WTF is 5th note?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
H20nly
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by H20nly » Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:18 am

perplex wrote:
3dot... wrote:
evon wrote:Who cares the fuck about a 5th note anyway :!: :!: Just make some music :mrgreen:
what do you mean? this IS about making music..
this is knowledge that any 5 year old playing any instrument knows
and ofcourse knowledge is power..
One would not compare those inquiring to 5 year olds without having the sole intent to offend. That is not becoming of an ableton forum member.

btw i screwed ur mother this past fortnight
for a guy who asks so many questions you sure do talk a lot of smack.

keep sowing.
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crumhorn
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by crumhorn » Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:00 am

Piplodocus wrote:I look at music theory like this:

You'll never be a great poet just by learning the language. It's the creativity and emotion that creates the poetic art form. Knowledge is never a substitute for real creativity if you want to make something new, exciting and beautiful.

However, if you know the language well you can create your poetry easier, and usually express yourself much better than if you only have the creativity alone. This may then enable you to create far greater works of emotion than fumbling for the closest thing you can find. (Especially if working with other musicians)


(From a classically trained trombonist who mostly played jazz for a few decades, but who still never learnt what the notes on his guitar were called in the last 15 years... :oops: )
I prefer the analogy of a painter. They might be able to see the colour they want in their minds eye, but mixing it on their pallet will be much simpler if they know the basics of colour theory.

If anything raw emotion and creativity are held back by lack of theoretical knowledge.

But I do agree with you about beginners being introduced to theory in the form of rules, when really all they are is common practices and tools for understanding and communicating musical ideas.
"The banjo is the perfect instrument for the antisocial."

(Allow me to plug my guitar scale visualiser thingy - www.fretlearner.com)

mersault
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by mersault » Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:09 am

I'm really digging on what a lot of people are saying on here!

There's nothing wrong with NOT learning music theory and still trying to create music. To each his own. We shouldn't all take the same exact approach anyhow.

I have to admit though, that it does bother me when I hear stated with a tone of arrogance about how somebody doesn't NEED to learn that "stuff" because they're doing their own thing. ..as if with an air of revolutionary superiority. I realize this is not the case with many people who don't study music theory, but sometimes it is.

Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Chopin, Schoenberg, Scriabin, etc. knew exactly what they were doing and fully succeeded in doing their own thing. ...and even changed what everybody else's "thing" in the process!!!

nathannn
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by nathannn » Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:36 am

Piplodocus wrote:Since it has no 3rd (either major or minor) it means you can play them over both. Easy chords! If you're as lazy as me you can put your guitar in drop d and play them with 1 finger on the bottom strings! :P
if you are as lazy as me you can tune your guitar to dadada and play with your thumb.
i usually dont just play with my thumb in this tuning i use it to make other chords that are hard to play in standard.
but you can be lazy if you want.
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oddstep
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by oddstep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:18 am

mersault wrote: I have to admit though, that it does bother me when I hear stated with a tone of arrogance about how somebody doesn't NEED to learn that "stuff" because they're doing their own thing. ..as if with an air of revolutionary superiority.
+1
particularly if you're using any midi sound generator.. softsynth etc... every note is likely to be pushed into the standard diatonic tuning - - so to ignore music theory is effectively to ignore several hundred years of trying to do interesting things with this selection of frequencies. You might get lucky and hit upon something totally new, but its way more likely that you'll hit on something that has already been done.

perplex
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by perplex » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:09 am

i would love to understand all there is about music theory, and wish I did earlier in my life.
I have a full time job, a wife, and a baby, but i still come home and manage to contribute time to learn many things. Music theory not excluded.

Cezband
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by Cezband » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:45 am

nathannn wrote:if you are as lazy as me you can tune your guitar to dadada and play with your thumb.
Interestingly no nonsense tuning - probably allows for some brilliant slide stuff too. :)
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crumhorn
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by crumhorn » Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:04 pm

nathannn wrote:if you are as lazy as me you can tune your guitar to dadada and play with your thumb.
Don't you break a lot of E strings that way? I've never dared to tune it so high!

I love MIDI guitar for playing with different tuning systems. let the software take the strain (but you need to play via headphones or learn to ignore the string noise)
"The banjo is the perfect instrument for the antisocial."

(Allow me to plug my guitar scale visualiser thingy - www.fretlearner.com)

oddstep
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by oddstep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:28 pm

d a d a d f# is pretty nice as well. it was only on reading nathann's post that i checked what notes my guitar was tuned to.

LeifonMars
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by LeifonMars » Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:53 pm

oddstep wrote:d a d a d f# is pretty nice as well. it was only on reading nathann's post that i checked what notes my guitar was tuned to.
That would make D major. Lower that f# a semitone and you're already playing saddest of all keys.
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oddstep
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by oddstep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:16 pm

:lol: i'm sticking with the triumphal major. minor keys are too intelligent

perplex
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by perplex » Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:16 pm

im a c d# g man

Piplodocus
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by Piplodocus » Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:26 pm

H20nly wrote:
Piplodocus wrote:(From a classically trained trombonist who mostly played jazz for a few decades, but who still never learnt what the notes on his guitar were called in the last 15 years... :oops: )
something tells me that you can play the shit out of it anyway :wink:
Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I'm always too busy to practice, so I'm not that great. I spend half my song writing time re-recording the same crap because my playing's too loose, or deciding it all sounds dull as I haven't got enough new inspiration, or the theory and practice to do what I want quickly.

If I had the time to practice more and brush up on my theory more you guys might hear some finished songs from me!

H20nly
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by H20nly » Wed Jun 08, 2011 8:47 pm

^ :D yeah i delete wayyyyyyyy more takes than i keep too... doesn't necessarily mean they actually suck. i've got into this thing lately where i play a bass chop for a while, if i vary, no worries, i just keep playing. i then chop out the good bits and splice. composite bassline! i wish i could do the same with guitar, but i just end up playing it like a bass with higher sounding strings :roll: FAIL.
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azmills
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Re: WTF is 5th note?

Post by azmills » Sat Jun 11, 2011 8:58 am

My music life started as a cornet player. Got pretty good at it moved to trumpet became first chair and then after awhile other things became more important to me. I eventually discovered I loved the sound of 5ths by banging away at the black keys on a friends familys unused grand piano in a large basement room with an amazing natural reverb. From there I bought my 1st synth, a brand new yamaha cs 15. Monophonic with 2 oscillators I found I could detune it up or down to 3rds or 5ths. This was were all of my sound design came from. Still mostly black keys. I could get lost in that for hours creating imaginary soundscapes with much psychoacoustics happening. Almost subliminal. I referee to it as going under and that is still a goal of mine when I compose or perform. I love to take a crowd down along with me. It can be mesmerizing. I DJ this way too. A program like traktor makes it great to work this way & if I link in a sequenced acid synth or Maschine or my Machine drum via midi to that set up all the better.
AZ Mills: Dual 2.7gig G5, 5gig RAM, MBP 2.2gig C2D, 4gig RAM, Novation ReMote 25, Live 8 suite, Logic Pro 8 Studio, NI Maschine 1.6, various hardware & software

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