Ableton HQ please read

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
telekom
Posts: 1128
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 12:22 pm
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Contact:

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by telekom » Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:43 pm

I think this demonstrates pretty well what has been said here for ages... Ableton users enjoy beta testing BEFORE the new version is released, not AFTER they have paid for it and hope to start using it in "mission critical" situations (ie, onstage). Since my brokepunkass can't afford to buy a new version of Live since 5.2, I'm actually pretty happy with Ableton's performance on my laptop. :) And I don't beta test. But I bet there are plenty of people, Kenny and Jamief included, who want the shizzle to work and don't want to either be a beta tester or have to go onstage wondering if the whole gig is going tits up or not.

But the original point still comes down to NOT going "into the valley" if your gear isn't working. Kenny said something about being a technician in the air force - maximum respect to Kenny for his obvious tech know-how, and of course for the music. But I wouldn't fly a plane that keeps having its engines cut out... If the engine on my plane cut out, I would land it, get out of it, walk away from it, go and change my underwear, call my loved ones and tell them I love them. On no account would I get back in the plane and start flying it again.
MacBook Pro Retina, Live 9.5, Reason, UC33, KRK RP5s, Teenage Engineering OP1, Korg ESX2, Korg Prophecy, Clavia Nord Lead, Bass, Guitars.
http://soundcloud.com/motorradkinophone

loydb
Posts: 178
Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2010 9:28 pm

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by loydb » Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:37 am

Well, when you get 'round to it, it's almost *always* memory related, whether it's array bounds, bad garbage collection, using previously-released memory, off-by-one, etc. :)

I mean, *occasionally* you get a "that function doesn't do what I thought it did" kind of thing, but in my experience the vast majority of non-deterministic errors are cumulative memory leaks -- and dropping a G or two on Purify is cheap at twice the price unless you're paying your coders in patch cables and twinkies.

Plus, the speculation (other than the Purify suggestion) wasn't really meant for the devs anyway -- it was to try and explain to some of the screamers an example of a seemingly-random bug that only appears after cumulative usage, and why they're such a PITA to find and fix.
MFOS Ultimate Expand-o-tron Build Log: http://www.electro-music.com/forum/view ... 797#308797
MFOS Mini-Controller Build Log [FINISHED!]: http://www.electro-music.com/forum/view ... hp?t=42968

Imaulle
Posts: 128
Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:46 pm

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by Imaulle » Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:56 am

Dennis DeSantis wrote:Completely agreed, and we're working on ways to make crash reporting more automatic.
Hey Dennis,

how about adding a much more efficient update system in the 'help' menu. You simply go to help > check for update, and then a new application will launch and check for any updates. if there are any, it will close ableton and download only the new files that have been changed, the main exe, the new engine dll etc etc. not try to download a 1.5 gig file. the update proccess is just a pain, especially for people on the road all the time. imagine trying to update ableton if you were in ibiza for the entire summer. it definitely needs to be reworked...

ethios4
Posts: 5377
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 6:28 am

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by ethios4 » Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:40 am

Ableton definitely made some blunders with v8, no doubt. I think they are doing all they can do though (well, maybe sending an email might have been a good idea for users)....what else is there?

In the meantime, if I were a touring professional with a reputation on the line, I would damn well make sure that I was as protected as possible. I mean, it's illegal to mug someone, but that doesn't mean you walk down some dark alley at 3am. Many pros take the approach of having two computers running at once, that way if one goes down you can flip to the other one. Pitch Black is an example. So, yes Ableton screwed the pooch, but that's no excuse for not taking measures to protect against inevitable computer problems. And I'm not even a pro.

jamief
Posts: 1856
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2002 1:50 pm
Location: Awakend

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by jamief » Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:20 am

Dennis DeSantis wrote:Ok, ability to save multiple file types is an interesting feature request, and I'll pass it along.

Best,
Hi, yes that may be interesting but obviously may be time consuming. The only usefull feature that i can think of is the file format ( and i cant remember the name becasue i havent used it for 7 years) that alllows you to import and export via avid/ protools / logic/ cubase/ nuendo primarily for film scoring. i use to do a fair amount of scoring for fashion shows tv etc etc at one point in my life.

But seriously i think this is not for now but for the future and Dennis thankyou for engaging properely with us - it says a lot- and i still love live and i keep getting deeper and deeper with it each day and that makes my music production simpler to matearilse.
There is nothiung else so simple to use and yet has the ability to be so deep and complex and allow's me to caryy our beautifull automations and writing patterns.

Thanks Ableton

best
J :)

Thanks

jamief
Posts: 1856
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2002 1:50 pm
Location: Awakend

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by jamief » Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:26 am

ethios4 wrote:Ableton definitely made some blunders with v8, no doubt. I think they are doing all they can do though (well, maybe sending an email might have been a good idea for users)....what else is there?

In the meantime, if I were a touring professional with a reputation on the line, I would damn well make sure that I was as protected as possible. I mean, it's illegal to mug someone, but that doesn't mean you walk down some dark alley at 3am. Many pros take the approach of having two computers running at once, that way if one goes down you can flip to the other one. Pitch Black is an example. So, yes Ableton screwed the pooch, but that's no excuse for not taking measures to protect against inevitable computer problems. And I'm not even a pro.
yes i think we will be running 3 laptops. 2 for show 1 back up + cdr ready + ipod ready. Been there before.
But we have a lot of flexibilty built into our live show - and it will sound live - not just a collection of short, mid and extended loops of tracks - but a layout where we can access especially the parameters of vsti,s in way that sound very very close to the way when we had an sh2 via cv and gate from the 303 running and say a moog prodigy running of s trig via a kenton and some midi notes - there was no illution - you could tell that we were playing live stuff anomolies occured and the crowd loved it. It was all imperfect and chance was a big feature of it all.



best
J :)
Last edited by jamief on Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

H20nly
Posts: 15844
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 9:15 pm
Location: The Wild West

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by H20nly » Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:34 am

^ give a shout if you play in San Francisco\Oakland area... I'll check your show out...


I'll buy you a beer too, if you're around afterward.

Cheers

jamief
Posts: 1856
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2002 1:50 pm
Location: Awakend

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by jamief » Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:39 am

H20nly wrote:^ give a shout if you play in San Francisco\Oakland area... I'll check your show out...


I'll buy you a beer too, if you're around afterward.

Cheers
Will keep you posted :)
Peace :)

davepermen
Posts: 2198
Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:38 pm
Location: Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by davepermen » Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:46 am

3phase wrote:you fanboys are really disgusting.. i wonder if it wasnt maybe you and your all forgiving attitude that has intoduced the messy state we have now...

in any case you dont get the point.. somebody that fails on stage before a few thousend people because the software crashes has damage for his reputation.. something that maybe dont matters for you because there is not much reputation too loose.. but nevertheless a problem for others.. that actually can effect theire income..


why not roling back to a stabel version?

again..the file format change... live was a trusted software.. you start doing things with L8..you cant roll back..or you have to do it again.. you maybe try.. but there is not much time..the show tomorw.. ..in such case you might end up in a situation wher you go on stage with live 8 ..even when you know that this is most crazy...
but hope dies last...


the last gig i did i was prepared.. L8 crashed.. but the 606 and 303 was still running... just restart and enjoy the astonishing new extended loading times of L8.1..

thanks god a 606 and 303 is good for more than 3 minutes
you suck and you know it (and yes, it's me again, searching your posts and blaming you to be the failure, and not live.. :))
http://davepermen.net my tiny webpage, including link to bandcamp.

jamief
Posts: 1856
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2002 1:50 pm
Location: Awakend

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by jamief » Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:15 am

jamief wrote:
Dennis DeSantis wrote:Ok, ability to save multiple file types is an interesting feature request, and I'll pass it along.

Best,
Hi, yes that may be interesting but obviously may be time consuming. The only usefull feature that i can think of is the file format ( and i cant remember the name becasue i havent used it for 7 years) that alllows you to import and export via avid/ protools / logic/ cubase/ nuendo primarily for film scoring. i use to do a fair amount of scoring for fashion shows tv etc etc at one point in my life.

But seriously i think this is not for now but for the future and Dennis thankyou for engaging properely with us - it says a lot- and i still love live and i keep getting deeper and deeper with it each day and that makes my music production simpler to matearilse.
There is nothiung else so simple to use and yet has the ability to be so deep and complex and allow's me to caryy our beautifull automations and writing patterns.

Thanks Ableton

best
J :)

Thanks
i remember there called omfi files

best
J

kleine
Posts: 1851
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2001 11:46 am
Location: ableton
Contact:

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by kleine » Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:39 am

It´s OMF - http://www.fileinfo.com/extension/omf

Best,
Christian

Dennis DeSantis
Posts: 670
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2002 3:31 pm
Location: Ableton NYC

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by Dennis DeSantis » Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:46 am

Imaulle wrote:how about adding a much more efficient update system in the 'help' menu.
Yes, we realize these files are larger than users would like. It's being discussed.

Best,

jamief
Posts: 1856
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2002 1:50 pm
Location: Awakend

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by jamief » Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:06 am

kleine wrote:It´s OMF - http://www.fileinfo.com/extension/omf

Best,
Christian
yes its been a while. this would be usefull. Incidently there is some influence for me to adopt a pro-tools rig for the ease of file exchange but i have so far resisted it. For me live has ervything i need including being able to master ( i have no issues with sound quality or summing busses in any shape or form at all) buy omfi file import would be a big bonus and cut out a lot of manual down time.

thanks
:)
i hope you guys are all feeling ok there - there must be a fair amount of pressure at the moment. Stay strong

best
J :)

aizo
Posts: 562
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2008 12:00 am
Location: Osaka

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by aizo » Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:49 am

Suite 8 runs perfect for me. 8.1.1 om an ole black Macbook and on an early 2008 iMac
ImageImage

jamief
Posts: 1856
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2002 1:50 pm
Location: Awakend

Re: Ableton HQ please read

Post by jamief » Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:12 am

aizo wrote:Suite 8 runs perfect for me. 8.1.1 om an ole black Macbook and on an early 2008 iMac
What thirs party plugins do you use ?

Post Reply