Where does sound designing come in?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
kanuck
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Where does sound designing come in?

Post by kanuck » Fri Dec 09, 2011 9:33 am

I'm sure this is more of a personal thing but while you're composing a song where exactly do you take out the synth and start creating the sounds? I'm stuck on if either I should write the parts first then make the synth parts later or make the synth sounds first then write the parts. Also, I'm just curious.

mharris
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by mharris » Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:48 am

You're right, it is a personal thing. But I like to get any musical content done first then focus on the specific sounds after. I can spend hours tweaking sounds so I like to know that a musical idea is worth it before I invest the time.

I used to work the other way around wasting time getting something that sounds amazing, only to ditch it because I didn't have anything interesting to do with it.

I also don't worry about any of the sounds too much until I have at least started some arrangement. This again ensures that the project is actually going somewhere before I spend hours deliberating how something should sound.

oddstep
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by oddstep » Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:37 am

about 70% of the time, I am making an instrument patch - it might be a sample or synthesis with some max or midi automation built in (like an arp or whatever) and during the noodling phase I come up with something I like. So thats sound design driving composition.
about 30% of the time I am using a simple sound, usually a triangle wave on operator because a melody or chord progression has got into my head.
its not an efficient way of working - I have a massive project called notes which is basically me recording clips of ideas generated during the noodling phase. Then when I want to make some new material for a performance or a recording I go through my notes project and listen to ideas I have made - if any of those prototracks seem to be still interesting (particularly if other people like them or better start playing/singing with them), then I begin developing these fragments into finished tracks. Generally the 70% of stuff generating by prannying around with synths gets dropped and the 30% of material generated by having a musical idea gets developed. However, its worth carrying on with the sound design because:
a) I can reuse those patches on tracks with better musical ideas - to give them a more distinctive voice
b) sometimes the behaviour of a patch can force me out of my standard musical prodedures - in much the same way as learning more about music theory can.

oddstep
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by oddstep » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:06 pm

:o

friend_kami
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by friend_kami » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:24 pm

the sound design for me if what inspires the the rest of it all.

oddstep
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by oddstep » Fri Dec 09, 2011 9:54 pm

innit

simmerdown
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by simmerdown » Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:14 pm

for me it is ongoing throughout the track creation, and different for every track

seldom (never) does a sound make it from beginning to end of the process without goiing thru a bunch of changes, you have to make it fit with the new sounds and such that are coming in all the time...

Music Vee
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by Music Vee » Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:14 pm

Different with every track for me. But although there is a lot of sense to arranging the production first, then playing with the sound afterwards, it barely works that way for me. Sound design can change your song and may lead you off in a different way than you would have gone otherwise. I prefer it to. Every tune comes out different then.
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gromgrom
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by gromgrom » Sun Dec 11, 2011 12:56 am

This is very personal :) Try whatever works best for you. I usually design a sound and pick a scale to mess around on. I might have a certain chord progression in mind from the beginning though and start my sound design from a specific objective.
Music is alive and doesn't obey static rules :) Do what you want!

Dr. Fluffenstein
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by Dr. Fluffenstein » Sun Dec 11, 2011 3:55 am

It really depends on the situation. I'll sometimes start with a patch that inspires me to turn it into a good melody or harmony. As I add more parts, I might realize that the original sound or the midi notes don't work well with the rest of the stuff. So I may change them around. I usually end up continuously changing drums, synth patches, melodies etc to get something that works better as a whole. So the point is that it's a fluid process with no exact rules (for me anyways). I may start a track with a patch, or a melody I hear in my head, but I often end up changing both so they suit each other more.


Sometimes I just spend time messing around with synths making new sounds or ones I hear in other songs and save them for a later day.

abletony84
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by abletony84 » Sun Dec 11, 2011 5:00 am

It's easier to get into the zone if the synth is tight. It's gonna help evoke the right emotions to take your piece where it needs to be..

Your melodies are probably still gonna suck though !! 999999 out of 1 million usually do..

invol
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by invol » Sun Dec 11, 2011 5:05 am

I find it useful to set aside time for sound design, templates, file management, etc, so when I am working I can grab something quickly that I already created. Sound design is interwoven into the whole process, but creating distinct workflows pays dividends in the long run.

abletony84
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by abletony84 » Sun Dec 11, 2011 5:18 am

heres what im talking about

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contrafact

For the same reason its easier to jam to moving soulful music
invol wrote:I find it useful to set aside time for sound design, templates, file management, etc, so when I am working I can grab something quickly that I already created. Sound design is interwoven into the whole process, but creating distinct workflows pays dividends in the long run.
+1

Hermanus
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by Hermanus » Sun Dec 11, 2011 12:02 pm

I would take it to the opposite.

Sound designs comes when I record something like a piano toy keys by keys, then I put these in sampler, audio untouched...
then the idea comes to tweak it like a crazy man thus leading me to have spacious weird piano vibes and a ubber pianotoy inside of live.

After this intense process, you can end with good materials for starting plenty of tracks.

3dot...
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Re: Where does sound designing come in?

Post by 3dot... » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:44 pm

sound design..in electronic music IS 50% of the writing process
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