ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live

Press Enter
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by Press Enter » Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:47 pm

You'll still need a Melodyne (editor/assitant/etc) license to do the Melodyne stuff. All this ARA thing does is remove the necessity for analysing the audio file within the DAW before doing the melodyne processes.

Analysis means 'recording' or 'capturing' the audio in real-time into the melodyne plugin.

If you're not using audio files, rather vstis + vsts controlled by midi, the same thing needs to be done - the audio needs to be captured first. An ever so slight workflow hiccup.

This ARA thing works with AUDIO files. it will skip the analysis/capture step in that scenario only. all other sequenced vsti stuff will need to be rendered/frozen first before ARA can be of use. Which is only a minor enhancement to the workflow, if even.

I mean, do you even own a melodyne license ? ... Threatening to 'definitely' ditch LIVE if it's not implemented 'soon' seems extremely melodramatic to me.

Unless I'm mistaken.



At any rate, as a melodyne user it's a welcome development, but please don't get your knickers twisted over this.

timothyallan
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by timothyallan » Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:23 pm

rikhyray wrote:If they dont I will definitely change my DAW, i want ARA, soon!
So you'd rather have Live become more bloated and slow?

Press Enter
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by Press Enter » Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:42 pm

^^ Evidently so, and for little gain.


So what DAW you switching to rikhy ?

rikhyray
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by rikhyray » Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:43 pm

timothyallan wrote:
rikhyray wrote:If they dont I will definitely change my DAW, i want ARA, soon!
So you'd rather have Live become more bloated and slow?
Oh,that was already delivered with M4L and version 8

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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by timothyallan » Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:48 pm

rikhyray wrote:
timothyallan wrote:
rikhyray wrote:If they dont I will definitely change my DAW, i want ARA, soon!
So you'd rather have Live become more bloated and slow?
Oh,that was already delivered with M4L and version 8
But yet you want to tack more stuff on? :)

Press Enter
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by Press Enter » Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:51 pm

ya, and at least M4L is worth the tax.

Plus the dude ignored my explanation of what ARA actually is.

He's got no clue what he's talking about in this case. I'm sure if we wanted to know about classical indian flute music he could school us though.

rikhyray
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by rikhyray » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:09 pm

If you watched the videos and still dont realize what it means to workflow, then it is probably useless for you. Anyway, I do not expect much from Ableton anymore. Hope against hope they come back to be truly innovative, after last 5 years of their chronic burnout . Good to see some interesting developments elsewhere.

Khazul
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by Khazul » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:28 am

As a melodyne dna user... +1 for live supporting this.
Nothing to see here - move along!

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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by simpleton » Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:15 am

rikhyray wrote: Oh,that was already delivered with M4L and version 8
True dat. A feature rammed down our throats. Live became unstable after that. I wonder what percentage of Live users subscribe to M4L?
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by dbfs » Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:56 am

simpleton wrote:
rikhyray wrote: Oh,that was already delivered with M4L and version 8
True dat. A feature rammed down our throats. Live became unstable after that. I wonder what percentage of Live users subscribe to M4L?
MaxMSP was already a buggy piece of shit on its own... Max 4 fags takes it to whole 'nother level. Of course it was going to fuck up Ableton. It was inevitable!

They dug their own grave adding that garbage to Live. Why they didn't break it down to two different version, or make it some sort of installable module for people who want that buggy shitstorm, was the stupidest fuckin decision they have ever made in regards to pushing this software forward. Now look at it... Even the most die hard fanboys are getting fuckin disappointed. You know you fucked up big time when your cult like followers are turning on you. :lol:

This shit is still crashing 2 years later doing the most basic of shit... You'd think they get a fuckin clue and separate this travesty into two versions. It's the only logical fuckin thing to do at this point...

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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by League » Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:01 pm

rikhyray wrote:http://www.celemony.com/cms/index.php?id=ara#top
http://www.celemony.com/cms/index.php?id=ara#top
If they dont I will definitely change my DAW, i want ARA, soon!
I'm happy with LIVE... don't care the rest

League :twisted:

UncleAge
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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by UncleAge » Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:22 pm

Seeing that new tech in Live is not an issue for me one way or the other really. Don't get me wrong, when I owned Melodyne I used it mostly for audio>midi conversion. So not having to jump out of the DAW to perform that action is nice. However, I already use Studio One.

What I found interesting in that video was that they used a new protocol/interface between the DAW and the ARA technology. Celemony has good market saturation at this point and it would be very interesting if they have come up with a new standard that offered developers a better way to build that mouse trap. And yes, I'm sure that most devs wouldn't want to develop yet another plugin standard. But RTAS/VST/AU and the rest are definitely not perfect. And a lot of devs stated that the VST 2.4 > 3 changes were not that big of a deal at all. So if someone has improved things a bit I'd like to know more.

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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by rikhyray » Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:28 pm

dbfs wrote:
simpleton wrote:
rikhyray wrote: Oh,that was already delivered with M4L and version 8
True dat. A feature rammed down our throats. Live became unstable after that. I wonder what percentage of Live users subscribe to M4L?
MaxMSP was already a buggy piece of shit on its own... Max 4 fags takes it to whole 'nother level. Of course it was going to fuck up Ableton. It was inevitable!

They dug their own grave adding that garbage to Live. Why they didn't break it down to two different version, or make it some sort of installable module for people who want that buggy shitstorm, was the stupidest fuckin decision they have ever made in regards to pushing this software forward. Now look at it... Even the most die hard fanboys are getting fuckin disappointed. You know you fucked up big time when your cult like followers are turning on you. :lol:

This shit is still crashing 2 years later doing the most basic of shit... You'd think they get a fuckin clue and separate this travesty into two versions. It's the only logical fuckin thing to do at this point...
Strong words, strong opinion- now you can expect shitstorm of condemnation from all the happy users of M4L on this board ( that means all 3 of them, since Ableton employees dont count, neither those silly enough to install M4L for free).
The whole Max concept is based of idea that the way to become concert instrumentalist is to slaughter a goat, tear intestines, dry them and twist to make strings, cut spruce,season it etc and make your own guitar or violin. If Max might be or not piece of musically useless junk is not the point, it is essential question do you want to be a mechanic or a driver, violinist or luthier ? Even if M4L worked properly, it is questionable or rather unquestionable that it is a tool for music creation supporting services not the musicians and/or composeres. The geeks/nerds @ Ableton drove this company to the bottom by integrating something that music creators never needed. They pleased their own geekness and dozen of passionate tweakers. There is long way from filter sweep on steroids to art, music as most of sane humanity perceives it.
Sorry, now you get me ranting but it is not even ridiculous anymore, it is beyond pathetic, Ableton released a buggy software 2 and half years back, 2 years ago admitted their error and still unable to fix it. Ableton is like a stubborn driver who missed a turn but keeps like a maniac driving wrong route with a illusory hope of getting to the destination "by some chance" instead of just turning back and taking the correct route.
I would pay 200€ upgrade/downgrade for "Maxless Live" aimed at performing musician, let say musicians in general and not geeks, nerds and tweakers but it better be 64 bit.

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Re: ARA - Ableton developers, better get it quick into Live

Post by oddstep » Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:54 pm

that's not a fair comparison. making music with a computer doesn't have to be about physical activity driving every musical event. max/msp has as much in common with a score or an extended technique as it does with making instruments from raw materials as an alternative to making music. yeah, adding it to Live has slowed down the development cycle - hard to say how much though, there's no parallel scenario to compare it with. ... how many versions of cubase/logic/sonar have there been during the same duration.

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