How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

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Manestra
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How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Manestra » Fri Dec 10, 2010 2:48 pm

Hi

For my DJ/Live-setup I want to hav on each channel a compressor for being able to sidechain it with any other channel.
Now I made a rack with the compressor in it - mapped the trashhold, output, frequency to a knob on the APC40 - no problem.

But what I want to be able is to change the input channel for the sidechain signal also with a knob - so that I don't need to use the trackpad or mouse when I switch from input-channel 1 to 3 f.e.

Problem: it's a drop-down menu, not a scale - so it's not mapable to a knob on the APC.

Any ideas how to solve that?

oddstep
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by oddstep » Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:15 am

This is only the beginning of an idea. Try using a return as the sidechain audio and use some sort of midi mapping to control the audio that it being sent to that return. Its the some sort of midi mapping bit i can't work out. Maybe a set of buttons that switch sends on and off.

dancing Ray
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by dancing Ray » Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:53 am

This should work:

create a "dummy track" for each channel, set monitor to "in"

create an empty effect rack for each dummy track

set different chain ranges on each rack and map every chain selector to the same knob

group the dummy tracks and set group output to "sends only"

choose the group track as your sidechain input
Spiralgroove wrote:a little quantization never hurt nobody

Manestra
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Manestra » Sat Dec 11, 2010 1:11 pm

when I understand it right, than will I change the input than on the dummy track and not on each channel?

but means also: I have than just 1 sidechain signal I can use - not 2 signals parallel.

I will not be able to have f.e. on channel 1 the signal of channel2 and on channel 3 the signal of channel 4.

I want to be able to have several sidechainsignals on the different channels because it should not just be the main kickdrum-ducker only. For that I just use than a muted separated channel with a kickdrum which is always in the backround.

hmm - maybe I have to search an other compressor where the inputsignal switch is a switch and not a dropdown

davepermen
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by davepermen » Sat Dec 11, 2010 2:05 pm

i would try it with sends. so you can chose what gets send to the side chain. but i dunno, not much thinking bout it yet. but i played with such setups, it's always fun.
http://davepermen.net my tiny webpage, including link to bandcamp.

Roy.G.Biv
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Roy.G.Biv » Sat Dec 11, 2010 2:50 pm

I'm with Dave. How many aux sends are you using on each project? If you're only using 2 for FX, you can use send C on your tracks to control the sidechain.

Just assign send C's output to "no output," (that way the sidechain isn't making it to the mater) and set the compressor to use Send C as a sidechain input. Then anytime you want to sidechain off a specific channel, you just hit "send C" on your APC40 and turn up the knobs pertaining to the channels you want added to the sidechain signal.

That way you can sidechain off one or many signals.

I'm doing this without Ableton right in front of me, but I'm 99 percent certain that's the easiest way to get it done and it will work great. Let us know what you find out.

Manestra
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Manestra » Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:30 pm

just tried. It's not the solution I looked for but also nice idea.

But a problem I have now: I don't have a free send switch on the APC40 for send C.
All 4 banks are fix routed to something.

Is there a possibility to map the C-send to a button in a effect-group? there I have free switches I could use. Via Midi is wrong - as it's still in the computer. But Mapping not work either. How do I have to route/map/assing/whateva that send-C is controllable via an effect group-button?

Roy.G.Biv
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Roy.G.Biv » Sun Dec 12, 2010 6:33 pm

Do the sends thing and just map a button to the send with a min of -inf and a max of 0.

You hit the button, the send turns to max, and you're sending to a sidechain. Hit it again and it turns all the way down and you no longer have a sidechain signal, and no compression. All done.

fx23
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by fx23 » Sun Dec 12, 2010 6:47 pm

i expenrienced for a while with sends sidechaining, but i noticed that if compressors take back sends,
it can returns incoherent latencies according to complexity of the liveset, sad because cool.
didn't spoted yet why sometimes it works and sometimes not.
if some have clues, good or bad reports about using this technique let me know.

Roy.G.Biv
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Roy.G.Biv » Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:09 pm

Well that's strange. Sounds like there's a deeper issue. I'm running Live in the background right now and doing exactly what we are talking about and it's working perfectly. Maybe it's worth calling tech support.

fx23
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by fx23 » Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:20 pm

it works for me most of the time, if make new live set that works,
but when i merged a rack in a complex liveset with vsts, racks, ect, recentely, the tracks on wich the compressor
was were delayed.
i ve read somewhere you inerit a sample latency when going from right to left, but here it was more sounding like a buffer latency,
but i have to retest from scratch, it might come from elsewhere in my setup/routings.

Roy.G.Biv
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Roy.G.Biv » Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:48 pm

Yeah, if your set is complex I'm guessing that the issue stems from plugin latency.

If you want to do sidechaining in Ableton in any way and keep the timing perfect, you have to avoid those plugins that cause a lot of it.

Khazul
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Khazul » Mon Dec 13, 2010 2:07 am

M4L I guess...
Nothing to see here - move along!

Manestra
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Manestra » Mon Dec 13, 2010 10:38 am

Roy.G.Biv wrote:Do the sends thing and just map a button to the send with a min of -inf and a max of 0.

You hit the button, the send turns to max, and you're sending to a sidechain. Hit it again and it turns all the way down and you no longer have a sidechain signal, and no compression. All done.
the problem I have is: the only "available" buttons on the APC40I have are the 8 switches in the right lower corner - all other knobs are already in use. And every other knob I would assign then is fix for just one specific channel - no relative mapping just for the active channel.
So I would need 8 buttons for that.

That's the reason why I would love to get a solution with a rack. There I can use the same switch or button for something else.

Roy.G.Biv
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Re: How map inputselect for sidechain on compressor to a knob?

Post by Roy.G.Biv » Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:05 pm

Sounds like you want a lot of control. Maybe you need another controller like an Akai LPD8 or something. Or you could sacrifice some track launch buttons to serve your purpose. Or just simplify your set/controller.

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