Ableton continues to support both platforms

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Geraldo
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Ableton continues to support both platforms

Post by Geraldo » Tue Sep 10, 2002 8:09 pm

If Ableton really wants to convince me they support both platforms equally, why don't we have an Altivec optimized version yet??? Hello??????????????
Geraldo

SongCarver
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Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2001 3:29 pm

Post by SongCarver » Tue Sep 10, 2002 9:51 pm

I admire the fact that Ableton are supporting OS 9 and OS X. Currently they're between a rock and a steve jobs.

I'm sure altivec takes time to get right.

Guest

whats up with Geraldo

Post by Guest » Tue Sep 10, 2002 10:29 pm

dude, they do support them equally, they don't support altivec yet and they don't support the equivalent of altivec by intel or by amd. sowhat are you talking about :roll:

Geraldo
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Post by Geraldo » Wed Sep 11, 2002 3:41 am

I thought I was talking about about Apple's 128 bit vector engine that Ableton does not support. This essentially ties one hand behind a Mac's back and is one reason LIVE does not perform as well on Macs as it does on PC. I disagree that there is any equivalent technology for Intel or AMD.

Guest

huh?

Post by Guest » Wed Sep 11, 2002 4:48 am

yon
Guest





Posted: Fri May 17, 2002 5:39 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Geraldo wrote:

If an 800Mhz Tibook can keep up with a 1Ghz Dell w/o Altivec imagine what it would do with.



You might rather choose to compare
an Intel or AMD PC running SSE optimized
code and a G4 Powermac running Altivec
optimized code. Or perhaps SSE2 on the
P4 and 3dnow! on the AMD. The platform
specific stuff can get quite complicated.

Of course, people have made some pretty
incredible computer music on much slower
machines than these!

-Yon

Guest

Post by Guest » Wed Sep 11, 2002 5:48 pm

Altivec is a crucial part of the Macintosh platform. I think it is safe to say its more important to Mac performance than SSE2 is to Wintel. If Cubase and Logic can manage to integrate it, why can't Ableton? And why is it unreasonable for me to bring it up on this forum? If users don't ask for the features they want, they won't get them. Am I making some of you uncomfortable by mentioning it?
Geraldo

joshcarter
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Post by joshcarter » Wed Sep 11, 2002 7:14 pm

A note to Ableton: Apple has pretty nice vector processing libraries in Jaguar 10.2:

http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/mac ... ecLib.html

Just FYI, in case these would help.

Your fan,
Josh

lasers and their beams
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Post by lasers and their beams » Wed Sep 11, 2002 7:39 pm

I'm on a g4 for one reason: photoshop 7, which gains speed increases of 48% from altivec enhancement. I can't afford two platforms. This issue has been bouncing around for so long...is it in the pipeline?

Steve

Alex Reynolds
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yon...

Post by Alex Reynolds » Wed Sep 11, 2002 7:44 pm

Addition of support for SSE2 and the like does not provide the same level of improvement as Altivec:

-- http://developer.apple.com/hardware/ve/summary.html

Therefore, a developer looking at which problem to tackle first might see this as a return on investment of time, as far as performance improvement goes, and see that spending time on supported Altivec will yield greater returns than SSE2, et al.

Regards,
Alex

Alex Reynolds
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On the other hand...

Post by Alex Reynolds » Wed Sep 11, 2002 8:41 pm

That's not to say that better music can't be made with slower machines. Fast software should not compensate for a lack of creativity.

But getting the full power out of the hardware would be ideal, in an ideal world...

Regards,
Alex

Guest

Post by Guest » Wed Sep 11, 2002 8:44 pm

Thanks Alex, L & TB and Josh

Guest

abosolutely not Geraldo

Post by Guest » Wed Sep 11, 2002 8:45 pm

No Geraldo I did not mean to give you the impression that you should stop
asking ableton for enhancements, or that ableton should not support altivec, I wish they would fufil all of our request, at least the ones that are logical and I believe that the altivec one is logical. what I don't like is the attitude on this forum , like i've seen no where else where people have the nerve to actually encourage ableton to just become another macintosh product, that is very selfish and I wish it would stop.

SongCarvernotloggedin

Post by SongCarvernotloggedin » Wed Sep 11, 2002 11:18 pm

This is actually a pretty good forum I believe,

My 2 cents:

-The fact that Ableton supports both major platforms well is a credit to them

-Logic becoming an Apple product was great for Apple users, and I feel that it will probably be a good thing.This is due to the ability for Logic developers to reduce the time it takes to test and re-code for different platforms and hundreds of variants on PC.

the question arises, what if Avid never released Pro-tools for OS X. (I know they said they will)

A lot of studios would move to PC.


Altivec

I believe that altivec is not easily comparable to the Wintel chip options. The difference between a G3 and a G4 is basically the altivec unit. IT MAKES the new chip.

Obviously there is a lot of work involved in implementing it. However, the altivec unit is almost designed for FFT work.

thanks josh and alex for your constructive links. Guys like me go and read those things to learn what this altivec thing is really about.


A last point,

How about Dual Proccessing?
Does LIVE support that, since all new macs are DP.

And other benefits of the mac platform, like Audio Units... is there any official word on support for them?

-K

[/b]

tjwett
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Post by tjwett » Thu Sep 12, 2002 2:33 am

maybe it's on it's way. this is the one big issue that gets beat to death here that the Abe's have not responded to at all. maybe we will get a surprise one day. hope it's before everyone gives up and leaves though.

FrankH
Posts: 226
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2002 9:38 pm
Location: Zeist, The Netherlands

I'll wait

Post by FrankH » Thu Sep 12, 2002 7:01 pm

tjwett wrote:maybe it's on it's way. this is the one big issue that gets beat to death here that the Abe's have not responded to at all. maybe we will get a surprise one day. hope it's before everyone gives up and leaves though.
Leave?
With or without all these optimalisations, Live is still great.
I hope they'll find some time overthere in Berlin to give a response. But i can't blame them, those people are working very hard.

Peace,

f

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