Ableton HQ please read

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
lark830
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by lark830 » Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:00 pm

In my specific case, Live was crashing when I dragged and dropped clips into empty slot positions. I was also duplicating clips, by holding down the option key, as I moved them to new locations. It crashed every time, sooner or later. I wasn't doing any cpu intensive activities like crazy complicated effects routing, or using tons of plugin's (vst or audio units, or software synths). Just moving files, and doing a loose arrangement of my show.

That "light" task shouldn't cause the program to crash. I actually saw another thread, where another user was doing the same thing, dragging, dropping, and duplicating clips before his system crashed.

Hoping this helps...

3phase
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by 3phase » Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:25 pm

jamief wrote:just posted by on facebook

Kenny Larkin Thanks goes out to Ableton 4 screwing up my live shows this weekend! The buggie software was the star of the show! Live 8.1.1 crashed I don't know how many times leading up 2 both gigs. I had 2 download a beta and start from scratch by throwing something together at the last minute in the hotel before the gigs! Why re...lease this buggie crap that will crash in front of thousands before it's ready for use?

Kenny Larkin Squeaky wheel gets the oil my friends! I hope they sort this shizzy out before my show with Carl Craig at the end of the month at Elysée Montmartre! Or it will be just me rappin' onstage, and trust me, they don't want to see that.

welcome to the club
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3phase
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by 3phase » Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:48 pm

locojohn wrote:[ I do not install beta versions and I do not work with beta versions. Someone from support constantly advises me to install beta version of Live to see if the problem I experience persists in the beta. I

Problem is that Live 8 is a beta version and all users are paying betatesters.. a new concept to keep the thing exciting..

because all versions are betas you are best of with the newest beta..

if you want to return to l7 now? forget it..ther is a new file format you will loose all your work youve done under 8...

so do it all again..or become a happy paying betatester..


I personally don mind the paying so much.. just the time the betatesting continues...

i started complaining in july.. now its... almost july again...
Last edited by 3phase on Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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zee verkawound
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by zee verkawound » Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:49 pm

Donnie wrote:What zee verkawound described sounds like what would happen to me in 7 whenver I had a vst plugin that wasnt jiving with ableton.

Not saying thats it, but something to look out for.
appreciated Donnie. Thing is I have been using the same exact VSTs since 6. And also doing the same things with those same VSTs. I admit that I use Live pretty hard but I have been using it like that for years.

I wish I understood the mechanics of how these memory leaks work. Maybe the memory leak possibility is precisely why such basic random or routine actions can cause the program to crash within a corrupted set. I still say that its something happening in the program itself once whatever this accumulative process is that causes more frequent crashes to occur. Some kind of a bad reaction. There is just too much ignorance on my part to do anything but imagine what might be.

The bottom line is that there is really nothing software wise that does what Live does, but as Live currently is, it's a real frustrating mess.

Dennis DeSantis
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by Dennis DeSantis » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:05 pm

3phase wrote:if you want to return to l7 now? forget it..ther is a new file format you will loose all your work youve done under 8...
For what it's worth, I know of no software that allows you to use a newly created document in an older major release. You couldn't use Live 7 documents in Live 6 either. This is not a "bug."

The issue is that documents created in Live 8.1 or newer are not compatible with versions of Live 8 prior to 8.1.

Best,

3phase
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by 3phase » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:10 pm

zee verkawound wrote: The bottom line is that there is really nothing software wise that does what Live does, but as Live currently is, it's a real frustrating mess.

and what is that beside thats a pattern based sequencer?

isnt the trap just theese bloody comfort to be able to mangle your old audio files instead beeing a real sportsman and using paternbased hardware on stage?.

is the pling plong you play with ableton really so much superior to the pling plong you do with a mpc ?

you have to carry an fx rack with the mpc?.. ok..ther is software that emulates fx racks on your computer.. you can use you laptop as a mixer..

for what do we really need live? isnst this just rather some kind of laziness that has grown over years and now one feels dependend on that crap?

ther are other ways.. they just need a bit creativity..and of cause to abandon all the gigabytes of material created in live..
Last edited by 3phase on Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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3phase
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by 3phase » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:15 pm

Dennis DeSantis wrote:
3phase wrote:if you want to return to l7 now? forget it..ther is a new file format you will loose all your work youve done under 8...
For what it's worth, I know of no software that allows you to use a newly created document in an older major release. You couldn't use Live 7 documents in Live 6 either. This is not a "bug."

The issue is that documents created in Live 8.1 or newer are not compatible with versions of Live 8 prior to 8.1.

Best,

when i would be the owner of Ableton.. and realise that my new software is to buggy for my professional userbase i would at least provide a converter applikation..
especially when i change the fileformat 2 times in one year..thats a bit extreme.

besides.. i remember older logic versions that was able to safe in Logic 4 format..

at the times emagic wasnt apple... and more orientated towards there professional customers..

Allmost all professional software allows to safe in an older file format..

see excel, word, auto cad.. and others..
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H20nly
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by H20nly » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:31 pm

^ Flash, Photoshop, Acrobat, Dreamweaver... since long before the "merger".

BUT most of those programs can also save in other file formats/types too. Live only saves in 1.

Dennis DeSantis
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by Dennis DeSantis » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:38 pm

Ok, ability to save multiple file types is an interesting feature request, and I'll pass it along.

Best,

longjohns
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by longjohns » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:44 pm

*read*

*sigh*

ethios4
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by ethios4 » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:48 pm

Dennis DeSantis wrote:Ok, ability to save multiple file types is an interesting feature request, and I'll pass it along.

Best,
That would also be a great feature for those of us that sometimes collaborate with people using older versions of Live. Don't know how it would work, but simply disabling new features would be a start, or freezing tracks that utilize newer features. Could get complicated.

telekom
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by telekom » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:56 pm

beats me wrote:
jamief wrote:
beats me wrote:Live crashed countless times before my gig so I used it at my gig and it crashed at the gig! Fuck you Ableton!

Sincerely,

Long time experienced PRO touring Live user
So if it crashes all the time,. How do you ever manage to play any gigs ?
I really have no idea who this character is but since you just posted this on here without any background and he's name dropping I'll assume he's been around for awhile and is Somebody.

So how would you gig? Use the previous version that you know is stable. I'll also assume this isn't his first version of Live. If it is then use whatever method you used before. Whatever you do, you don't bring something on stage that has given you countless moments of greif before you hit the stage. That's idiotic.
I think beats me got it right here. In the 70s synthesizers were notorious for not staying in tune. But you couldn't go into the bar after the show and say "Those fucking SHITTY Moogs keep drifting out of tune! RUINED my show!". Because the show wouldn't have happened without the Moogs.

If Kenny had just rolled back to an earlier, WORKING, version of Live, he'd be all set. Plus he probably forgot that he used to have to connect loads of items of gear together with actual cables and make sure they all talked to each other. Now he just rocks up with a box and some software and a BIG WHINY FACE.
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Imaulle
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by Imaulle » Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:20 pm

Braindropz wrote:As someone who spends more time debugging code than actually writing it, my first guess would be there's a memory leak somewhere -- the longer you work, the more RAM that gets 'lost' until everything seizes up. And if it's not a memory leak, it may be a rogue memory write that sometimes hits somewhere important, and sometimes doesn't...
this.

plus, I'll bet any amount of money the people that get a lot of crashes use shitty cracked VSTs too. Honestly I feel Ableton takes the blame way too often.

The only crash I ever had from Ableton was something that many other people got, and it was fixed fairly quick. Ableton Inc FTW!!!

3phase
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by 3phase » Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:32 pm

you fanboys are really disgusting.. i wonder if it wasnt maybe you and your all forgiving attitude that has intoduced the messy state we have now...

in any case you dont get the point.. somebody that fails on stage before a few thousend people because the software crashes has damage for his reputation.. something that maybe dont matters for you because there is not much reputation too loose.. but nevertheless a problem for others.. that actually can effect theire income..


why not roling back to a stabel version?

again..the file format change... live was a trusted software.. you start doing things with L8..you cant roll back..or you have to do it again.. you maybe try.. but there is not much time..the show tomorw.. ..in such case you might end up in a situation wher you go on stage with live 8 ..even when you know that this is most crazy...
but hope dies last...


the last gig i did i was prepared.. L8 crashed.. but the 606 and 303 was still running... just restart and enjoy the astonishing new extended loading times of L8.1..

thanks god a 606 and 303 is good for more than 3 minutes
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Tone Deft
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Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by Tone Deft » Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:34 pm

Braindropz wrote:As someone who spends more time debugging code than actually writing it, my first guess would be there's a memory leak somewhere -- the longer you work, the more RAM that gets 'lost' until everything seizes up. And if it's not a memory leak, it may be a rogue memory write that sometimes hits somewhere important, and sometimes doesn't...
I also do quite a bit of debugging. in my experience while I'm trying to track down a bug I'll speculate with coworkers about what the bug could be. I've noticed that the speculation rarely, if ever leads to the root of a bug. we can't help ourselves but we do it. have you noticed this?

as users we can't help but speculate but I seriously doubt that someone that hasn't seen Live's architecture map let alone have DAW or audio coding experience could pin down what the cause of a bug is.

not that your idea isn't bad, it's just that I doubt users can pin down the root cause of bugs, we can only find them and give Ableton a clear bug report.

my $0.02.
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