how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
yaddablah
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how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:11 pm

fugedaboudit.
Last edited by yaddablah on Wed Sep 14, 2011 1:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

abl385
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by abl385 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:19 pm

Without the use of loops.

yaddablah
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:22 pm

abl385 wrote:Without the use of loops.
what is it about loops...? I mean, I know they're obnoxious, but why?

ok, what's the point in asking that? I know what I need to do. You sort of reminded me that I used this medium as a composition scratchpad. Now I need to actually record the thing.

abl385
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by abl385 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:32 pm

It's just not original.

yaddablah
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:36 pm

abl385 wrote:It's just not original.
well wait a minute. every pop song that ever sold more than 10 copies features about two - four bass riffs. period. maybe some fills. maybe not.

you might be saying that "looping isn't original." But that's like saying that "typing" isn't original. Just because you use automation doesn't prevent your work from being original.

But maybe you're one of these hip hop kids, who thinks everything is a clip of someone else's playing.

I'll take that as a compliment.

mbird21
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by mbird21 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:38 pm

IMO if you listen to 99% of Beatport you hear several same fx on alot on artists tracks from a well known cd, ofc you entitled to say that about loops, but loops can be totally changed, split and sound entirely different. Dont agree with original point?, house music was built on loops and samples from records!
Alex!

yaddablah
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:44 pm

mbird21 wrote:IMO if you listen to 99% of Beatport you hear several same fx on alot on artists tracks from a well known cd, ofc you entitled to say that about loops, but loops can be totally changed, split and sound entirely different. Dont agree with original point?, house music was built on loops and samples from records!
yes, so it has. SO I see. becuase I use a bass clip and cut and paste it, instead of actually playing it 100 times, I'm "looping," and therefore the work "just isn't original."

Interesting feedback.

I do have to tell ya, I played all the instruments here (drums are midi, of course) and for someone to suggest I lifted them from someone else's work is a major backhanded compliment.
Last edited by yaddablah on Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mbird21
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by mbird21 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:45 pm

haha i dont judge on whats original and not, original is how the finished tune is, whateva you use or prefer to use to make it, take no notice dude.
Alex!

yaddablah
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:47 pm

mbird21 wrote:haha i dont judge on whats original and not, original is how the finished tune is, whateva you use or prefer to use to make it, take no notice dude.
It's all good.

abl385
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by abl385 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:50 pm

When I say loops I mean the use of readymade loops. You can use Garageband's loops and make a track entirely of them. I don't mind.. But that's not how Pink Floyd made music if you're still wondering.

yaddablah
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:55 pm

abl385 wrote:When I say loops I mean the use of readymade loops. You can use Garageband's loops and make a track entirely of them. I don't mind.. But that's not how Pink Floyd made music if you're still wondering.
Well, no, they didn't use someone else's loops, but they did record and dub, as does everybody. In fact, many of the sound effects were some of the first loops ever used (i.e. "cash" sounds on Money; overture at beginning of record). It was unique then. And of course, extremely well done.

These hooks and riffs are all mine. I guess it's good if they sound canned. They are "short" ideas, admittedly, I guess because I have a short attention span.

Although as originally stated, this wasn't the sound I wanted, now I feel compelled to defend it.

franknputer
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by franknputer » Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:20 pm

To be fair, DSOTM used loops too - they just had to do it with tape.

But, to the OP: I think your main issue is source-related. The ideas are fine, but the sounds seem a bit sterile. If your benchmark is DSOTM, remember you're comparing yourself against a pro studio using a pro mixing desk and analog tape to record real instruments (for the most part) in real spaces. (Then there's that whole Alan Parsons thing... :lol: )

Dunno what you have to work with, but try to get some warmth (tubes? ribbon mics? tape? plugins, even?) and space (real acoustical space if possible) in your sounds.

infiniteB
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by infiniteB » Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:57 pm

ok. here we go. loops or not don't matter. "non-loopers" can be great or suck. great ones still "borrow" concepts, scales, problem solving techniques, etc... "loopers" can be biting, unoriginal, uncreative pathetic f#$%s, or just unknowing, or amazing musicians that realize any sound, rhythm, etc. can be shaped into anything else--- trial and error, problem solving, clip begin and end points (down to millisecond), effects, arrangement, quantization/lack thereof, ive control, not being satisfied with the 50th "hit" within a creative process of one song, listening to 2 seconds for four hours making 500 decisions, going through 1000 sounds, breaking the rules, learning the rules, experimenting, stimuli, lack of stimuli, environment, volume and speaker set up, flat monitor speakers, cheap computer speakers, mistakes, errors, compression, ignoring the masses... all play equal parts. Anyone who knows music knows that the creative process is different for everyone... some find it harder than others, others choose not to make 500 "hit songs" in a year just to make them, others find enjoyment in falling asleep on the keyboard and waking up only when something hits them- something through trial and error that "wasn't supposed to happen" that for some reasons inspires them more than the 50 "hit basslines" they created and tossed aside. It all depends on the person. Most "producers" front or bite. I don't know why-- admitting you don't know something is the greatest place to be-- you have that much more room to learn and grow. Anyways, all these words can only point you in a direction. Ignore the "bad loop, bad" thing, but realize that yes, most people who use loops are not creative nor original. Neither are a lot of "unlooping" musicians. The same for 99 percent of "experimental" MFers-- who just turn a knob every minute for a new "squelch"... Find your way. Robert Plant 100 years ago would have had a "terrible" voice... It's all relative to understandings. Peace.
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yaddablah
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Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:54 pm

franknputer wrote:To be fair, DSOTM used loops too - they just had to do it with tape.

But, to the OP: I think your main issue is source-related. The ideas are fine, but the sounds seem a bit sterile. If your benchmark is DSOTM, remember you're comparing yourself against a pro studio using a pro mixing desk and analog tape to record real instruments (for the most part) in real spaces. (Then there's that whole Alan Parsons thing... :lol: )

Dunno what you have to work with, but try to get some warmth (tubes? ribbon mics? tape? plugins, even?) and space (real acoustical space if possible) in your sounds.

To the point , well. I know about the playing and cueing flubs. Was trying get at what was missing or shouldn't be missing to become a recording that sounds... clean, spacious, deep...????. You mentioned all things that matter. Acoustics? The acoustics consisted of a quarter inch line from an amp to my laptop...
Last edited by yaddablah on Sat Sep 03, 2011 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

yaddablah
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Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 12:02 am

Re: how do I make my tinny mix sound like Dark SIde of the Moon?

Post by yaddablah » Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:57 pm

infiniteB wrote:ok. here we go. loops or not don't matter. "non-loopers" can be great or suck. great ones still "borrow" concepts, scales, problem solving techniques, etc... "loopers" can be biting, unoriginal, uncreative pathetic f#$%s, or just unknowing, or amazing musicians that realize any sound, rhythm, etc. can be shaped into anything else--- trial and error, problem solving, clip begin and end points (down to millisecond), effects, arrangement, quantization/lack thereof, ive control, not being satisfied with the 50th "hit" within a creative process of one song, listening to 2 seconds for four hours making 500 decisions, going through 1000 sounds, breaking the rules, learning the rules, experimenting, stimuli, lack of stimuli, environment, volume and speaker set up, flat monitor speakers, cheap computer speakers, mistakes, errors, compression, ignoring the masses... all play equal parts. Anyone who knows music knows that the creative process is different for everyone... some find it harder than others, others choose not to make 500 "hit songs" in a year just to make them, others find enjoyment in falling asleep on the keyboard and waking up only when something hits them- something through trial and error that "wasn't supposed to happen" that for some reasons inspires them more than the 50 "hit basslines" they created and tossed aside. It all depends on the person. Most "producers" front or bite. I don't know why-- admitting you don't know something is the greatest place to be-- you have that much more room to learn and grow. Anyways, all these words can only point you in a direction. Ignore the "bad loop, bad" thing, but realize that yes, most people who use loops are not creative nor original. Neither are a lot of "unlooping" musicians. The same for 99 percent of "experimental" MFers-- who just turn a knob every minute for a new "squelch"... Find your way. Robert Plant 100 years ago would have had a "terrible" voice... It's all relative to understandings. Peace.
Geez welcome to my world for the last two months! And bump to Robert Plant, whose Zep voice I never dug but who I think might be the best songwriter of the generation.

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