WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
nicogrubert
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by nicogrubert » Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:57 am

After I re-setup my system completely and removed all the unnessary vst plugins I only have a handful of vst plugins I always use (all UAD plugins, all NI plugins, all arturia plugins).
However, since Live 8 I have a lot of crashes (around 1-2 per hour). I save my work every 10 minutes. However, I could recover all my projects after a crash.

Hm, I cannot remember any crash in Live 6.10.

supamonsta
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by supamonsta » Tue Jan 26, 2010 12:36 pm

Hm, I cannot remember any crash in Live 6.10.
well, to be true, there are sometimes crashes with live 6.10. But here, "sometimes" means something around 2-3 crashes in a year for me... and I never lost anything.

I'm soon installing live 7, I hope it will be as reliable as live 6.

(not even speaking of live 8 :wink: )

@ Original Poster:

sad you lost your work. I absolutely understand your anger and sadness. Ableton should offer discounts to all Live 8 buyers (MFL, the bridge, live 9 upgrade...)

and apologies for this crap they pretend to be a professionnal software (speaking of version 8 )

cheers

Khazul
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by Khazul » Tue Jan 26, 2010 12:45 pm

3dot... wrote:bottom line... it's the users responsibility to save the material...
Yes - but its ableton responsibility to make sure the friggin recovery works sensibly, and not just give up with the whole damn thing because the very last item caused it to die - duh - the last item was probably what caused it crash in the first place, so allmost no suprise that kills it again.

I thought this was what the undomarker.cfg file was for - to note how far it got in case it died again - I guess this process is buggy.

IMHO fixing the recovery and making the process work as well as possible should be absolutely number 1 priority, at least when (not if) it crashes, most of what you did in the last five minutes/4 hours or whatever gets recovered. (Five mins may not sound like alot, but if you have created some absolute killer section, riff or whatever that you probably havnt a hope in hell of ever recreating as good - then five mins may as well be a lifetime - what you did is gone forever).

Its fair enough that it doesnt receover that last thing that killed it, but it damn well should recover everything else!

Also saving a large complex set (which is typically what starts to tip the balance towards crashing) all the time becomes a right pain when its starts to take longer to save than it took to do the edits you are saving.

Make the recovery work flawlessly!
Nothing to see here - move along!

ethios4
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by ethios4 » Tue Jan 26, 2010 1:41 pm

@OP - Yea, save often...sorry to hear it though....you've got a good sense of humor! :D
Last edited by ethios4 on Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kenporter
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by kenporter » Tue Jan 26, 2010 2:45 pm

3dot... wrote:
kenporter wrote:
davepermen wrote:last save 4 hours ago == fail.

it's abletons fault that it crashed. it's your fault you lost lots of work.
Why is it a big fail if he didn't save it for 4 hours? When you're in the midst of working sometimes it just happens that you don't save. If a program crashes you should be able to recover the work regardless if the program restores it from the undo history (which obviously failed in this case and shouldn't have!) or if the program has an auto save function.

Ken
because it could have been a power outage ,a hard drive failure or anything else that's not predictable
(...Live8 crashes are pretty predictable...
I'll give it a 1/10 ratio when composing..)
bottom line... it's the users responsibility to save the material...
I have a UPS, so power outages don't matter to me. ;) My point was sometimes it's easy to forget to save. An auto save function like many other DAW's have would be a nice feature. Back in the day when I was still using Cubase it crashed on me all the time, but I never lost more than a few minutes worth of work (I did lose my patience and hence switched to Live) because I had set up an auto save function to two minutes that created up to 3 different versions. Nice feature...

Ken

3dot...
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by 3dot... » Tue Jan 26, 2010 6:32 pm

kenporter wrote:
I have a UPS, so power outages don't matter to me. ;) My point was sometimes it's easy to forget to save. An auto save function like many other DAW's have would be a nice feature. Back in the day when I was still using Cubase it crashed on me all the time, but I never lost more than a few minutes worth of work (I did lose my patience and hence switched to Live) because I had set up an auto save function to two minutes that created up to 3 different versions. Nice feature...

Ken
agreed that the current scheme isn't working...
and I also agree that the auto-save feature would be welcome...

believe me ..
I've learned the hard way... and not once or twice either..
you kinda develop a reflex ...more like a ctrl-s twitch...
so somehow.. I AM the auto-save feature...
:mrgreen:
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SubFunk
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by SubFunk » Tue Jan 26, 2010 6:39 pm

if auto save, then only user switchable on/off... !!!

i would not like it to save in an interval i have no control over, respectively being still able to save when i want it.

or someone should just write a simple add on app like Logic7s autosave apps, you can run it if you are in need and you can also define in which time interval it saves, brilliant.

like that, that for Live would be perfect, i think!

http://www.opuslocus.net/logic/

it is only a script, should be easy to make for one of you IT geniuses out there...
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cotdagoo
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by cotdagoo » Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:07 pm

3dot... wrote: agreed that the current scheme isn't working...
and I also agree that the auto-save feature would be welcome...

believe me ..
I've learned the hard way... and not once or twice either..
you kinda develop a reflex ...more like a ctrl-s twitch...
so somehow.. I AM the auto-save feature...
:mrgreen:
so long as auto-save has the option to save incremental filenames!
i use ctrl-s usually, but after big changes i tend to save the filename as -1 or -2, etc.. just in case i want to go back to tweak something or revert to a previous version.

LoopStationZebra
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by LoopStationZebra » Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:15 pm

hey, didn't we just see this thread yesterday or something? lol.
I came for the :lol:
But stayed for the :x

cotdagoo
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by cotdagoo » Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:38 pm

LoopStationZebra wrote:hey, didn't we just see this thread yesterday or something? lol.
it's possible.. i mean this thread was made yesterday. so if you saw it then, maybe that's why :roll:

ethios4
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by ethios4 » Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:51 pm

Didn't someone just post about this thread being posted yesterday??

LoopStationZebra
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by LoopStationZebra » Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:53 pm

ethios4 wrote:Didn't someone just post about this thread being posted yesterday??
I see what you did there.
I came for the :lol:
But stayed for the :x

davepermen
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by davepermen » Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:10 pm

kenporter wrote:
I have a UPS, so power outages don't matter to me. ;) My point was sometimes it's easy to forget to save. An auto save function like many other DAW's have would be a nice feature. Back in the day when I was still using Cubase it crashed on me all the time, but I never lost more than a few minutes worth of work (I did lose my patience and hence switched to Live) because I had set up an auto save function to two minutes that created up to 3 different versions. Nice feature...

Ken
tell that to my home server, who got its mainboard killed because the psu made some outage itself somehow.

systems will always have ways to die. that's why my home server backs up my pcs, and it's own data, too.
http://davepermen.net my tiny webpage, including link to bandcamp.

davepermen
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by davepermen » Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:13 pm

Khazul wrote:
3dot... wrote:bottom line... it's the users responsibility to save the material...
Yes - but its ableton responsibility to make sure the friggin recovery works sensibly, and not just give up with the whole damn thing because the very last item caused it to die - duh - the last item was probably what caused it crash in the first place, so allmost no suprise that kills it again.
it's the cars responsibility to recover once it crashed?

if some software crashes, there is NO guarantee possible. that's why it crashes.

normally, it can recover, but there's no guarantee for anything.
http://davepermen.net my tiny webpage, including link to bandcamp.

nicogrubert
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Re: WTF?? Big crash lots of work lost!!!

Post by nicogrubert » Wed Jan 27, 2010 7:38 am

The good point is:

Code: Select all

We have now decided to:

    * suspend all development towards new features while the whole team joins forces to address the current issues. This effort is open ended and will result in a free Live 8 update;
    * make process changes to prevent similar situations from happening in the future.
Read Gerhard's full post here:
http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=132761

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