Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Machinesworking
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Location: Seattle

Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by Machinesworking » Fri Sep 10, 2010 1:57 am

dum wrote:
Machinesworking wrote:Also, logic board authorizations can be a pita if your logic board dies, no purely awesome copy protection scheme exists beyond the weakest protection there is, a simple serial number.

seriously ?
I mean, ....seriously ?

What will you come out with next ? "Life can be a pita if you get a brain haemorrhage" ?


Of all the fuckin maintenance scenarios that might thwart a copy-protection scheme, replacing a motherboard/logic board HAS to be the least frequent one.

Kill yourself.
You also seem oblivious to the fact that yes, an error/bug/glitch can de-authorise your machine by simply corrupting the relevant system file. You're oblivious to that fact because it hasn't happened to you. That does not mean it's impossible. Asserting the authorisation system is fine because you haven't encountered that bug yourself = not that clever.
Nope dumb shit, you're implied scenario has to be the least frequent, in fact if it's happened to you and you weren't just using it as a way to argue with somebody, it's the first fucking time I've ever heard of it happening on OSX. I've never had my system hard drive die on me, or PACE corrupt itself, or a dongle go bad, but I've had two logic boards die on me. I sure as fuck have never had my authorizations corrupted in OSX, ever, at least without it being user error. ( Almost deuthorized NI kit by trashing preferences, didn't know they used them for authorization, but putting them back fixed the issue. )

Now stop acting like everyone is out to get you, and come out with how you managed to have your authorization destroyed in OSX, was it hardware or software related?
Otherwise, arguing for a different authorization scheme without doing more than implying why the one in place sucks, is circular.

slicedbread
Posts: 313
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 5:22 pm

Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by slicedbread » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:00 am

this just bit me this week. luckily it was during the week and customer service "granted" me 2 additional unlocks the next day. if it happened on a weekend i had planned to make music i'd be a bit more pissed.

i am however upset that i am at the whim and mercy of the company to install software i purchased. what happens if (heaven forbid) the company goes under? or gets bought by another company who dissolves this product line? or i decide to move to a cave and make beats off the grid?

tying the unlocks to hardware would be better, but still you'd have the same problems. i've upgraded my main pc 3 times in the last year and a half. my music machines are constantly being modded and wiped/reinstalled to trim the fat.

i also understand they have to do something to protect their ip. i just wish it was something that allowed me to install my software without waiting for their intervention and good will to "grant" me an install. maybe an automated number to call to get a unique challenge/response unlock code.

dum
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Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 10:51 pm

Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dum » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:01 am

ShelLuser wrote:Hope you had fun, this is very possibly the last serious comment I'm writing to any of your posts.
Hope I had fun ?
You're the one trolling in here - supposedly for laughs.

Besides, don't make promises you have no intention of keeping.

Before your smug comments in this thread, you had made smug comments in another thread just a day or so ago.... you were suggesting a guy was using a pirated version of ableton live because in his query he said he was using live 7.0.9

You were quick to come to such conclusions, despite the fact his post was from 2008. That sums you up.
Pasha wrote:Thanks dum for being so precise.

dum
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dum » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:09 am

Machinesworking wrote:
dum wrote:
Machinesworking wrote:Also, logic board authorizations can be a pita if your logic board dies, no purely awesome copy protection scheme exists beyond the weakest protection there is, a simple serial number.

seriously ?
I mean, ....seriously ?

What will you come out with next ? "Life can be a pita if you get a brain haemorrhage" ?


Of all the fuckin maintenance scenarios that might thwart a copy-protection scheme, replacing a motherboard/logic board HAS to be the least frequent one.

Kill yourself.
You also seem oblivious to the fact that yes, an error/bug/glitch can de-authorise your machine by simply corrupting the relevant system file. You're oblivious to that fact because it hasn't happened to you. That does not mean it's impossible. Asserting the authorisation system is fine because you haven't encountered that bug yourself = not that clever.
Nope dumb shit, you're implied scenario has to be the least frequent, in fact if it's happened to you and you weren't just using it as a way to argue with somebody, it's the first fucking time I've ever heard of it happening on OSX. I've never had my system hard drive die on me, or PACE corrupt itself, or a dongle go bad, but I've had two logic boards die on me. I sure as fuck have never had my authorizations corrupted in OSX, ever, at least without it being user error. ( Almost deuthorized NI kit by trashing preferences, didn't know they used them for authorization, but putting them back fixed the issue. )

Now stop acting like everyone is out to get you, and come out with how you managed to have your authorization destroyed in OSX, was it hardware or software related?
Otherwise, arguing for a different authorization scheme without doing more than implying why the one in place sucks, is circular.
Picking quotes out of context ?
That quote was in response to this:
mihai wrote:i've actually never had authorization issues with ableton live. i'm on v. 7 and i've gone through hdd and os changes on the same computer and never an issue, once it authorized it authorized. of course i've had to authorize after each change but only once and i have done so online.
You're implying I'm making comments for the sake of arguing now ? Just because I called you out for making a tedious, inane comment regarding motherboards ? Motherboards needing replacement is the least frequent maintenance scenario. Period. You want to start insinuating user error if my authorisation corrupted ? The same insinuation can be made about your logic boards, learn to look after your laptops dipshit.

Leave the discussion, you've deposited your nuggets of wisdom. at this stage even tone deft is less of a douche.
Pasha wrote:Thanks dum for being so precise.

dazzer
Posts: 1240
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2005 10:24 am

Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dazzer » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:12 am

Yeah, I can see how the system sucks.

However, what I did when I was emailed to tell me that I had run out of unlocks was write to them before I needed the future unlocks to get them set up, so that means (I guess) that I'm not gonna run out and be left in the lurch.

(hobbyist here)

dum
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dum » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:18 am

slicedbread wrote:this just bit me this week. luckily it was during the week and customer service "granted" me 2 additional unlocks the next day. if it happened on a weekend i had planned to make music i'd be a bit more pissed.

i am however upset that i am at the whim and mercy of the company to install software i purchased. what happens if (heaven forbid) the company goes under? or gets bought by another company who dissolves this product line? or i decide to move to a cave and make beats off the grid?

tying the unlocks to hardware would be better, but still you'd have the same problems. i've upgraded my main pc 3 times in the last year and a half. my music machines are constantly being modded and wiped/reinstalled to trim the fat.

i also understand they have to do something to protect their ip. i just wish it was something that allowed me to install my software without waiting for their intervention and good will to "grant" me an install. maybe an automated number to call to get a unique challenge/response unlock code.

I'm noticing a distinct pattern here.

People who have experienced this, agree.

Even with hardware related unlocks, we will find ourselves in the position where we're begging for another unlock - sure. My point in that regard is they will be less frequent.

Besides that, the german business hours + weekends off situation is a piss-poor one when it comes to needing an unlock. At the very, very least we should be able to beg for an unlock 7 days a week, 12 hours a day - minimum. And those requests should be handled promptly.

Not replying ? at all ? for an entire business day ? and longer ? ... weak.

And yes, I also take issue with how they word issuing another unlock as making an 'exception'... like they're doing you a favour :roll:
Pasha wrote:Thanks dum for being so precise.

dum
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dum » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:20 am

dazzer wrote:Yeah, I can see how the system sucks.

However, what I did when I was emailed to tell me that I had run out of unlocks was write to them before I needed the future unlocks to get them set up, so that means (I guess) that I'm not gonna run out and be left in the lurch.

(hobbyist here)
I like you,
and ya, given the current system as it stands... begging in advance is a good idea and I will do just that.

Cheers
Pasha wrote:Thanks dum for being so precise.

ShelLuser
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by ShelLuser » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:27 am

dum wrote:Before your smug comments in this thread, you had made smug comments in another thread just a day or so ago.... you were suggesting a guy was using a pirated version of ableton live because in his query he said he was using live 7.0.9
Ooooh, the one you forget in your previous answer to me when you wondered "huh?" ?

rofl :mrgreen:

It is amazing how easily trolls allow themselves to be trolled and thus by doing so reveal information they tried to keep hidden earlier 8)

Oh well, got a new quote for you:

Thanks dum for making up my mind about you :)

*ploink*
With kind regards,

Peter

Using the 'Power' Trio: Live 10 Suite (+ Push & Max 8 ), Reason 10 and Maschine Mk3 (+ the ultimate Komplete 12).
Blog: SynthFan (under heavy construction!)

dum
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dum » Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:31 am

I have absolutely no idea what you're on about.
Pasha wrote:Thanks dum for being so precise.

Machinesworking
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Location: Seattle

Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by Machinesworking » Fri Sep 10, 2010 4:38 am

dum wrote: You're implying I'm making comments for the sake of arguing now ? Just because I called you out for making a tedious, inane comment regarding motherboards ? Motherboards needing replacement is the least frequent maintenance scenario Period.
Who fucking cares if it's the least frequent maintenance scenario, it's not the least frequent reason authorizations fail, that would be system corruption, but again, you won't go into detail about how that happened to you...
You want to start insinuating user error if my authorisation corrupted ?

Not at all, I don't doubt that you can maintain your computer. Curious as to why/how it happened though.
The same insinuation can be made about your logic boards, learn to look after your laptops dipshit.
Retarded childish comment, normally I don't bother replying when you froth, but that's stupid on too many levels. Good job.
You're quite aware I know how to take care of my laptops, you're reaching.
Leave the discussion, you've deposited your nuggets of wisdom. at this stage even tone deft is less of a douche.
Good luck with that sort of grandiose proclamations on the interwebs, I'm sure it'll serve you well. Especially on a relatively unmoderated public forum.
Seriously who the fuck cares if you think I'm a douche? Generally I think you're a pretty bright character, but if there was one thing about you that could use some work it's your retardedly explosive temper, calm the fuck down, not everyone is out to get you. What sets you off isn't even rational half the time, so why would I care?
Pussy move to agree with another user about getting advance unlocks when he's just repeating what I stated earlier. :roll:

For the record, no, I don't think Ableton's Authorization scheme is the worst, not the best, not the worst, and no, I'm not a huge fan of logic board authorizations for the reasons I mentioned. Getting mad at people trolling your thread is one thing, getting violently upset at people who don't agree with you is childish.

dazzer
Posts: 1240
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2005 10:24 am

Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dazzer » Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:14 am

Machinesworking wrote: Pussy move to agree with another user about getting advance unlocks when he's just repeating what I stated earlier. :roll:
"Repeating" implies that I read what you wrote, which I didn't, sorry 'bout that.

mihai
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by mihai » Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:12 am

dum is also dazzer. did not know that.

rikki
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Location: Scotland

Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by rikki » Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:58 am

I have never had a problem with either on or offline authorisation. I work at a college and have over 20 machines and auth codes to deal with. Unlocking has never been a problem, I have found it to be swift and effective. As for my personal account I have also had no problems and have found (as stated) the process to be more than generous concidering how often I upgraded my computer/laptop in the past few years.

As for out of work hours, I can understand this can be an inconvenience. It has however not stopped me gigging/teaching/etc as there are always demo copies to fall back on if this problem arises (the fully functioning demo has saved my skin a few times at gigs)

recap - works for me

/rik
'the truly wise man does not play leapfrog with the unicorn'

crumhorn
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by crumhorn » Fri Sep 10, 2010 8:16 am

The Only problem with Lives authorization is the inability to get a new unlock during evening and weekends. Surely this is something they could give priority too.

Any system would be broken if the file where it stores it's authorization codes gets corrupted. If Live trashes it's own file then that is a bug and needs reporting as such.

Try a Synthogy plugin sometime. I need 3 different unlock codes depending on what combination of wired and wireless networking I have enabled. Now that is crap.
"The banjo is the perfect instrument for the antisocial."

(Allow me to plug my guitar scale visualiser thingy - www.fretlearner.com)

dum
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Re: Abletons Unprofessional Authorisation system-Online/Offline

Post by dum » Fri Sep 10, 2010 8:58 am

rikki wrote:I have never had a problem with either on or offline authorisation. I work at a college and have over 20 machines and auth codes to deal with. Unlocking has never been a problem, I have found it to be swift and effective. As for my personal account I have also had no problems and have found (as stated) the process to be more than generous concidering how often I upgraded my computer/laptop in the past few years.

As for out of work hours, I can understand this can be an inconvenience. It has however not stopped me gigging/teaching/etc as there are always demo copies to fall back on if this problem arises (the fully functioning demo has saved my skin a few times at gigs)

recap - works for me

/rik
if you've used offline authorisation, like me, maybe you can shed some light on whether the offline challenge code is the same after, say, re-installing an OS or changing a HDD

Unlocking isn't a problem when you've got unlocks to use, never claimed otherwise. The unlocks are wasted too easily though, and their manual request system leaves alot to be desired. You said as much, but it's much more than an inconvenience - that's a very favourable way of putting it.

I see you define generosity as giving you unlocks for new machines as you upgrade them. Sure, unlocks for new machines is grand. But their system can burn through unlocks unnecessarily on the same machine. There is a much better method out there. (motherboard)

I know about demo mode, that's fine for gigging with an existing set. Surely you realise there are production scenarios that running in demo mode won't help.
Pasha wrote:Thanks dum for being so precise.

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