analog isn't really doing it for me..

[dum]

You don't learn much about synthesis from ROMplers ...

[polyslax]

You don't learn much about synthesis from ROMplers ...

Quite right. You make tracks.

[dum]

You don't learn much about synthesis from ROMplers ...

Quite right. You make tracks.

the obvious meaningless response I was expecting, but I wasn't sure who'd make it.

You're not necessarily more productive using ROMplers than you are using Synths, that my friend is what's known as a 'fallacy'. For noobs, it's worth noting that synths use these things called 'presets' ... they're awesome. And very educational cos you can see what synth settings make each sound. Making tracks has never been so educational.



Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day....etc

[polyslax]

You don't learn much about synthesis from ROMplers ...

Quite right. You make tracks.

the obvious meaningless response I was expecting, but I wasn't sure who'd make it.

You're not necessarily more productive using ROMplers than you are using Synths, that my friend is what's known as a 'fallacy'. For noobs, it's worth noting that synths use these things called 'presets' ... they're awesome. And very educational cos you can see what synth settings make each sound. Making tracks has never been so educational.



Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day....etc

You're a funny man.

I'll leave it to you to carry on with the lesson... ain't got the time I'm afraid.

[dum]

Lesson number 1: You'll learn nothing about synthesis from ROMplers



he can figure the rest out himself.

[anybody human]

These tutorials were posted on the forum recently, nicely done.
http://www.mrbillstunes.com/services_tu ... _video.php

This one is about separating bass frequencies to build a fuller bass sound. He uses Analog, racks it (Command G) then duplicates the 1st chain. So now he has 2 Analogs in a rack and puts an EQ8 after each, 1 filtering off everything above 250hz, the other cutting everything below 150hz (creating a bump or resonant shelf).
He throws a bunch of effects on the 2nd chain (overdrive, chorus, phaser, super short filter delay for stereo width) so only the high and midrange are being affected. By the end, he's added a 3rd Analog chain w/ a Sine wave for sub bass. This is a common technique which you can do with audio also but I was really impressed with the results and the tutorials.

http://vimeo.com/10480671

[3phase]

A friend of me used yesterday rob papens predator... it sounded pretty good for a plug in...
i was impressed.. And i usually dont consider plug in synths as an option at all... so i am not easy to impress..

[3phase]

isnt it more live that causers itself to crash at any corner?.. my friend was using predator with live actually without crash..... but he is on pc

[jsn]

funken, use the lfo as oscillator to make a sin wave in ACE.

Back to Analog,

Analog (and/or multiple instances of it) makes a warm layered bass just fine. Analog is using physical modelling for sound synthesis. Good to keep in mind when you are using the synth. It is not made to sound like anything before it. This does not insinuate that it is of lesser quality, only that your sound is being generated by real-time calculation which models certain electrical circuitry versus using familiar samples or wavetables for oscillators.

Although Operator is also very much a fun powerful synth packed with potential, I find Analog stands quite deservedly well on its own, due in part to its unique shell. I find myself taking different avenues during sound design with Analog versus when I use a subtractive synthesis algorithm with Operator. While using Analog, and therefore taking different avenues to arriving at an idea in my head, I sometimes happen upon interesting developments that I end up keeping for a patch. For instance, I may feed a certain 'right' percentage of filter 1 into #2 with a certain envelope mod amount that I otherwise would not have done within Operator using the same form of synthesis.

I also very much like Analog's two LFO's and the possibilities that arise with these, as well as use of the formant filters. Do not forget that careful use of the different filter saturation modes can be used to smooth or warm up filter output...or simply add character and presence to one layer of a two-layer sound. Last but definitely not least...both oscillators offer sub oscillators that generate sound one octave under each respective oscillator. This provides nice layering potential, not limited to basses, depending on how high the parent osc is tuned. In the end, both of Ableton's synths are definite additions inside the program and having both of them is not a waste in the least. Don't put it aside too quickly without further experimentation.

It is not always about what synth is 'better' but also about how one arrives at unique or familiar sound within a particular synth. As stated, I feel Analog's special workflow/interface offers a certain advantage during sound design because of certain special elements and the where they appear (not-to-mention the excellent grouping potential).

One other thing to mention, sometimes people judge the synths based on the preset patches available and when they start using the synth for the first time they thumb through to presets to 'get an idea' of what it is capable of... this is NOT a good indication of what a synth is capable of... in the slightest.. always learn your synths/plugins and experiment on your own. Very interesting worlds of sound will surface with prolonged dabbling.

[3phase]

i can understand that someone looks for something else than abletons analoge.. i dont liked the sound...
and that it can achive something when doing complex stacks with fx? that statement apllies to any plug on the market..

[jsn]

3phase, what do you not like about the "sound" if you do not mind explaining in a bit more detail?

[Newecho]

wow guys thanks for all the replies and opinions. i guess i'm just not satisfied with the sounds i'm getting from it, even with chorus/reverb/delay ect. in an effects rack...just looking for something a little phatter and phunkier hah. i wish i had the $ to shell out for a moog but unfortunately a plug in is going to have to be the way to go for me. another noob question (i apologize): would I be able to map massive or sylenth1's paramaters to my apc40? and does recording automation function the same way as it would with ableton's instruments? thank you!

A few links for you.

Controlling VSTs with APC40 - "Video Tutorial: Ableton Live 8 + APC40 + Remote SL Controllerism" - http://www.modulatethis.com/2009/06/vid ... erism.html

Sylenth1 and Massive are pretty great, you should also try the free trials for Tone 2's Gladiator 2, UHE ACE, and if you are new to programming give FAW Circle a look.

A few more related links:
Sound Design with Gladiator 2: HCM Synthesis Explained - http://www.modulatethis.com/2009/05/gla ... orial.html

Future Audio Workshop Releases Circle, A Software Synthesizer that Focuses on Flow and Ease Of Use - http://www.modulatethis.com/2008/06/fut ... io-wo.html

u-he ACE Video Tutorial: Patch Cables 101 - http://www.modulatethis.com/2010/01/u-h ... s-101.html

Mark Mosher
Checkout my new album "I Hear Your Signals" at http://www.MarkMosherMusic.com

[3phase]

3phase, what do you not like about the "sound" if you do not mind explaining in a bit more detail?

jsut sounded boring and week to me.. never would buy it..
same applies to corpus and what was the name of the other thing? also sampler sounds dreadfull.. only good plug they have is operator imo

[mholloway]

Predator causes Live to crash.

I recorded my whole album in Live using Predator about 4-5 instances per song. Probalby more than any other soft-synth I own. Live never crashed due to Predator once. Not sure what's not working for you. But to the OP, don't assume this is true for everyone. Predator has been a glitch-free VST for me and I've made heavy, heavy use of it, always in Live, for over a year now.

-M

[mholloway]

Do not forget that careful use of the different filter saturation modes can be used to smooth or warm up filter output...or simply add character and presence to one layer of a two-layer sound.

god, this is the part I always forget! analog is even more feature-rich than I manage to remember while using it; i repeatedly space out the existence of the filter drive modes, but yes, they can really add some serious grit to sounds when you kick them in.

the signal path of Analog reminds me of the Yamaha CS-80, because of the two-divided channels approach, where you basically take an osc--filter-amp-env-lfo path and then just duplicated every part of it for a second row of goodness right beneath the first.

-M