with these decks.

I've DJ'd on some pretty dire decks in my time, even Technics have a pitch wobble after a while in clubs, so you're constantly keeping on your toes with it...get the basics, learn the basics and then move on.

Good luck and most of all....have fun doing it! :mrgreen:

p.s. btw i've never used these particular brand....but if you can stretch your budget abit, then consider:

http://www.thomann.de/ie/stanton_t_62.htm

they come with a decent cart as well to get you going...

rozling
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by rozling » Mon Oct 05, 2009 2:45 pm

Heh - interesting re the pitch control, seems counter-intuitive to me but then I have a weird way of understanding things sometimes.

I should clarify - I have experience DJing, mostly with Live but sometimes alternating between Live/CDJs and (very rarely) turntables. But any time I used decks I was pretty awkward at it :) I've always had the luxury of Live beatmatching for me unless I ran out of time to warp a track.

This time round I'm collaborating with another DJ for a funk & soul night (with the hopes of getting a regular slot) so it'll be more straight playing out than proper mixing/scratching stuff, but I do want to be prepared.

I could just use Live, but I find for this type of music Live isn't great due to the music's occasional tendency to tempo variation. My next preference would be Traktor (I also like this for the ability to draw up playlists/sort tunes nicely), but until I'm comfortable with that and get my head around beatgridding etc I think I'll just use vinyl. It'd be nice to give my stack of records an airing, and I may eventually upgrade to Traktor Scratch/Serato|Ableton.

rozling
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by rozling » Mon Oct 05, 2009 2:56 pm

Oh yeah almost forgot - I like the cut of that Stanton drive's jib. Annoyingly I can't find mention of torque even on the product page, but it's a nice looking bit of kit, as is the Numark TT 1650 at the same price point.

MrShine
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by MrShine » Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:59 pm

rozling wrote:Oh yeah almost forgot - I like the cut of that Stanton drive's jib. Annoyingly I can't find mention of torque even on the product page, but it's a nice looking bit of kit, as is the Numark TT 1650 at the same price point.
I don't know tbh with the torque on the Stanton....hang on....quick google....

http://www.stantondj.com/v2/prod_t62_tech.asp

doesn't show the torque settings, but tbh it'll be standard which is apprx 1-1.5.

The Numark are a decent deck, i've had mine for a few years ( TT200 ) and the difference is minimal between the 1650 and 200, i think a reverse button, quartz lock and switchable tonearms on the 200 are the benefits.

From what you're saying you know the basics, the first deck will play vinyl no problems, the Stanton & Numark will allow you to progress further ( i've used/owned both ) in the mix as they say :)

Cheers

v00d00ppl
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by v00d00ppl » Tue Oct 06, 2009 12:32 am

i use a cheap ass ion i picked up for 50 used and i just threw own a shure m97xe cartridge and i was good to go when it comes to sampling records. Or if you like to sample a lot of the low end go with the shure m447 cartridge
SSL X Desk / Apollo Twin Solo / Sherman Restyler / Ensoniq EPS Classic / Analog Keys / Handsome Audio Zulu

Da hand
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by Da hand » Tue Oct 06, 2009 1:22 am

rozling wrote: It occurs to me that the clubs I'll be playing at will probably have at least halfway decent decks, so the specs that you mention will probably be good on those machines. Probably better to be familiar with something closer to what I'll be using rather than get a surprise in terms of difference in feel etc.
Yes, if your decks at home are inferior and you start playing out on better ones, you will see a difference. Although, I would say that adjusting to better equipment will be quite easy, but then you will begin getting frustrated with your equipment at home. So the more you start playing out, the more you will see yourself having to adjust on your (inferior) home equipment.

rozling
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by rozling » Wed Oct 07, 2009 4:06 pm

Just put in an order for the Stanton, just as Thomann added another entry-level American Audio deck (same as the one above but with USB output).

Thanks a lot for the advice everyone :D

MrShine
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Re: Is this cheap a$$ turntable any use?

Post by MrShine » Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:11 pm

rozling wrote:Just put in an order for the Stanton, just as Thomann added another entry-level American Audio deck (same as the one above but with USB output).

Thanks a lot for the advice everyone :D
typical :roll:

Anyway...have fun :mrgreen:

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