Logic vs Live

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
slirak
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Logic vs Live

Post by slirak » Wed Sep 29, 2010 9:58 pm

I've used several different sequencers and DAW's since I started out with Dr T's KCS on the Atari, slaved to a reel-to-reel.
I've been using Live since v 4 though and it's been my only DAW since v 5.

I love Live, but all the issues with L8 have made me have a serious look at alternatives, especially Logic.
Now Live is the only computer program I've ever thoroughly enjoyed using for the sake of using it, not only for the outcome. Logic on the other hand is dead boring. Much to my surprise, I've found this to be a strong argument for Logic.

Thing is, with Live, tweaking any goddam parameter is loads of fun and I get completely lost in it. The only thing I do when I fire up Logic is - music... There's simply no 'fun element' to divert my attention. And I must say I'm really weary of the everlasting issues with L8. I can't even use the current version with my audio interface (known issue apparently) and I must say Ableton's support haven't been very helpful.

So now I'm thinking, maybe I should switch to Logic.

So, you folks out there who use Logic, what are its weakest points, compared to Live? (Obvious differences, like the UI, workflow and Session View aside.)

Come on, talk me out of it!

H20nly
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by H20nly » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:07 pm

slirak wrote:I must say I'm really weary of the everlasting issues with L8. I can't even use the current version with my audio interface (known issue apparently)
you need more than this?

you did mention that actually making music is a plus, right?
Last edited by H20nly on Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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mihai
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by mihai » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:08 pm

slirak wrote:Come on, talk me out of it!
get a new audio interface instead of spending the cash on logic.

H20nly
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by H20nly » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:10 pm

slirak wrote:The only thing I do when I fire up Logic is - music... There's simply no 'fun element' to divert my attention.
LoopStationZebra wrote:it's like a hipster commie pinko manifesto. Rambling. Angry. Nearly divorced from all reality; yet strangely compelling with a ring of truth.

slirak
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by slirak » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:15 pm

mihai wrote:
slirak wrote:Come on, talk me out of it!
get a new audio interface instead of spending the cash on logic.
Logic (Express) is actually cheaper than getting a new interface...

slirak
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by slirak » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:15 pm

H20nly wrote:
slirak wrote:The only thing I do when I fire up Logic is - music... There's simply no 'fun element' to divert my attention.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8

glitchrock-buddha
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by glitchrock-buddha » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:18 pm

You can get Logic so cheap, I'd say get it and keep Live. You don't get that much for used Live anyways.

And seriously, at some point you will regret ditching Live, don't do it. But you had valid points for wanting to explore Logic. But that fun factor of Live that you talk about is good enough reason to keep it. Then you have the option of both, which brings out different workflows in you. Logic is great, but I hardly find time to use it because I use Live mainly. I went the other way, Logic to Live, and I haven't been able to bring myself to ditch Logic.
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3phase
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by 3phase » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:25 pm

the first thing is that logic is totally boring... ther is no fun involved exept you start to work with the track automation ob fx parameters.. with a faderbox with motorfaders that can be quite some fun to ride all the parameters in realtime and beeing quickly able to edit them..

lots of people think that it soudns better..while this is true for cubase i am not sure about logic.. btw.. the new cubase is pretty good too...

minus points of logic? complikated setup ..as more keycoomands you assign and use and as more locked screen presets and editors you have as better the workflow..but you need lots of time to settle in..

and clock out to external machines is shifting the startcommand when doing a recording.. what is an age old bug they never fix.. for me the strongest point that speaks for live ..that is not espacially good regarding syncing aswell..but at least places the start command wright and has the ability to have dfferent offsets on differenr midi interfaces...

but ..logic repais with a higher precission of the timeallignment of recordings and latency free midi thru..

so the mess logic has with the start command live has with the placement of the midi data..and sometimes with the audio data aswell.. in general live behaves more glitchy than logic..

than the price..logic is much more expensiv than live.. ok..you pay less money but initially logic was a 2k software and is equipped like one.. that apple has viciously dropped the prices so badly dont makes a difference ..logic is more expensivbuild with an excessiv amounts of details and key functions and user prefferences..

lots of halway hidden functions.. its actually possible to do similar things as with live by haveing special realtime folders..
now with the new stretch feature ... but its quite some work to establish such a folder track..with life you just press on the button..done..

so live is defently quicker to get some clips recorded and alligned to each other.. this defently helps and can allow more musical ideas to be tried out..

for the fial production logic shows its strength again with mutiple arrange versions you easily can copy paste in between and the pretty nice track automation for mix down..

so.. its not really a question to decide for the one or the other, they complement each other pretty well..
In early production stages live wins..as it wins on stage.. for late production stages logic offers higher precission and better arrange and mixdown infrastrukture.

when you do a lot with midi logic wins in the preproduction aswell. Its just so limiting to be in one arrange window all the time..

life is defently better to try out 5 different things without even switching one window...

when you like to try things life is pretty unbeatable.. when you wnt to concentrate on one arrangement and work it all out logic is probably better..

lets say.. logic is a studio tool.. one you use to serve customers ..

live is a stage tool..one you use to jam around and play with your things..
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Sage
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by Sage » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:47 pm

For all the issues mentioned on here about Live, there's just as many with Logic, it's by no means any more stable. At the moment I've got playback issues with Logic and it's far more annoying than the occasional crash with Live (Which Logic does as well).

Still have Logic around for things I can't do with Live or not too easily, also, others I work with use Logic, so it makes life a bit easier.

CR78
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by CR78 » Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:53 pm

You should also look at Presonus's Studio One or Reaper.

They both don't have as many Instruments/FX as Logic but they are both damn stable.

I create in Live and then mix in Studio One.

Tarekith
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by Tarekith » Wed Sep 29, 2010 11:28 pm

Studio One is a great app, I was on the beta-team for that, very impressed.

3phase
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by 3phase » Wed Sep 29, 2010 11:43 pm

Sage wrote:For all the issues mentioned on here about Live, there's just as many with Logic, it's by no means any more stable. At the moment I've got playback issues with Logic and it's far more annoying than the occasional crash with Live (Which Logic does as well).

Still have Logic around for things I can't do with Live or not too easily, also, others I work with use Logic, so it makes life a bit easier.
i am using logic since the end of 1994 and count the crashes on one hand..but that is just because i moved to live when logic started to get messy.. live so very limited but so very stable for the biggest part of the time its on the market.. feature limitation and implementation was rather the border than one had problems with, but it never crashed..what is damn wright this way for a software intended for stage use.

i hope that ableton will hold this speciality high and cares about it..because than live will have a place in any electronic working musicans setup, regardless wether its the best daw for that person or not.

therefor stability is from much higher importance for ableton than anything else. stability of operation..in all regards.

maybe once the have a special live stage version ;-) extremly slimmed down.. fast loading times..and optimized for paralell opened instances.. so you have one instance per track and seemlessly switch and fade between them... ultrastable with superior wireless sync.. whoaaa.. that will be fun :P
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CR78
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by CR78 » Wed Sep 29, 2010 11:51 pm

Tarekith wrote:Studio One is a great app, I was on the beta-team for that, very impressed.
That's cool to hear. I just love how they laid out the workflow; super smooth and well thought out.Again, damn stable.

Do you use it now? I know you are/have been a Logic user.
As an aside, you've got to be excited about the just released Wavelab for OSX. Although you're probably still content with Wave Editor(Hell of alot less expensive).

Sorry to the OP for the slight OT.;)

33tetragammon
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by 33tetragammon » Wed Sep 29, 2010 11:56 pm

-Logic has no instrument/fx racks like Live,unless you're willing to spend time with Logic's environment.
-if you're using 3rd-party groove or sequencer plugins like Maschine to sequence other plugins,walk on by.AU's cannot pass on midi.

-biggest gripe imo is that there's NO DEMO of the damn software.sure,you can try it out in a store,but it's not the same as taking your sweet time to get to know what you're interested in.TOTAL FAIL!

it really depends on what you want to do :
-do you want to do everything on a performance basis,then i'd say stick with Live.learn,learn,learn.know your S&%t!!!!!
after that,if you feel you still miss something,look further.

i own both,i barely use Logic other than for mixing/mastering projects(combined with Wave Editor)for other musicians,and the occasional Flextime edits for sounddesign.
mixing in Logic is more refined,and has better visual feedback with different automation colours,automation curves etc.
but everything i myself create in Live gets mixed in Live,and mastered in Wave Editor.
i don't even bother to make music with Logic,boring as hell imo.internal plugins are pretty good,but nothing that can't be done with Live's additional plugins/3rd party ones.

nylarch
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Re: Logic vs Live

Post by nylarch » Thu Sep 30, 2010 1:12 am

Logic has crashed more than Live for me lately and doesn't recover as well from a crash....

I still like it though. I find Live's arrange page a little drab and blurry and like the look, the key commands, zooming, etc. in Logic. Logic's instruments are underrated as well IMO. Logic sounds great, Live is more fun to start ideas, play with rack macros, etc....

Wow those were sensible, informative posts by 3phase - I thought he just did rants.
MacBook Pro; Live 8 Suite, Reaktor; '77 Fender Jazz Bass; Apogee One;

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