Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

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BoddAH
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Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by BoddAH » Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:52 pm

Easy question. I’m currently using Line 6 PodFarm and I’m quite happy with it. But still, for the price I’d consider something better. There is is quite a lot competition and of course everybody will tell you he’s the best (Line 6 PodFarm, NI Guitar Rig, Logic Pro guitar Amp Designer, etc.)

What’s your opinion? Are they all more or less the same or is there a real difference in quality? :)

agent314
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by agent314 » Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:38 pm

I've only used Guitar Rig 4, but I love it. Absolutely worth the money.

smaucher
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by smaucher » Fri Sep 17, 2010 1:32 pm

+1 on GR4
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razorblade
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by razorblade » Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:12 pm

Line 6 has a new set of 13 HD models coming out, and Rich Renkin implied that they would be available in Pod Farm...There is a thread on TGP that even had pictures of the actual amps they modeled.

Early buzz is comparing them to Eleven/Axe FX level quality, but who knows? Suppose to be anounncing them in the next couple of weeks.

I wouldn't do anything before then.
No...I am 3phase!

n8tron
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by n8tron » Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:19 pm

I have Pod Farm, Guitar Rig, and Eleven.

Obviously Eleven is Pro Tools only so forget about it, besides, while it does sound very good, it doesn't include effects without the eleven rack which I think really cripples it as a plugin.

I have Guitar Rig 4 because it came with Komplete. I don't like it. I don't like the sound, I don't like the way you use it. I like clean sounds, and to get a good clean sound without sounding weak and straight through a preamp is difficult for these amp modelers. I just haven't been able to do it with Guitar Rig.

Pod Farm simply gets me the results quickly and they sound great to me. I've started to really integrate it as my entire guitar sound. I now have a pod xt live, so I can work on the plugin composing and then transfer the sound patches to the unit, rework them if needed and have a stand alone unit to gig with. The other modeling companies don't have this solution. Well, they have a solution of foot controllers attached to a computer with software but I don't want a computer that could crash on stage with me, and I'd have to buy a laptop anyway.

Logic Amp designer doesn't compare to any of these in my opinion.

Check out amplitube though. I have never used it, but some say its the best sounding of the bunch. I have no bias towards it or against it, but if I wasn't already entrenched in Line6 and happy with it, I'd have looked at it. Which bring me to a final point... you said you are quite happy with PodFarm. So why waste your money and change? And your final question... While I said I didn't like Guitar Rig and I do like PodFarm, its not necessarily because of quality differences, its just because they sound different, and I simply can get the sound that I have in my head quickly and most accurately with PodFarm. When I dial in even the same amp settings in Guitar Rig it just doesn't come out right. Not bad, but just not what I wanted.

BoddAH
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by BoddAH » Fri Sep 17, 2010 5:37 pm

n8tron wrote:I have Pod Farm, Guitar Rig, and Eleven.

Obviously Eleven is Pro Tools only so forget about it, besides, while it does sound very good, it doesn't include effects without the eleven rack which I think really cripples it as a plugin.

I have Guitar Rig 4 because it came with Komplete. I don't like it. I don't like the sound, I don't like the way you use it. I like clean sounds, and to get a good clean sound without sounding weak and straight through a preamp is difficult for these amp modelers. I just haven't been able to do it with Guitar Rig.

Pod Farm simply gets me the results quickly and they sound great to me. I've started to really integrate it as my entire guitar sound. I now have a pod xt live, so I can work on the plugin composing and then transfer the sound patches to the unit, rework them if needed and have a stand alone unit to gig with. The other modeling companies don't have this solution. Well, they have a solution of foot controllers attached to a computer with software but I don't want a computer that could crash on stage with me, and I'd have to buy a laptop anyway.

Logic Amp designer doesn't compare to any of these in my opinion.

Check out amplitube though. I have never used it, but some say its the best sounding of the bunch. I have no bias towards it or against it, but if I wasn't already entrenched in Line6 and happy with it, I'd have looked at it. Which bring me to a final point... you said you are quite happy with PodFarm. So why waste your money and change? And your final question... While I said I didn't like Guitar Rig and I do like PodFarm, its not necessarily because of quality differences, its just because they sound different, and I simply can get the sound that I have in my head quickly and most accurately with PodFarm. When I dial in even the same amp settings in Guitar Rig it just doesn't come out right. Not bad, but just not what I wanted.
Thanks for all the feedback; I guess I’ll stick with PodFarm for a while and will try out Guitar Rig once I get my hands on Komplete. :mrgreen:

What I don’t like about PodFarm is the kind of “amateurish” feel it has. Hundreds of useless presets that sound terrible and bloat the software/take ages to load, a shiny but un-ergonomic interface and an installation/update process that reminds me of Windows 95 days.

But sound wise as I said I was happy with it indeed. It does the job but so does probably any other guitar amp software. It sounds OK but I wouldn’t say I’m blown away by the sound (then again, no plug-in will probably be able to achieve the sound and feel of a real tube amp through headphones/studio monitors, in large part due to the air moved by the cab and the inevitable delay), as I said I only tried PodFarm. :D

I also own a Vox ToneLab ST multi-effect pedal along with my PocketPod and I like the Vox modeling much better which leaves me relatively unimpressed with Line 6. I was just curious if maybe there’s something much better out there in the world of software amp modeling.

clipperer
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by clipperer » Fri Sep 17, 2010 7:55 pm

voxengo boogex

UKRuss
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by UKRuss » Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:26 pm

I think they all have their pros and cons but I like the way that NI have now developed add-ons for Guitar Rig 4. So we now have, if its your kind of thing, the Rammfire amp modelled in conjunction with the fella from Rammstein and a convolution reverb which is excellent. These can be bought separately so the choice is there if you want to add bits in.

So, this suggests to me they might continue to develop new FX and signature amp sims for example and those can be purchased separately.

The flexibility with the control room micing is really very nice in GR now too. You take your time, you can get some lovely sounds both clean and dirdy.

Its fun fiddling anyway but for me its the best all-rounder.

I do disagree with the clean sounds being difficult. If anything I've found the opposite to be true...its excels at clean but the dirdy is too digital. The Coolplex amp is outstanding for those clean sounds and in conjunction with the new convo reverb sounds amazing to my ears.

ark
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by ark » Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:38 pm

If you're a Live user, Guitar Rig has a nice bonus: You can use the "Rig Kontrol" controller to control Live. The hardware comes with an application that lets you assign MIDI signals to the expression pedal and buttons, which means that you can use those signals to control Live when you're not using it to control Guitar Rig. In fact, you can switch back and forth between the two modes.

Also, you can use the Rig Kontrol pedal as an audio interface: Plug your guitar or whatever into it, plug its outputs into your PA, use Guitar Rig as a VST plugin within Live, and you're good to go.

n8tron
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by n8tron » Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:46 pm

BoddAH wrote: What I don’t like about PodFarm is the kind of “amateurish” feel it has. Hundreds of useless presets that sound terrible and bloat the software/take ages to load, a shiny but un-ergonomic interface and an installation/update process that reminds me of Windows 95 days.
I'd agree with you here. In fact I often like to use gearbox with my podxt attached because I think the interface is easier to use. For example... if I select an amp in it it appears immediatly, it doesn't scroll through half the amps just to get to it. Granted I'm still on podfarm 1, so I don't know if 2.0 has changed this sort of stuff.

But, I've been using Line6 amps for a long time and I know which ones I like. Fact is I use 3 or 4 amps with 3 or 4 cab combinations for 99% of the sounds. Basically because I know these amps in real life and know how to get the sound I want from them. Just because they give you a ridiculous amount of amps doesn't mean you have to use them all! I've found this way of thinking helped me get a better sound with the few amps that I know.

Tone Deft
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by Tone Deft » Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:48 pm

ignore advice from people that have only tried one device. you'll find fanboys for every device, this topic never ends.

personally I get all my guitar tone outside the computer.
1 - when I want to play I don't need to deal with a @#$%^&ing computer
2 - when Live is all stressed from running many tracks my tone won't crackle nor do I need to up the latency to lower the CPU load.
3 - zero latency.

unless you're using a traditional amp there's work that goes into setting up the tones for any amp sim, IMO there's a LOT of variation in user error or user win when it comes to amp sim tone.

I use a Pod XT, nice integration in the computer when it comes to tweaking tones and downloading new tones. I didn't like Guitar Rig's or Amplitube's sound. friends' whose ears I respect disagree, so it goes. it also depends on which amp packs you buy.
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Machinesworking
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by Machinesworking » Fri Sep 17, 2010 9:07 pm

ark wrote:If you're a Live user, Guitar Rig has a nice bonus: You can use the "Rig Kontrol" controller to control Live. The hardware comes with an application that lets you assign MIDI signals to the expression pedal and buttons, which means that you can use those signals to control Live when you're not using it to control Guitar Rig. In fact, you can switch back and forth between the two modes.

Also, you can use the Rig Kontrol pedal as an audio interface: Plug your guitar or whatever into it, plug its outputs into your PA, use Guitar Rig as a VST plugin within Live, and you're good to go.
Just to note, only Rig Kontrol 3 hardware works as a MIDI controller, I have Rig Kontrol 2 and because of that I'm stuck using an FCB101 for Live.

Fizmarble
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by Fizmarble » Fri Sep 17, 2010 10:40 pm

n8tron wrote:I have Pod Farm, Guitar Rig, and Eleven.

Obviously Eleven is Pro Tools only so forget about it, besides, while it does sound very good, it doesn't include effects without the eleven rack which I think really cripples it as a plugin.

I have Guitar Rig 4 because it came with Komplete. I don't like it. I don't like the sound, I don't like the way you use it. I like clean sounds, and to get a good clean sound without sounding weak and straight through a preamp is difficult for these amp modelers. I just haven't been able to do it with Guitar Rig.

Pod Farm simply gets me the results quickly and they sound great to me. I've started to really integrate it as my entire guitar sound. I now have a pod xt live, so I can work on the plugin composing and then transfer the sound patches to the unit, rework them if needed and have a stand alone unit to gig with. The other modeling companies don't have this solution. Well, they have a solution of foot controllers attached to a computer with software but I don't want a computer that could crash on stage with me, and I'd have to buy a laptop anyway.

Logic Amp designer doesn't compare to any of these in my opinion.

Check out amplitube though. I have never used it, but some say its the best sounding of the bunch. I have no bias towards it or against it, but if I wasn't already entrenched in Line6 and happy with it, I'd have looked at it. Which bring me to a final point... you said you are quite happy with PodFarm. So why waste your money and change? And your final question... While I said I didn't like Guitar Rig and I do like PodFarm, its not necessarily because of quality differences, its just because they sound different, and I simply can get the sound that I have in my head quickly and most accurately with PodFarm. When I dial in even the same amp settings in Guitar Rig it just doesn't come out right. Not bad, but just not what I wanted.
I had not heard a good "clean" guitar sound out of an amp until I played through a Roland JC-120. My philosophy was, if you had good clean sound, than your distorted or otherwise effected sound would be of the highest quality. I couldn't afford to keep that precious JC-120, but it is modeled most accurately in GR4, and is the base amp for nearly all of my sounds. I can relate to not liking the clean tones in GR, probably because they model their respective amps with some accuracy, but since the Roland is modeled in GR, I have found my final resting place.
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n8tron
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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by n8tron » Sat Sep 18, 2010 12:32 am

Fizmarble wrote: I had not heard a good "clean" guitar sound out of an amp until I played through a Roland JC-120. My philosophy was, if you had good clean sound, than your distorted or otherwise effected sound would be of the highest quality. I couldn't afford to keep that precious JC-120, but it is modeled most accurately in GR4, and is the base amp for nearly all of my sounds. I can relate to not liking the clean tones in GR, probably because they model their respective amps with some accuracy, but since the Roland is modeled in GR, I have found my final resting place.

Thanks for the tip! I'll check out their model of the JC-120 next time I'm playing around with guitar sounds. I definitely agree about your philosophy of getting a good clean sound and a distorted sound will follow. I feel like the distortion hides the digital-ness of the model. Though there are plenty of distortion connoisseurs that will disagree! Since most of my sound is clean or slightly overdriven that's what I worry about.

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Re: Guitar modeling plug-in tiers

Post by Simbosan » Sat Sep 18, 2010 5:44 am

+! Guitar Rig, I don't play live, but if I did I would buy an amp... Line6 is ok, but it's farty at the bottom end. I find amp sims fail at the bottom end rather than the top

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