some music theory questions

[the_antagonist]

1. Writing music in 'C' has advantages in that it seems pretty easy. I am still learning so I try and write in other keys. However, upon listening to Outrospective by Faithless (the album theme was to have all tracks in 'C') I hear that just writing in C still gives an opportunity to express many different emotions. So my question is. Why should I bother practicing any other keys? Should I just master C then move onto D?

2. I may have asked this before. Other than manually changing every note is there a midi effect that can just modulate to the next key? Is that something that people do (either manually or automatically)?


Thank you

[stevedd]

One good reason to learn other keys is to enable you to play with other people. Some instruments - sax, trumpet, etc - are tuned to a given key (Bb; Eb, I think). If you play with singers you'll have to work to their key.

On a less practical level, although C (the white notes on a keyboard) seems to be the easiest key, you might well find other fingerings, while at first seeming more difficult, fit your fingers/brain better.

On your point 2., there are transpose and scale midi effects in Live that will do what you want.

[chapelier fou]

To make it short, consider A and C as basic models. The rest is only transposition.

[UKRuss]

Wasn't it No Roots that was all in the key of C, and Cminor at that not Cmajor? Cminor is defintely not all white keys...

But, Aminor is!

Every major key has what is called its relative minor built off the 6th degree of the relative major scale.

So

Cmajor = CDEFGABC

Aminor therefore is ABCDEFGA

I would say that Aminor, being all white keys is probably more useful to you as a compositional tool. Major keys sound a bit twee more often than not and are rarely used in electronica/dance/rock etc. well, certainly not as common as minor keys.

Another popular guitar key is Eminor, the relative minor of Gmajor, which has only one sharp in it, Fsharp.

So, EF#GABCDE therefore all white keys except one, F#

[simonlb]

I guess writing in C Major / A minor (UKRuss is right - the vast majority of electronic and especially dance music seems to be written in the natural minor keys) makes things a bit easier to a beginner because of the white keys thing. Although really once you understand one key, they're all the same, the difference is just which note you start on, from there it's the same intervals (i.e. 2nd note in the scale is 2 semitones from the root note, 4th note is 5 semitones up, etc.)

Don't get me wrong it's a bit more awkward to play the same melody in F# Major than C Major on a piano, but from a theory point of view it's the same thing, just relatively different if that makes any sense! If you're using the piano roll MIDI editor on Live it's not really any more difficult to write in one key than another, just look at the number of piano keys/horizontal rows between each note.

Note that a lot of this is referring to intervals, i.e. distance between notes, I've always found it helpful to think in terms of intervals as opposed to absolute notes a lot of the time, it gets you out of the mindset of thinking purely in terms of the notes in one particular key. It's similar to how a guitarist will learn the "shape" of a scale so they can then apply it to any key, instead of thinking "the minor scale goes A B C D..."

[the_antagonist]

Note that a lot of this is referring to intervals, i.e. distance between notes, I've always found it helpful to think in terms of intervals as opposed to absolute notes a lot of the time, it gets you out of the mindset of thinking purely in terms of the notes in one particular key.

I see that... good tip.

Wasn't it No Roots that was all in the key of C, and Cminor at that not Cmajor? Cminor is defintely not all white keys...

But, Aminor is!

Every major key has what is called its relative minor built off the 6th degree of the relative major scale.

So

Cmajor = CDEFGABC

Aminor therefore is ABCDEFGA

I would say that Aminor, being all white keys is probably more useful to you as a compositional tool. Major keys sound a bit twee more often than not and are rarely used in electronica/dance/rock etc. well, certainly not as common as minor keys.

Another popular guitar key is Eminor, the relative minor of Gmajor, which has only one sharp in it, Fsharp.

So, EF#GABCDE therefore all white keys except one, F#

No Roots yes.... My thinking is that No Roots is a track on Outrospective, My wife is better with Faithless.

Yes. must be minor. I never thought of that. good thinking.

[mersault]

Even most of the simplest of songs in C major don't exclusive use "white keys". Its not all that simple. ...and unfortunately, there's no simple answer as to "...so then which black keys can I also use". Unless you really want to learn (on whatever level you feel comfortable) music theory, its nearly impossible to get any really quick and useful answers to those sorts of questions - I wouldn't be intimidated though. There are plenty of music theory books/workbooks - with exercises that can be very useful and help you to answer those questions, though a little more slowly.

Obviously, there have been many great songwriters who don't read/write music. They use their ear - and trust their ears! - and trust their gut! ...and most often learn a lot from other peoples' songwriting.

...and if you try to write all of your songs in the same key, they'll become extremely redundant - whether its conscious or subconscious, the average non-musician listener will notice this and feel like it all sounds the same!

[the_antagonist]

Even most of the simplest of songs in C major don't exclusive use "white keys". Its not all that simple. ...and unfortunately, there's no simple answer as to "...so then which black keys can I also use".

I am not really looking for quick answers and I know about the use of black keys when appropriate. I just formulated a question to broaden my understanding and to engage with the ableton forum.

I think I made the same 'C' and 'A minor' misunderstanding a year ago in reference to my Blue Steel track. The explanation given to me at the time for my misunderstanding went a bit over my head but I see now a bit clearer.

[Moody]

Advanced theory would imply that your question is irrelevant.

[evon]

Another point to note is that some of the most common natural vocal pitches are : A, G and C whether Major or Minor. So aside from the falsetto pitches, you may want to bear that in mind when writing.

I would want to believe that G is one of the most natural tenor pitches used in contemporary pop music. I could be wrong.

[Musiclab]

A great way to extend your keyboard skills while in the key of C Major or Am is to look into Scale based or Scale Tone chords. Essentially these are the family of chords that are built off of each note of the chosen scale. It is a recurring pattern based on a group of notes with the same gap or interval in between so when you play them simultaneously they form a chord. In the key of C Major (using all the white keys) you would play the C-E-G combo of notes to form the C Major chord. Shift this one position up to where the starting note is on the D and you have D-F-A which forms D minor. Carry this on for each note of the scale and you have a family group of chords C-Dm-Em-F-G-Am-Bdim. Without going into the theory behind the names of these chords, just think of them as a good match for the single notes of the C Major scale. The two groups like to be played together. To extend your keyboard playing, try writing chord sequences with ONLY these chords and then write melodies using the related scale over the chords. Even better is to try to play the chords with your left hand while jamming the single scale notes with the right an octave or two higher. Making the connection between these two family groups can often be an Ahh Haaa experience for people wanting to get more out of their keyboard playing. Of course, once comfortable with C Major and Amin, move to the Keys of G Major and Emin as it will only introduce 1 black note, the F#.

[bosonHavoc]

Ifrom there it's the same intervals

ahh that was a weird little eye opener thing that i should of thought of..
i mean i know its all intervals and i have been playing bass and guitar for years.. guitar and bass are super easy to transpose keys.. all you need to do is learn the modes and the fingering is the same..

now on piano i've had to realize a few things
.. i just can't learn the modes..but if i ignore white and black, and just focus on the intervals (which i know) it should be a more natural way of looking at it for me... thank you.. gonna try it later..

the other thing that that took me a minute to realize was that my left index finger or my middle finger was my main bass/root fingers on the guitar..
on the piano my main bass/root is my pinky (left hand)... that was a big eye opener when i realized it...

and to the op
if no one has mentioned this yet try viewing scales as pure mathematics.
learn the intervals and what makes a minor or major interval..
music is math and if you happen to have a strong mathematical mind then it may be easier to grasp theory using numbers instead..

[MPGK]

Choosing the right key can make all the difference. Different instruments sound different in different registers.

Actually, before Well temperament introduced by Werckmeister and J.S. Bach, different keys even sounded different by themselves - I'm not going to elaborate on this one, there are plenty reference books and websites.

[evon]

A great way to extend your keyboard skills while in the key of C Major or Am is to look into Scale based or Scale Tone chords. Essentially these are the family of chords that are built off of each note of the chosen scale. It is a recurring pattern based on a group of notes with the same gap or interval in between so when you play them simultaneously they form a chord. In the key of C Major (using all the white keys) you would play the C-E-G combo of notes to form the C Major chord. Shift this one position up to where the starting note is on the D and you have D-F-A which forms D minor. Carry this on for each note of the scale and you have a family group of chords C-Dm-Em-F-G-Am-Bdim. Without going into the theory behind the names of these chords, just think of them as a good match for the single notes of the C Major scale. The two groups like to be played together. To extend your keyboard playing, try writing chord sequences with ONLY these chords and then write melodies using the related scale over the chords. Even better is to try to play the chords with your left hand while jamming the single scale notes with the right an octave or two higher. Making the connection between these two family groups can often be an Ahh Haaa experience for people wanting to get more out of their keyboard playing. Of course, once comfortable with C Major and Amin, move to the Keys of G Major and Emin as it will only introduce 1 black note, the F#.

+1
A great example for jammin is playing two or three of the chords of Cmajor (C Maj Progression) with the left hand while jammin in the relative A Min scale with the right hand. Totaol freedom and extasy, you should give it a try.

[bicarbone]

Choosing the right key can make all the difference. Different instruments sound different in different registers.

This is actually very true. Each key has got its own color and flavour.

Also try to find out about modes: dorian -ie, from D to D in the key of C- and mixolydian -ie, from G to G in the key of C- (yes, nothing but white keys on your keyboard!). Those are great for electronic music.

Try different scales as well (blues, minor harmonic, minor melodic...).

Finally, try to understand some basics of harmony. Thrill awaits!

As someone said, your tracks will eventually sound boring repetitive if they're all in C Major or A minor, no matter how great they are independantly.