How to create a U2-like guitar-effect called Shimmer ?

[Borizz]

Hi All,

I have been trying to create the so-called shimmer-effect that the Edge from U2 uses a lot.
The effect sounds like a synthesized orchestra of strings (Note: this is NOT the same as the Icy Shimmer that is described on Nickstutorial.com)
My guitar is connected to the PC using an analog to USB-converter.

I am using Ableton Live Intro, and I suppose it should be possible with the right set-up and settings.
I came to a result that sounds a bit like the desired effect, but it's not really good.
Has perhaps anybody on this forum tried the same, and have you been succesful ?
If so, which set-up did you use, and whcih settings did you appply ?

I tried two configurations:
ONE - first unit: chorus and delay / second unit: another delay, a pitch-shift (used the resonator module) by one octave, output is fed back into unit one / third unit uses output of unit one, and contains a heavy reverb
TWO: - three or four chained units, each containing delay plus pitch-shift and reverb, each sends output to MASTER.

Config ONE goes very easily into heavy oscillation (makes sense, because of the feedback loop), but the sound is closer to the desired result than TWO
Number TWO is easier to control, but the sound is not really what I'm after.

Hope somone can help.

Thx !
Borizz

[The Leveller]

I think you're on the right lines with one, but you also need a parallel dry track, then mix the wet FX line and the dry to taste.

[Borizz]

Thx Leveller,

I wil try yr suggestions.

One of the things I was wondering about is which Ableton module to use for pitch-shifting ?
I have used the resonator (could not find any other device that does it), but I found that the output signal - even when set to 100% wet and max amplification - still contains a lot of the groundwave, and very little pitch shifted output.
Any idead on that one ?

[anybody human]

What about the Grain Delay effect? Is that included in Live Intro? If so maybe try that.

[Borizz]

Thx Anybody Human,

Yes, I have tried that one as well. Is however a somewhat complicated module for this purpose, results were not satisfying.

[anybody human]

Right, it is quite complicated to set up. Try only using the sliders, not dragging multiple parameters with the graph display at first. I'm just guessing it's the closest to the Eventide Harmonizer effect. Is that the effect you're thinking of, from Where the Streets Have No Names?

[anybody human]

Found this forum thread about Grain Delay, FWIW.

http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php? ... w=previous

[rbrown46]

Sean Costello (developer behind Audio Damage's EOS reverb algorithms) recently posted a really thorough and interesting series on this effect:

http://valhalladsp.wordpress.com/2010/0 ... t-is-made/

Check out the posts before and after as well.

AFAIK the closest you can get to an accurate reproduction in software is by using SoundToy's Crystallizer and the new Lexicon reverb plugins, with feedback routing (using sends) between the two, and some EQ and other tweaking between them.

[anybody human]

Yep, Soundtoys Crystallizer would do it. Made by a guy who worked on the Eventide harmonizer.
Thanks for the link, really cool.

[anybody human]

Fantastic link. Thanks so much. So should I be getting a constant feedback loop or is it supposed to be decaying after a bit. Seems fairly playable the way it's decaying, I'm just running a guitar snippet into it. Interested in the 2nd post where he talks about Eno playing a DX7 into it.

[rbrown46]

Fantastic link. Thanks so much. So should I be getting a constant feedback loop or is it supposed to be decaying after a bit. Seems fairly playable the way it's decaying, I'm just running a guitar snippet into it. Interested in the 2nd post where he talks about Eno playing a DX7 into it.

When I've done it I've had it decay by using < 0 dB on the send levels and by EQing (e.g. with a high pass filter). The decay length changes based on those settings. But yeah, I hadn't thought about doing feedback loops like this in Ableton before reading those posts. It opens up a whole new world of possibilities, especially when you start adding FX beyond just reverb, delay and pitch shifting.

[valhalladsp]

In addition to my blog posts in May 2010, I have been working on creating a plugin that allows for the U2 / Eno / Lanois "shimmer" sounds, as well as a bunch of other sounds. I just put up a sound example:

http://valhalladsp.wordpress.com/2010/0 ... ng-plugin/

I should be posting more about the upcoming plugin in the next week or so.

Sean Costello
http://www.valhalladsp.com
http://valhalladsp.wordpress.com

[steko]

Thanks Sean! ValhallaFreqEcho & cool blog! Looking forward to new plugin…

Happy i-Dosing!

[Borizz]

Hi All,
I want to thank you all for your advices, I found a solution that produces the desired shimmer sound.

For those of you who are trying to do the same - here's what I ended up with after a lot of try and error.

Configuration. first unit: delay / second unit: another delay, a pitch-shift (use the grain-delay module) by one octave, then a heavy reverb, output of unit two put is fed back into unit one.
You may consider a third unit (connected to ouput of unit one, with another heavy reverb, but that is not absolutely necessary, and perhaps some chorus.

The critical part is the setting of the grain-delay.
AnybodyHuman put me on the right track here: “Try only using the sliders, not dragging multiple parameters with the graph display at first”. I used the following settings: SPRAY: 0 ms, Frequency: 1 Hz; Pitch 12 ; Rand Pitch: 0, feedback: 50%, DryWet: 50%, Time: 50 ms. This produces a clean one-octave pitch-shift. I also tried to do achieve that result using a resonator-module, but that does not work fine.

When starting up, try to use unit 2 first with output connected to MASTER, no reverb activated yet, only pitch shift, and listen to the result.

Only when this works fine, try closing the feedback loop (by connecting output of unit two into input of unit one). Mind your ears and speakers (!!!), cause you may start with heavy oscillations. If that happens reduce the gain-parameters in both unit one and two until the oscillations die out. Once again listen to this intermediate result, make a short sound on your guitar, and you should hear the pitch shift do it’s repeated work when the short sound travels through the loop over and over, every time shifted to one octave higher.

Once this works fine you can activate the reverb. Now you should hear the shimmer sound (or at least something that comes near).

Experiment with the delay parameters for quicker/slower fade-in and fade-out. Try the decay parameter for sustain. If you find the shimmer too sharp (too much high frequencies), introduce a low-pass or mid-pass equalizer, and the sound will be warmer.

Enjoy!
I certainly did and still do .

If you want to hear an example of the sound, I suggest you watch this video (it’s not me/mine): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOBQBEEh ... re=related . I managed to produce exactly the same sound (and isn't it great ?!), although the sound in this video is produced in a different way: with multiple delays/pitch-shifts/reverbs chained.

My special compliments to Valhalla for his blog and excellent article, which helped me to find config one. You kind of lost me halfway when you started talking about auto-correlation and de-correlation, but it was very helpful anyway!

Regards, Borizz

[franklinvi]

Nice work! I tried to create it, but I'm a bit stuck with the routing. Did you put the 2 delays on seperate tracks or on two send busses? Maybe it's possible to save a demo setup as a Ableton set?