Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
Im interested in this and would like to pick your brain for short moment. I am especially interested in its quantizer for chords and scales. Any comparison to the omnichord controller?
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
Thats a long time i would love to test it. Interested in reviews as well.
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
I have one.
Ask away and I'll be happy to answer whatever I can.
I have never used an omnichord, so I can't give any comparisons.
Also- there is no way to use it (R2M) for chords. Or at least it is not possible to generate chords from the ribbon controller itself. If thats what you meant.
Ask away and I'll be happy to answer whatever I can.
I have never used an omnichord, so I can't give any comparisons.
Also- there is no way to use it (R2M) for chords. Or at least it is not possible to generate chords from the ribbon controller itself. If thats what you meant.
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
When the quantizer is on, does the scale play only the notes within that selected scale? If you could elaborate on the quantizer that would be great.Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
Yes the quantizer only outputs the notes in the selected scale. It has options for 12 tone (chromatic), Major, Minor, 4ths 5ths, Major chord, Minor chord (Triads basically) It doesnt play a chord- it just quantizes so every note is either a 1,3, or 5. And a bunch of other chords.
If you have it quantized to a chord shape however- you cant easily change the root note, so you could sort of strum it I suppose but you wont be able to follow a chord progression with it.
All in all I have to admit I was kind of disappointed with it. I play guitar and did play cello in HS so I bought mine with the hope of being able to expressively use it to input notes into my sequencer. Something akin to a 1 string fretless bass or so. And unfortunately it's just not very good for that purpose. The tracking is not very consistent- to the point where you have to use it quantized to about one octave to even play any kind of notes accurately. (and the quantizing kinda destroys the value of being able to do pitch bends or vibrato) And sometimes it's bad enough that hitting the same spot on different occasions will generate a different note. I suppose if you were going to use it for something like filter sweeps or creatively controlling effects sends it might be cool- but I wouldn't recommend it for anything where you want to generate notes.
Hope this is somewhat helpfull.
If you have it quantized to a chord shape however- you cant easily change the root note, so you could sort of strum it I suppose but you wont be able to follow a chord progression with it.
All in all I have to admit I was kind of disappointed with it. I play guitar and did play cello in HS so I bought mine with the hope of being able to expressively use it to input notes into my sequencer. Something akin to a 1 string fretless bass or so. And unfortunately it's just not very good for that purpose. The tracking is not very consistent- to the point where you have to use it quantized to about one octave to even play any kind of notes accurately. (and the quantizing kinda destroys the value of being able to do pitch bends or vibrato) And sometimes it's bad enough that hitting the same spot on different occasions will generate a different note. I suppose if you were going to use it for something like filter sweeps or creatively controlling effects sends it might be cool- but I wouldn't recommend it for anything where you want to generate notes.
Hope this is somewhat helpfull.
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
Thanks, very helpful. I am going to try to find a demo unit around somewhere. Thanks again.
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
I am also interested in getting one...
However, mainly for the purpose of using it like a 1 string fretless bass style controller... seems that its not accurate enough for that though
However, mainly for the purpose of using it like a 1 string fretless bass style controller... seems that its not accurate enough for that though
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ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 84
- Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2007 4:48 pm
- Contact:
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
I was in the same boat some weeks ago and in the end decided for the Eowave Ribbon.
From what I read, the Doepfer has limited pressure sensitivity and that was actually one of the things that I hoped to use a lot. I also didn't feel like I would use the functions of the controller much with the available interface.
And as sturdy as it looks, it seemed a bit clunky
So this is a "short" review of the Eowave Ribbon:
Overall, I'm slightly mixed about it. For what it is, it feels a bit on the expensive side, but as I understand it its made by hand in France...
The Body is one massive stick of transparent perspex, 1.4 cm thick. Very solid. It's illuminated by a blue LED from the inside and looks gorgeous in the Dark as soon as it's attached to USB Power.
Four little rubber-feet are in the box that you can attach to it to avoid scratching it when laying it on a table.
It has two connectors: A mini USB (comes with a cable) for connection with a computer and getting it's power and a 3.5 mm stereo plug that can either output the sound of the internal synth or CV signals.
By default it sends Notes when you press down, Volume (cc 7) for pressure and if you move your fingers around: Pitchbend. On one End of the Stick there is an additional pressure sensitive Pad that outputs Modulation (cc 1) by default. The area you can play is 50 cm long, the whole Stick is 60 cm.
By default the ribbon is spanning 4 octaves and there are little circles printed on the ribbon that give a relatively accurate account on note placement.
The first thing that surprised me was, that the ribbon area feels rather soft, a bit like expensive black gaffa tape. They write in the docs that it is to be handled carefully and I think I would subscribe to that - so no hitting the thing with sticks for drumming
How long it will hold is to be determined. It's not as if it falls apart, just not meant for rough treatment.
The internal "Synth" was never why I bought it - it can output some basic waveforms and has simple FM built in that you control with the modulation area, but I guess it was easy to implement and they thought "why not". Fun to play for 5 minutes but not a serious instrument with any depth (well, for me anyway ).
The Settings are controlled with a max patch. You need to download it from Eowaves rather simplistic website (grab the documentation PDF as well when you are there) and you need a Max Runtime installed. Version 1.0 seems to be for Max 5 and 1.1 for Max 6, but that was not documented anywhere, I just deduced it from where it worked or didn't. Otherwise they seem identical.
In the software, you can Switch between Audio out and CV out, scale the ribbon between "full scale continuous", "full scale halftones", "4 octaves continuous" and "4 octaves halftones". You can select a Waveform for the synth (sine, noise, triangle, square and saw), set the pressure pad to control AM or FM, you can set the direction of the ribbon depending on how you want to hold/play it, the base note (C-2 to G8), midi channel 1 - 16 and the destination for CC Pressure and CC Pad.
For those two you can select from all 128 CCs, but there seems to be no way to use pressure for Aftertouch - which I would have preferred.
You can save 16 different presets but I haven't looked into that to be honest.
On Windows a midi device can only be connected to one application, so you you can't leave the editor open while playing in Live, which makes it a bit hard to change anything on the fly (and Live can't re-scan midi devices while running so a restart is required).
All of this feels a bit simplistic and I would say there is quite some potential to improve it, but so far it works well enough.
And now to the ribbon itself
I totally love it!
It is such a nice difference from playing a keyboard (although you can also combine them very well).
I think those of you looking for a 1 string fretless should demo it.
Especially with softsynths like Diva, Zebra, Diversion etc. where you can set wide ranges of Pitchbend with them still sounding very good it is awesome how natural you can move around the ribbon.
But even with Kontakt playing for instance Soniccoutures "Broken Wurli" you get interesting things out of sounds that you may have never expected. Vocal samples are also extremely interesting to play with it in a way more natural way than with a keyboard and a mod wheel (IMO).
As a direct result, I recently bought Max for Live and that makes it a killer controller. My first patch was a tool to more flexibly route the output without changing the ribbons settings all the time
Would be nice to have the control/editor-patch as a M4L device actually - not sure if it would work though.
Some last things:
- The sensitivity is not such, that you can just gently lay your finger on it and it reacts (like a touch screen). You need a certain pressure to make it send a note.
- With 4 octaves and half notes, it is very accurate to play, but sometimes a different note comes out anyway.
- The Mini-USB makes it a bit fragile feeling. Again, it's not meant for rough stage handling and it may fall out, there is no way to secure it other than applying some gaffa tape ...
- Worked on every machine I tried by just plugging it in - no drivers needed. I tested on Mac and Windows.
- The additional Pressure Pad uses a different Technology and isn't very accurate. It seems to depend on the weather and how moist your fingers are, so don't expect any accurate control from it. Eowave recommends un- and re-plugging the stick to re-calibrate the pad, but in my tests that didn't help too much and at least on Windows, this isn't something you want to do often.
My vote:
Overall design: 4.5 stars.
Sturdiness: 2 stars.
Control Software: 2 stars.
Playability: 4 stars.
Functionality: 4 stars.
Finally: even with the shortcomings mentioned above, I totally love the device.
Cheers,
Tom
From what I read, the Doepfer has limited pressure sensitivity and that was actually one of the things that I hoped to use a lot. I also didn't feel like I would use the functions of the controller much with the available interface.
And as sturdy as it looks, it seemed a bit clunky
So this is a "short" review of the Eowave Ribbon:
Overall, I'm slightly mixed about it. For what it is, it feels a bit on the expensive side, but as I understand it its made by hand in France...
The Body is one massive stick of transparent perspex, 1.4 cm thick. Very solid. It's illuminated by a blue LED from the inside and looks gorgeous in the Dark as soon as it's attached to USB Power.
Four little rubber-feet are in the box that you can attach to it to avoid scratching it when laying it on a table.
It has two connectors: A mini USB (comes with a cable) for connection with a computer and getting it's power and a 3.5 mm stereo plug that can either output the sound of the internal synth or CV signals.
By default it sends Notes when you press down, Volume (cc 7) for pressure and if you move your fingers around: Pitchbend. On one End of the Stick there is an additional pressure sensitive Pad that outputs Modulation (cc 1) by default. The area you can play is 50 cm long, the whole Stick is 60 cm.
By default the ribbon is spanning 4 octaves and there are little circles printed on the ribbon that give a relatively accurate account on note placement.
The first thing that surprised me was, that the ribbon area feels rather soft, a bit like expensive black gaffa tape. They write in the docs that it is to be handled carefully and I think I would subscribe to that - so no hitting the thing with sticks for drumming
How long it will hold is to be determined. It's not as if it falls apart, just not meant for rough treatment.
The internal "Synth" was never why I bought it - it can output some basic waveforms and has simple FM built in that you control with the modulation area, but I guess it was easy to implement and they thought "why not". Fun to play for 5 minutes but not a serious instrument with any depth (well, for me anyway
).The Settings are controlled with a max patch. You need to download it from Eowaves rather simplistic website (grab the documentation PDF as well when you are there) and you need a Max Runtime installed. Version 1.0 seems to be for Max 5 and 1.1 for Max 6, but that was not documented anywhere, I just deduced it from where it worked or didn't. Otherwise they seem identical.
In the software, you can Switch between Audio out and CV out, scale the ribbon between "full scale continuous", "full scale halftones", "4 octaves continuous" and "4 octaves halftones". You can select a Waveform for the synth (sine, noise, triangle, square and saw), set the pressure pad to control AM or FM, you can set the direction of the ribbon depending on how you want to hold/play it, the base note (C-2 to G8), midi channel 1 - 16 and the destination for CC Pressure and CC Pad.
For those two you can select from all 128 CCs, but there seems to be no way to use pressure for Aftertouch - which I would have preferred.
You can save 16 different presets but I haven't looked into that to be honest.
On Windows a midi device can only be connected to one application, so you you can't leave the editor open while playing in Live, which makes it a bit hard to change anything on the fly (and Live can't re-scan midi devices while running so a restart is required).
All of this feels a bit simplistic and I would say there is quite some potential to improve it, but so far it works well enough.
And now to the ribbon itself
I totally love it!
It is such a nice difference from playing a keyboard (although you can also combine them very well).
I think those of you looking for a 1 string fretless should demo it.
Especially with softsynths like Diva, Zebra, Diversion etc. where you can set wide ranges of Pitchbend with them still sounding very good it is awesome how natural you can move around the ribbon.
But even with Kontakt playing for instance Soniccoutures "Broken Wurli" you get interesting things out of sounds that you may have never expected. Vocal samples are also extremely interesting to play with it in a way more natural way than with a keyboard and a mod wheel (IMO).
As a direct result, I recently bought Max for Live and that makes it a killer controller. My first patch was a tool to more flexibly route the output without changing the ribbons settings all the time
Would be nice to have the control/editor-patch as a M4L device actually - not sure if it would work though.
Some last things:
- The sensitivity is not such, that you can just gently lay your finger on it and it reacts (like a touch screen). You need a certain pressure to make it send a note.
- With 4 octaves and half notes, it is very accurate to play, but sometimes a different note comes out anyway.
- The Mini-USB makes it a bit fragile feeling. Again, it's not meant for rough stage handling and it may fall out, there is no way to secure it other than applying some gaffa tape ...
- Worked on every machine I tried by just plugging it in - no drivers needed. I tested on Mac and Windows.
- The additional Pressure Pad uses a different Technology and isn't very accurate. It seems to depend on the weather and how moist your fingers are, so don't expect any accurate control from it. Eowave recommends un- and re-plugging the stick to re-calibrate the pad, but in my tests that didn't help too much and at least on Windows, this isn't something you want to do often.
My vote:
Overall design: 4.5 stars.
Sturdiness: 2 stars.
Control Software: 2 stars.
Playability: 4 stars.
Functionality: 4 stars.
Finally: even with the shortcomings mentioned above, I totally love the device.
Cheers,
Tom
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
Nice! I have been eyeing the Eowave ribbon for some time now..
Im looking for a controller that works like some synths on iOS. Like the Bebot app, but with a longer touch interface. I love the responsivenes / the latency with Bebot on iPhone. Another thing I love is that its 2 directional, so you can have like filter on x and pitch on y, etc. I guess we cant do that on the Eowave. Is the main ribbon preassure sencitive?
(Sorry for hijacking the thread)
Im looking for a controller that works like some synths on iOS. Like the Bebot app, but with a longer touch interface. I love the responsivenes / the latency with Bebot on iPhone. Another thing I love is that its 2 directional, so you can have like filter on x and pitch on y, etc. I guess we cant do that on the Eowave. Is the main ribbon preassure sencitive?
(Sorry for hijacking the thread)
-
ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 84
- Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2007 4:48 pm
- Contact:
Re: Anybody use a Doepfer R2M ribbon controller?
Yeah, it's pressure sensitive.
Maybe I wasn't clear above, the Eowave Ribbon sends:
- Notes by pressing somewhere.
- User assignable controller from the amount of pressure you apply (by default CC 7).
- Pitchbend when moving up or down while still pressing. Pitch-jumps can be done when pressing somewhere with a second finger - very little pressure needed for that.
- On the separate Pressure Pad you can controll another CC (1 by default), but as I wrote, it's not really accurate.
So I feel you get quite some control from basically a linear device.
Some videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20M0PJn_25o
The internal synth:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9dq3yz5 ... re=related
Funny:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVa-kkKG ... re=related
And my favorite, using the CV out with a modular system:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yy7PAgG3muM
Edit: One more thing: if you put your synth to 24 halftones on pitchbend, bending is basically in sync with the 4 octaves, so you can play a note, move your finger to somewhere else bending the pitch, release and when you then press down again on the same spot, the pitch of the new note is basically the same as where you left the pitchbend. Very natural feel that.
Cheers,
Tom
Maybe I wasn't clear above, the Eowave Ribbon sends:
- Notes by pressing somewhere.
- User assignable controller from the amount of pressure you apply (by default CC 7).
- Pitchbend when moving up or down while still pressing. Pitch-jumps can be done when pressing somewhere with a second finger - very little pressure needed for that.
- On the separate Pressure Pad you can controll another CC (1 by default), but as I wrote, it's not really accurate.
So I feel you get quite some control from basically a linear device.
Some videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20M0PJn_25o
The internal synth:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9dq3yz5 ... re=related
Funny:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVa-kkKG ... re=related
And my favorite, using the CV out with a modular system:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yy7PAgG3muM
Edit: One more thing: if you put your synth to 24 halftones on pitchbend, bending is basically in sync with the 4 octaves, so you can play a note, move your finger to somewhere else bending the pitch, release and when you then press down again on the same spot, the pitch of the new note is basically the same as where you left the pitchbend. Very natural feel that.
Cheers,
Tom