Dear Ableton

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
William
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by William » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:47 pm

Cubase 6 looks pretty amazing. If early reports about stability are good then I think I'm going to grab it.
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duro
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by duro » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:53 pm

Personally, my 8.2.1 has only crashed once (maybe twice) on me since I installed it. That sort of stability is about what I get with every other DAW.

I'm happy.

Sure there are a few things I'd like to see improved, but I could also say that about every other DAW.

zee verkawound
Posts: 92
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by zee verkawound » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:07 pm

ollyb303 wrote:What makes you think 64bit will be more stable? I'm a professional software architect and frankly that statement has no basis in reality....

Apparently the fact that you are a software engineer has little basis in reality. That or you know NOTHING about this program. Are you telling me that you are unaware of Live's absolute guaranteed promise of crashing when the program reaches 1.6 gigs of ram? Are you also stating that if Live was 64bit it would still crash the same way at 1.6 gigs of ram? That's utter nonsense. It crashes because it CANNOT capacitate more ram because of it's 32bit limitations.

zee verkawound
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by zee verkawound » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:09 pm

duro wrote:Personally, my 8.2.1 has only crashed once (maybe twice) on me since I installed it. That sort of stability is about what I get with every other DAW.

I'm happy.

Sure there are a few things I'd like to see improved, but I could also say that about every other DAW.

How long have you been using Live? What version did you start with? How many sample libraries are you accustomed to using in your studio setting. Do you even use sample libraries?

Khazul
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by Khazul » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:12 pm

zee verkawound wrote:
ollyb303 wrote:What makes you think 64bit will be more stable? I'm a professional software architect and frankly that statement has no basis in reality....

Apparently the fact that you are a software engineer has little basis in reality. That or you know NOTHING about this program. Are you telling me that you are unaware of Live's absolute guaranteed promise of crashing when the program reaches 1.6 gigs of ram? Are you also stating that if Live was 64bit it would still crash the same way at 1.6 gigs of ram? That's utter nonsense. It crashes because it CANNOT capacitate more ram because of it's 32bit limitations.
On 64bit it will just crash for a million different obscure reasons instead - i can tell you that with absolute certainlty as well :)
Nothing to see here - move along!

zee verkawound
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by zee verkawound » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:21 pm

Khazul wrote: On 64bit it will just crash for a million different obscure reasons instead - i can tell you that with absolute certainlty as well :)

but it won't crash for the NUMBER ONE reason it currently does will it?

Migra
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by Migra » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:23 pm

Khazul wrote:
You mean http://www.steinberg.net/en/products/cu ... start.html

(the one you gave gets a 404)

I might actually go for this upgrade - I skipped the v5 update, so V4 to V6 actaully seems like a decent step up in tools for the money and it will will buy me some time - maybe Live is slowly going to start going the way of Reason - too little too late etc...?
Sorry, yesterday my link was working, Steinberg modified it today..... by the videos and info on the site I'm liking it, I would love to buy my copy, let's see the reviews by April 2011 and maybe I'll be buying it! Looks nicer than Logic Pro........
| MacBook Pro 13" OS X 10.7.1 C2D@2.26 4GB.RAM 500GB.HDD@5400RPM | | Reason 6.5 | Logic Studio 9.1.7 | Cubase Artist 6.5.2 | Traktor Pro 2 | Nexus2 |

purpurkatten
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by purpurkatten » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:34 pm

I recall the statement from Ableton a long while ago (was it at NAMM 2010, a year ago?) saying that they would focus on software stability.

That is nice.

But, as all know, a software program like a sequencer is never "finished". There will always be room for improvement. So finally, one needs to call it a day and take the next step.

Therefore, I think it´s time to hear something from Ableton of how their work is progressing with Live 8 (and/or 9). When, and to what criteria, do Ableton consider the work done?

Right now, as far as I can see, the users are left totally in the dark when it comes to the future of the software.

ollyb303
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by ollyb303 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:40 pm

Khazul wrote:
zee verkawound wrote:
ollyb303 wrote:What makes you think 64bit will be more stable? I'm a professional software architect and frankly that statement has no basis in reality....

Apparently the fact that you are a software engineer has little basis in reality. That or you know NOTHING about this program. Are you telling me that you are unaware of Live's absolute guaranteed promise of crashing when the program reaches 1.6 gigs of ram? Are you also stating that if Live was 64bit it would still crash the same way at 1.6 gigs of ram? That's utter nonsense. It crashes because it CANNOT capacitate more ram because of it's 32bit limitations.
On 64bit it will just crash for a million different obscure reasons instead - i can tell you that with absolute certainlty as well :)
My point exactly. Back in yer box zee verkawound!

My employer thinks I'm a good enough software architect to pay me a fairly obscene amount of money and I've used Ableton Live pretty much every day since version 3.
.:O:B:1:.
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zee verkawound
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by zee verkawound » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:57 pm

ollyb303 wrote: My point exactly. Back in yer box zee verkawound!

My employer thinks I'm a good enough software architect to pay me a fairly obscene amount of money and I've used Ableton Live pretty much every day since version 3.
Address REALITY. That should be the first move on any companies behalf concerning their produced deficiencies. The fact that Ableton Live is not 64bit is a HUGE deficiency for the most infantile and exceedingly obvious of reasons. In fact, in the world of music software it's negligible at best not to be on a solid 64bit footing at this point. Look around.

Why are you ducking reality by ASSUMING that 64bit will result in more problems? You state what I suggest is not based in reality when you yourself have NO factual rebuttal based in reality whatsoever. I design shoes and am highly paid, that does NOT mean I know everything about shoes. It also does not mean that I know more about shoes than others with their own high level of specialized interest in shoes. It just means that I know more than most about the design aspect of shoes. End of story.

ollyb303
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by ollyb303 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:09 pm

zee verkawound wrote:
ollyb303 wrote: My point exactly. Back in yer box zee verkawound!

My employer thinks I'm a good enough software architect to pay me a fairly obscene amount of money and I've used Ableton Live pretty much every day since version 3.
Address REALITY. That should be the first move on any companies behalf concerning their produced deficiencies. The fact that Ableton Live is not 64bit is a HUGE deficiency for the most infantile and exceedingly obvious of reasons. In fact, in the world of music software it's negligible at best not to be on a solid 64bit footing at this point. Look around.

Why are you ducking reality by ASSUMING that 64bit will result in more problems? You state what I suggest is not based in reality when you yourself have NO factual rebuttal based in reality whatsoever. I design shoes and am highly paid, that does NOT mean I know everything about shoes. It also does not mean that I know more about shoes than others with their own high level of specialized interest in shoes. It just means that I know more than most about the design aspect of shoes. End of story.
I'm not assuming anything of the sort, nor am I professing to know everything about software, but I think you're being incredibly naive if you think a 64bit version would eliminate all crashes... Seriously dude, chill
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Khazul
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Re: Dear Ableton

Post by Khazul » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:09 pm

zee verkawound wrote:
Khazul wrote: On 64bit it will just crash for a million different obscure reasons instead - i can tell you that with absolute certainlty as well :)

but it won't crash for the NUMBER ONE reason it currently does will it?
Actually I have only ever once had ableton die due to running out of memory and that is because out of curiosity just now I loaded up a hell of alot fo instances of kontakt and battery with about the heaviest sample sets I could think of and rec enabled all the tracks (50+ of them) and ran fingers up and down keyboard so the whole lot would be thrashing like hell to keep samples in memory. Sammples sets used included all of the kontakt pianos and the huge alecias keys library, loads of Ableton EIC2 library sounds as well, the biggests battery kits, loads of abbey roads kits in kontakt loads and loads of strings in kontakt.

Kontakt eventually complained when memory use went past 3.6GB or so, followed by Live dying immediately afterwards.

So yes - Ive seen this happen too becuase I forced it just now - but at 3.6GB, not 1.6GB!

If it happens at 1.6Gb - thats down to your machine - and 64bit will not fix that, might even make it alot worse as 64 bit apps do use more memory generally. It would definately be nicer if plugins and ableton were a bit ore graceful about running out of phsyical memory, but TBH when you start running out of memory you can get into a right nasty mess with being unable to even allocate memory to tell the user about it for eg in many apps.

I have to ask what on earth you are doing if you actually meant 3.6GB? Sounds like what it is you are doing might be better done in something more geared towards massive orchestral scroring jobs for big movies etc on soe machine with a rediculous amount of memory?

The test I just did would probably be enough to score every individual instrument differently in a huge orchestral composition way before it eventually died?
Nothing to see here - move along!

zee verkawound
Posts: 92
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 3:55 pm

Re: Dear Ableton

Post by zee verkawound » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:13 pm

ollyb303 wrote: I'm not assuming anything of the sort, nor am I professing to know everything about software, but I think you're being incredibly naive if you think a 64bit version would eliminate all crashes... Seriously dude, chill
No, you seriously think before you post. I NEVER made the ridiculous claim that 64bit would solve all crashes. That's a lie. It will however serve to eliminate the biggest deficiency Ableton Live has.

purpurkatten
Posts: 113
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 11:09 am

Re: Dear Ableton

Post by purpurkatten » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:14 pm

Don´t know how important 64bit is to you guys.

But if Ableton won´t turn 64bit in first half of 2011 I will have to seriously consider getting an other sequencer.

zee verkawound
Posts: 92
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 3:55 pm

Re: Dear Ableton

Post by zee verkawound » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:15 pm

Khazul wrote:
zee verkawound wrote:
Khazul wrote: On 64bit it will just crash for a million different obscure reasons instead - i can tell you that with absolute certainlty as well :)

but it won't crash for the NUMBER ONE reason it currently does will it?
Actually I have only ever once had ableton die due to running out of memory and that is because out of curiosity just now I loaded up a hell of alot fo instances of kontakt and battery with about the heaviest sample sets I could think of and rec enabled all the tracks (50+ of them) and ran fingers up and down keyboard so the whole lot would be thrashing like hell to keep samples in memory. Sammples sets used included all of the kontakt pianos and the huge alecias keys library, loads of Ableton EIC2 library sounds as well, the biggests battery kits, loads of abbey roads kits in kontakt loads and loads of strings in kontakt.

Kontakt eventually complained when memory use went past 3.6GB or so, followed by Live dying immediately afterwards.

So yes - Ive seen this happen too becuase I forced it just now - but at 3.6GB, not 1.6GB!

If it happens at 1.6Gb - thats down to your machine - and 64bit will not fix that, might even make it alot worse as 64 bit apps do use more memory generally. It would definately be nicer if plugins and ableton were a bit ore graceful about running out of phsyical memory, but TBH when you start running out of memory you can get into a right nasty mess with being unable to even allocate memory to tell the user about it for eg in many apps.

I have to ask what on earth you are doing if you actually meant 3.6GB? Sounds like what it is you are doing might be better done in something more geared towards massive orchestral scroring jobs for big movies etc on soe machine with a rediculous amount of memory?

The test I just did would probably be enough to score every individual instrument differently in a huge orchestral composition way before it eventually died?
What you are stating here is complete and total BS. Ableton Live CANNOT use 3.6 gigs of ram. That's an utter impossibility.

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