finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta 'soon'...

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
puzzlefactory
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by puzzlefactory » Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:30 pm

Per note automation looks pretty handy too, will certainly be a time saver...

Jeroen
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by Jeroen » Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:35 pm

quote: "I think Bitwig and Live are from the same company, just another way to earn money by competing yourself! "

Indeed, they must have realized that the only way to solve major issues with Live is to start all over fresh, nothing CIA like.
the link with cycling would make them move too slow, that's why i think they (ableton, basically) is releasing a new product,
that solves all the repeated complaints once and for all. they used the good part of the code and removed the stuff they did
not like.

For me that makes sense that if they really want to innovate is that they will stop further dev of Live and there will be no Live 9

I am not sure why that would be CIA stuff
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glitchrock-buddha
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by glitchrock-buddha » Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:38 pm

I wasn't surprised to see the clip matrix but I was a bit surprised to see the bottom pane, containing devices in a side scrolling manner exactly like live. But then I thought about it, and for a mixer/clip view, it's really the only thing that makes sense. Sure it may be copying, but it's just sensible. It's like a traditional DAW having the channel strip for the selected track visible on the left while in arrange view. Logic did it first but now most do. It just makes sense. So for a loop performance style view I guess I'm not surprised to see the similarities. I wonder if racks are where they finally said "ok that's just too similar". ;) Hopefully not. Reason already had racks, but it's something sorely missing from several DAWs. But it's most important in a live performance style sequencer, so let's hope thy didn't leave that out. If/when they do, let's also hope they don't do something funny like put macros in groups of 6 and screw up all the hardware mapping. Judging by what seen so far it looks like they stick with what works.

I'm very excited by the "coming after v1" stuff. The ability to modify existing instruments is definitely cool and the sharing feature looks great for collaboration, as does jamming in the same document in different computers.

Can anyone make out anything on the fm synth? I see a couple envelopes but I can't really see anything recognizable as far as oscillators...

I wonder if there will be a vocoder that nobody needs. ;)
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rutgermuller
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by rutgermuller » Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:02 pm

Hopefully it will support surround sound plugins.

102455
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by 102455 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:19 pm

Sarrova-Q wrote:more innovative (implementation of M4L or the Bridge anyone?)
That's what I was thinking.

Ableton/Serato really let the side down with the frankly pathetic The Bridge implementation (IMO).

DJs were really disappointed with what it turned out to be, after all the hype.

If Bitwig can do the whole production/DJ blending thing better, it would be a big selling point.

Especially if it worked with software other than Scratch Live, and so wasn't so tied down to using
specific hardware.

That was one of the big fails for The Bridge. Established DJs have their choice of hardware and software already.

HeadrickProductions
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by HeadrickProductions » Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:31 pm

102455 wrote:
Sarrova-Q wrote:more innovative (implementation of M4L or the Bridge anyone?)
That's what I was thinking.

Ableton/Serato really let the side down with the frankly pathetic The Bridge implementation (IMO).

DJs were really disappointed with what it turned out to be, after all the hype.

If Bitwig can do the whole production/DJ blending thing better, it would be a big selling point.

Especially if it worked with software other than Scratch Live, and so wasn't so tied down to using
specific hardware.

That was one of the big fails for The Bridge. Established DJs have their choice of hardware and software already.

No one in this forum even cares about the bridge. I already owned everything so I was excited only to find out that is was weak at best. For those who do and read the survey they sent out there is alot of promise that they will implement some cool stuff down the line, but they better do it ASAP. But as it stand the bridge fails by most people's standards. Ableton just needs to bite the bullet and include MFL at no cost to say i'm sorry for the horrible live 8 BS. Or a very cheap upgrade. I love BW simply for the fact that it makes ableton really take stock of what they are going to WOW us with next.

AS far a MFL they have to wait on C74 to do anything which REALLY slows down everything and makes for a buggy nightmare to release max 6 debug, then MFL debug, etc
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HeadrickProductions
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by HeadrickProductions » Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:36 pm

glitchrock-buddha wrote:I wonder if there will be a vocoder that nobody needs. ;)
worst vocoder EVER :mrgreen:
In a K induced Haze (the old K kind not the special K kind ), but an Asian spizz can sometimes bring me out! If ya don't get it, ya never will.

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pgmjsd
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by pgmjsd » Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:36 pm

Regarding bitwig being Live 9 - Maybe. I think at least there must be some agreement between the two companies.

This is coming from a 20+ year software engineering veteran, FWIW.

Most software companies (here in the US at least) have non-compete agreements preventing key employees from using proprietary knowledge (which the company paid for them to learn) to build a competing product for specific time period after they leave the company. The only way to really avoid non-compete lawsuits is to wait it out. It seems strange to me that a successful company like Ableton would just let go of key employees like that. Maybe the bitwig guys worked around that by agreeing to let Ableton use some of their technology? Maybe the employment laws / practices in Germany are different?

Ableton might also be an investor. Starting a software company requires some *very patient* investors, and the lead time often cannot be reduced by pouring more capital into it.

I could see Ableton letting these guys form their own company as a think tank, and even letting them build a competing product if they can get libraries and tools out of it.

kb420
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by kb420 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:01 pm

Three things that Bitwig doesn't seem to have that I would definitely need.

1. A Crossfader.

2. Track Groups.

3. Groove Extraction.


They may all be there, but I just can't see it in that demo video or from reading through the website.
H20nly wrote:fuck Bitwig.

Monchai
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by Monchai » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:03 pm

is ableton going to say anything about this at all?

HeadrickProductions
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by HeadrickProductions » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:04 pm

the crossfader is huge! And still have not seen the 8 macro setup either

There are going to be lots of things that bitwig does not have that Live will and same goes for BW. Time will tell
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synnack
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by synnack » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:13 pm

Initially this seemed pretty exciting. But after a few hours of staring at the screenshots I forgot what I was excited about.

My initial thoughts: http://www.synnack.com/blog/post/48/bit ... -announced
Last edited by synnack on Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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moonpie
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by moonpie » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:19 pm

Are people seriously considering Ableton is secretly releasing Live 9 as... well not Live 9?? Bitwig must be both laughing and crying with their effort so. It would be ludicrous to change the brand and lose part of the user base. Its impossible - I mean really - ok it might be "possible" on an internet forum but how often is that grounded in actual reality?! Ok, its fun to read and theorize - but seriously guys - no-one reasonable could actually think this. Bitwig obviously "share" some of its aesthetic with Ableton (the current ableton anyways - we dont know what Live 9 will hold) but theyre a competing brand pure and simple.

ze2be
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Re: finally... BITWIG STUDIO! beta soon...

Post by ze2be » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:41 pm

moonpie wrote:Are people seriously considering Ableton is secretly releasing Live 9 as... well not Live 9?? Bitwig must be both laughing and crying with their effort so. It would be ludicrous to change the brand and lose part of the user base. Its impossible - I mean really - ok it might be "possible" on an internet forum but how often is that grounded in actual reality?! Ok, its fun to read and theorize - but seriously guys - no-one reasonable could actually think this. Bitwig obviously "share" some of its aesthetic with Ableton (the current ableton anyways - we dont know what Live 9 will hold) but theyre a competing brand pure and simple.
The mixer with sends, the matrix, most of the plugs (see the compresor!), the drum rack, the device view, the transport, the overall layout.. It looks exactly like Live!
But then there is more selection tools, like a knife and a rubber, and lots of other nice improvements.. To me it looks more like Live 10 then Live 9..
? ? ? ? ?

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