Pretty long beta huh?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
JuanSOLO
Posts: 3236
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2007 8:21 am
Location: Shreveport LA, sometimes Dallas/Ft Worth TX

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by JuanSOLO » Sat Dec 18, 2010 9:52 pm

OK Machinesworking,

I like your style, shit tons of instruments and FX for Live performing. My laptop specs are pretty much the same as yours too. I do have less synths on deck though, mainly because of CPU. However I have been one of those guys who overlooked Kore and recently got interested based on what your saying.

I think I am gonna have to go for it. So Kore 1 controllers, plus software seem harder to find than a Kore 2 plus software deal. Do you recommend finding a Kore 1 controller and getting the current software?

Machinesworking
Posts: 11105
Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2004 9:30 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by Machinesworking » Sun Dec 19, 2010 12:33 am

@JuanSOLO,

Yeah, basically for a single song I think the most synths/samplers that aren't turned off to save CPU is three though.
Say in song X I use Absynth and the B4 organ, so the others are all turned off with a program change message.
Here's the cool part, Kore also has a plug in that sends program change messages to the instruments loaded in Kore.
What this means is for instance my set is pretty redundant, I just haven't gotten around to slimming it down. :oops:
The only reason I have repeated instruments like Kontakt, Absynth and Massive is I took the individual Kores from each of my individual songs and loaded them into a Kore instance. (hope that makes sense to you, you can load kore sets within kore, so a single track can have a whole Kore rack and mixer set up inside.
At some point I'll create a "master" Kore instance with all the soft synths I want to play live loaded, and have them switch between their internal presets via the mentioned internal program change plug in, so only one instance of Absynth etc. need to be loaded for the entire set.

Kore 1 has only the advantage of having a pretty decent sound card built in 2 in 2 out with separate stereo headphone out for queuing etc. if you already have a decent sound card for playing live, apparently the Kore 2 hardware is much more hot swappable. Kore 1 hardware may not come with the Kore 2 software though, which you'll most definitely want to get.

JuanSOLO
Posts: 3236
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2007 8:21 am
Location: Shreveport LA, sometimes Dallas/Ft Worth TX

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by JuanSOLO » Sun Dec 19, 2010 1:27 am

Awesome!

Thanks for the tips. I am going for it!

Machinesworking
Posts: 11105
Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2004 9:30 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by Machinesworking » Sun Dec 19, 2010 1:43 am

Cool, I think of it as pretty much a no brainer, especially since I sometimes like working in Digital Performer and porting songs back and forth. So it's a hell of a lot quicker to open one instance of Kore than ten instruments, plus recalling every patch etc. 8)

Highjacked the thread a bit. :oops:

Anubis
Posts: 1397
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 1:06 pm
Location: Miami
Contact:

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by Anubis » Sun Dec 19, 2010 2:23 am

Here they are hard at work on version 9.
Image
9.0.4 Suite-Samsung Chronos 7 laptop(17")-12GB RAM-Samsung 840 series SSD(250GB)-iPad2-Maschine-TouchAble-SaffirePro24-Saffire6USB-Komplete Audio 6-Axiom25-PCR300-Nocturn-LaunchPad-QuNeo-QuNexus
miTunes

JuanSOLO
Posts: 3236
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2007 8:21 am
Location: Shreveport LA, sometimes Dallas/Ft Worth TX

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by JuanSOLO » Sun Dec 19, 2010 2:28 am

Yeah we did. So back to the topic.
I sure wish Ableton would give us a sneak peak of what they have in mind for Live 9.

Machinesworking said something while we were getting off topic that really struck me. Something about Live getting back to a more performance based application. I originally got into Live because it was once upon a time, a means to turn a Laptop into a performance based sampler. Granted I have really enjoyed what has happened with Live, including the partnerships. Outside of Live 8 being ultra rocky for a long time, I am pleased where it has gotten.

That being said, I would love to see them steer this ship more towards a performance tool.
Just my 2 cents.

davepermen
Posts: 2198
Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:38 pm
Location: Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by davepermen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 11:33 am

3phase wrote:with max for live they showed us that they can change the codebase virtually over night when they only want..
don't ever conclude anything about development when you have no clue. you attack enough people in here for not having a clue about music. so better just shut up about your believe on what's simple and what not. this has to do with logic, not something you know much about anyways.
http://davepermen.net my tiny webpage, including link to bandcamp.

3phase
Posts: 4648
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:29 am
Contact:

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by 3phase » Wed Dec 22, 2010 11:59 am

davepermen wrote:
3phase wrote:with max for live they showed us that they can change the codebase virtually over night when they only want..
don't ever conclude anything about development when you have no clue. you attack enough people in here for not having a clue about music. so better just shut up about your believe on what's simple and what not. this has to do with logic, not something you know much about anyways.

??? depperman? where have you been? snowed in?

and it dont needs to be an expert in software development to see that changing 2 times in one year the file format of a daw is a rather bad sign for stitching with the hot needle.. as the many many live 8 bugs was... is that what happens when you are too much into the "beauty of code" ??

Has anybody ever counted all the L8 bugs? have they reached the 1000? or was it just above 500?
mac book 2,16 ghz 4(3)gb ram, Os 10.62, fireface 400,

davepermen
Posts: 2198
Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:38 pm
Location: Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by davepermen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 12:49 pm

i left for you to spread your fud. and i won't be in here much anymore, as you are very annoying. you simply have no clue about software development. nor about "it's a bad sign they changed the file format" and such. there's no reason for it to be a bad sign (au contraire, actually. it looks like they fix problems at every place they find them).

but as said, you don't understand software development AT ALL. you can't understand if something is a big longterm thing to fix, or a tiny thing to fix. that is not a problem, you're a musician. but you complaining all day long and spreading your fud about your fake knowledge, that is a problem. but you know that already.

but have fun being an annoying piece of shit.
http://davepermen.net my tiny webpage, including link to bandcamp.

Rationalizer
Posts: 1308
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 3:14 pm
Location: Finland
Contact:

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by Rationalizer » Wed Dec 22, 2010 1:07 pm

They are trying to get the most of their workers by increasing the work time: http://youtu.be/7BhVdlZDQD0?hd=1
WIN8.1 x64 | Suite 9.5 x64 | RME FF400 | UAD-2 | Maschine 2 | SparkLE | Mopho | Blodeld | Komplete 9 | Ebony A2 | Adam A7 | Launchpad | Waves Diamond V9 | Many VSTs

Facebook | Youtube | Soundcloud | Beatport

3phase
Posts: 4648
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:29 am
Contact:

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by 3phase » Wed Dec 22, 2010 1:15 pm

it a bad sign regarding the attitude towards the customers to place not backward compatible file format changes on them.. without supplying any conversion tools.. and doing that 2 times in one year is really over the top.

its also really over the top that the whole program stayed in permanent beta state for over a year.. just since a few month we can call it release ready..


that all is for sure also related to the max integration.. the midiclock out bug is.. and i do any bet that this was not the only mfl related bug.

however.. with the mfl integration ableton has clearly shown that they can change things around quickly.. but also demonstrated at the same time thats better to dont do it in such a quick fashion...

so theire politics of leaving customers with certain problems for decade is maybe better than to much changes in one year..

something more balanced in the middle with a strong focus on core functionality would be actualy the best..
decade is too long.. and 2 fileformat changes in one year is too much...
In the end Ableton is the company the users allow it to be.. so they can do what they want as it looks.
mac book 2,16 ghz 4(3)gb ram, Os 10.62, fireface 400,

necho
Posts: 995
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:39 pm
Location: (y)UK

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by necho » Wed Dec 22, 2010 1:55 pm

I'm with Dave on this.

I manage a development team, and to presume that you know ANYTHING about what's going on behind the scenes at Ableton is to admit your total ignorance of the process of software development.

How can you possibly know the reasons behind the decisions they made? Software design and development is all about compromise: weighing up the pros and cons of every decision and trying to come up with the best (or "least bad") solution.

Better stop digging 3phase - some of us do this shit for a living.
_________
sigs suck.

fisto
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:06 pm

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by fisto » Wed Dec 22, 2010 2:26 pm

well. I think we should all FUCK ABLETON, I really can't stand it anymore.
No word from these assholes on anything here. The beta has been here for nearly 2 months now.
And they just keep bringing this FUCKING partner-instruments, while I get an out of memory issue (after 1.5 hours) while dj-ing in a simple template with 15% CPU and 2 tracks @the same time on 8.2. . And i have a 4gig MBP so should definetely be no problem. You have to know: when I used a CRACKED VERSION of Live 7 on a PC-laptop, I had no crashes. But with the legit 8 and a MBP I have. What the Fuck!! Serously. who wants this shit

Abes start to be cool again, and better be quick!!

@3phase: it seems that you are the only guy here who tells the truth :-). Scheiß auf diese Idioten :D
The others seem to be fucking noob fanboys who just want to make music with other peoples music, and it seems that they don't need functions in there DAW at all!!!!

FUUUUUUUUUUCKKKKK YOUUUUUUUUU ABBBBBLLLLLEEEEETTTTTTOOOOOONNNNN!!!!

I will definetely NOT buy Live 9. :twisted:

BUT: an idea for Live 9. Why not just make a simple program whre the users just press play and then Live connects to the internet and plays a David Fucking Guetta track from myspace in 128k-Bit and call it" Live 9, even easier and quicker to make music, and now with native 128 BIT engine". HAHAHAHA

This is so ridiculous guys!!

3phase
Posts: 4648
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:29 am
Contact:

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by 3phase » Wed Dec 22, 2010 2:31 pm

necho wrote:I'm with Dave on this.

I manage a development team, and to presume that you know ANYTHING about what's going on behind the scenes at Ableton is to admit your total ignorance of the process of software development.

How can you possibly know the reasons behind the decisions they made? Software design and development is all about compromise: weighing up the pros and cons of every decision and trying to come up with the best (or "least bad") solution.

Better stop digging 3phase - some of us do this shit for a living.
I was only stating the outcome of theire actions and this is without example in the music software industry.
No one ever performed such a bug soaked and longtime ongoing stunt with theire customers ever before.

And in many points the actions was rude.. like not naming the midicrash bug and workarounds as soon it was known.
having the time limited betas in the beginning that stoped working on friday, betas you had to use because the release version was crashing all over... and why friday? smart thinking somehow.. musicans have theire freetime on the weekend..sure...
And the arrogant attitude in the beginning of the crash rally.. they called it user bugs and user errors and ignored anything that wasnt reproducable prooved to them..needed half a year for them to take the random midi carshbug as such.
Claiming that only 2 users had it.. but why than a quality statement a few month later when only 2 users had crashes?
This kind of behavior and statements creates trust..

So leave me alone with development team necessaritys or compromizes.. this kind of politics has nothing to do with the development. Its a character of a company. One that defenetly was driven by arrogance at the launchtime of L8.
They was too succesfull the years before and lost their grip and design quality.
Hopefully just temporarily as we all will see next year..when the whole mess will just repeat again and all the old problems will be still there like family.. or?? maybe its an all new live with lots of quality.
mac book 2,16 ghz 4(3)gb ram, Os 10.62, fireface 400,

docprosper
Posts: 1192
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:20 am
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Re: Pretty long beta huh?

Post by docprosper » Wed Dec 22, 2010 3:35 pm

fisto wrote:when I used a CRACKED VERSION of Live 7 on a PC-laptop, I had no crashes. But with the legit 8 and a MBP I have.
karma? 8 works great for me :mrgreen:
Funk N. Furter wrote:Post properly.
Ableton Live Suite | M4L | Powerbook | Launchpad | APC40 | Faderfox | 2x1200 | ...
---> http://soundcloud.com/kilcraft

Post Reply