Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
d-track
Posts: 640
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2007 9:29 pm

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by d-track » Thu May 06, 2010 12:12 pm

chrk wrote:
d-track wrote:you get an unlimited band (!) compressor and also better eq-s than live has and a more friendly enviorinment for mixing + dither options.
Wouldn' know about the latter, but ReaComp, ReaXcomp and ReaEQ come with the free ReaPlugs-pack. I've never run into any issues using them in Live.
thanks! then fuck reaper! :D
*-*

Contra
Posts: 1263
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 9:59 am
Location: Miami,FL. USA
Contact:

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by Contra » Thu May 06, 2010 1:34 pm

well guess i can't try out those plugins in ableton cuz i;m a mac. 8O

H20nly
Posts: 15844
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 9:15 pm
Location: The Wild West

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by H20nly » Thu May 06, 2010 11:24 pm

Thanks guys. Very nice thread. I've been needing one of these. I'm Lounged out for a bit.

good luck Contra. There's some really good advice in here... 8)

one thing that I don't remember seeing mentioned. you can run your meters high in the red on your tracks (without them actually clipping) as long as you keep your master track under control. that probably won't help too much with what you're getting at here, but if there's an element that you've had to turn other tracks down for, sometimes you can get a little extra boost this way. i'm not sure what you're using in the way of samples/hits but if they're coming from multiple sources this can be a life saver.
LoopStationZebra wrote:it's like a hipster commie pinko manifesto. Rambling. Angry. Nearly divorced from all reality; yet strangely compelling with a ring of truth.

kb420
Posts: 2750
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2006 3:35 am
Location: Cydonia on the 4th Planet

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by kb420 » Thu May 06, 2010 11:57 pm

H20nly wrote:fuck Bitwig.

Contra
Posts: 1263
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 9:59 am
Location: Miami,FL. USA
Contact:

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by Contra » Fri May 07, 2010 4:06 am

H20nly wrote:Thanks guys. Very nice thread. I've been needing one of these. I'm Lounged out for a bit.

good luck Contra. There's some really good advice in here... 8)

one thing that I don't remember seeing mentioned. you can run your meters high in the red on your tracks (without them actually clipping) as long as you keep your master track under control. that probably won't help too much with what you're getting at here, but if there's an element that you've had to turn other tracks down for, sometimes you can get a little extra boost this way. i'm not sure what you're using in the way of samples/hits but if they're coming from multiple sources this can be a life saver.
for the quick mixin, i just now do drums n bass, -9 db. with everything else -6db. then bounce it, then ozone 4 on that bish. POW! lol

Contra
Posts: 1263
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 9:59 am
Location: Miami,FL. USA
Contact:

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by Contra » Fri May 07, 2010 4:17 am

shel! ur a beast!!! bigups on the test!

H20nly
Posts: 15844
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 9:15 pm
Location: The Wild West

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by H20nly » Fri May 07, 2010 4:37 am

cool, but you can push it if need be. got the official word from the abes:

[nis] wrote:
Grappadura wrote:
but what if you just drive the master into red?
This will cause clipping on the DACs of your soundcard / audio interface. The master track or any track which is routed to an external output should never go into the red.

Individual channels which are routed internally can be driven hot, because floating point calculations are not restricted to 0 dB. There's a safety limit at +60 dB, though. Anything beyond +60 dB will clip (in Live).

Best,
Nico

taken from here:

http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=141699

thread turns in to pretty much everyone fucking off after the question is officially answered on the first page (by nis) so you don't have to subject yourself to the rest but its good stuff to know. especially since MIDI doesn't get the "line noise" that audio will.

Peace
LoopStationZebra wrote:it's like a hipster commie pinko manifesto. Rambling. Angry. Nearly divorced from all reality; yet strangely compelling with a ring of truth.

The Carpet Cleaner
Posts: 1128
Joined: Sat May 16, 2009 2:21 pm
Location: Paris

Re: Ableton output is low compared to other DAW's

Post by The Carpet Cleaner » Sun May 09, 2010 4:33 pm

UKRuss wrote:If you really can't afford external mastering and are forced to do it yourself, focus on the mix so that you retain around -3db to -6db headroom, render as a 24bit stereo file.

Import the stereo file into a new live set and use Lives native plugs to 'master' it yourself. Live now has a multiband compressor and EQ8 is pretty transparent anc can work well as a mastering EQ for this type of job. Then bang the limiter on the end of your chain set the ceiling to just under 0db, say -0.1dbfs or -0.2 dbfs and crank the input to get your loudness.

Import one of your favourite pro track into another track in the same set and bypass the mastering chain of FX, set the master meter to read RMS rather than Peak and get a feel for where this typeof track sets on average meter readings. Re-engage your mastering chain and your own track and adjust the limiter to match the RMS area you identified for your genre.

If you can splash out some cash, try a different limiter such as Voxengo's Elephant or T-Racks singles.

There is a deal on at the moment for the shell, metering and classic EQ on T-Racks. The metering is worth the price alone as it has everything you need in one window.

With a tad of practice you can get pretty close to your fav tracks loudness just using the RMS comparison and adecent limiter. If you need to tweak EQs to match you pro track EQ8 will do the trick and for any compression needs on the stereo file, Lives multiband compressor will see you right.

once you're happy, render while dithering to 16bit.
can we do this, but skipping the part when you export the song to get a .wav file ?
Can you just do this in the same Live's project directly without rendering anyting and leaving the master channel level at 0 ?
this is what I've done so far and I wonder if it's "right" .

Post Reply