henke in london

[jellycaster]

i'll tell you tomorrow...

[slatepipe]

how was it?

i don't know, we haven't gone there yet

[JuanSOLO]

OH, I thought it was yesterday, sorry.

[jellycaster]

I found this to be a very useful and thought-provoking talk. I didn't take notes but these were a couple of the points covered -

Prof Henke covered the difference between instruments and tools, and how studios and production software fit somewhere between the two. We expect tools to respond in a linear way to inputs, but part of the magic of music comes from the 'controlled suprise' of instruments - the example given was pushing a signal on analogue tape resulting in distortion, whereas a signal can be multiplied on a computer without this effect.

Workflow - how an idea gets 'finished'. He described how we get to 'dead ends' in projects which may be interesting ideas in themselves, but for whatever reason aren't suitable for what we are working on. He suggested that to improve workflow, DAWs should make retreiving these 'dead ends' easier. He also said that the folder system of organising data is getting out of date, and noted the new ipad ios does not use a folder system. I thought the logical extension of this would be to 'tag' files with certain keywords, rather than put them in a particular folder. For my part, in my next ableton session I intend to create a 'dead ends' folder, where i will put clips that i think might be useful for future projects. I already sort of do this but will try to be more disciplined.

Thankfully, there were no embarassing questions on timing or content of live 9. It would be tempting, given what Henke was describing in the evolution of music software, to assume that the next version will focus on an upgraded workflow (and streamlining of publishing / collaborating) rather than just new instruments / effects. But obviously that is pure speculation!

There was a question about Bitwig, which Gerhard Behles answered very professionally with his CEO hat on, saying that imitation amounted to a validation of Live's interface (as if it needed one!)

This is a fraction of what was discussed, and i'm sure others can add... it was filmed so perhaps it will appear on the IET website at some point. Overall a great lecture, many thanks to Gerhard and Robert if you are reading.

[Slightlydelic]

I thought the logical extension of this would be to 'tag' files with certain keywords, rather than put them in a particular folder. For my part, in my next ableton session I intend to create a 'dead ends' folder, where i will put clips that i think might be useful for future projects. I already sort of do this but will try to be more disciplined.

One of the reasons I recently switched to mac and bought Audio finder was to do exactly that.

[starving student]

how is tagging an audio file and putting it in a dead ends folder any different than naming a file and putting it in a folder, and regarding the ipad isn't that the chief complaint about the ipad? depending on the cloud to get you through the day is akin to depending on a fairy to get you through life, it might sound nice but in practice it seems not to be working.
there's nothing like going to the drawer where you put your red socks, taking them out of that drawer and putting them on, it's tried, true, and tested, are we to believe that just throwing a pair of red socks in a room on the floor full of socks is going to be a better option just because we wrote 'red socks' on the tag?

[H20nly]

no, but apparently keeping the red socks floating outside and only reachable through a dependence on a third party is attractive to some people.

[Slightlydelic]

if you don't see the point that's cool.

but i like having instant access to my old material based on its audio content rather than in the context of the ableton project it was created in. at the moment that can only be done efficiently through 3rd party software. even then it doesn't really come close to the workflow i really want.

in an ideal world every sound, sample and loop i have whether audio or midi would be loaded as a clip into a single Ableton session view for instant access, their would be no browser, because session view becomes the browser.

[beats me]

how is tagging an audio file and putting it in a dead ends folder any different than naming a file and putting it in a folder, and regarding the ipad isn't that the chief complaint about the ipad?

[H20nly]

in an ideal world every sound, sample and loop i have whether audio or midi would be loaded as a clip into a single Ableton session view for instant access, their would be no browser, because session view becomes the browser.

i don't know what search tools you're using, but if it were my perfect world dream... i would search folders named "samples" or "audio" (can't remember what Live names them ATM) in the project folders then drag those bad boy audio files you want in your MEGASET into just a that... a mega set.

you can even set it to be your template set which should give you plenty of time to make a sandwich and grab beer while Live opens.

[starving student]

no, but apparently keeping the red socks floating outside and only reachable through a dependence on a third party is attractive to some people.

ok so is this only the case as delic is saying , whether or not the session view becomes the browser or not (of course to each his own delic i'm just trying to get an idea)
would having all of the samples in session view be more confusing though that's subjective better word might be less organized than the actual browser?

[the unknown wanderer]

I was their with Alex smoke, the guy who presented the talk had the worst presentation skills I have ever seen. Roberts presentation, started well, but in the end it was not academic enough for me.I would have preferred more mathematics. When Robert started he used one equation to show the difference between structure and process. But it was not enough for me and I would have loved it if he stayed down that route.

[H20nly]

no, but apparently keeping the red socks floating outside and only reachable through a dependence on a third party is attractive to some people.

ok so is this only the case as delic is saying , whether or not the session view becomes the browser or not (of course to each his own delic i'm just trying to get an idea)
would having all of the samples in session view be more confusing, though that's subjective better word might be less organized, than the actual browser?

i guess it depends on how you arrange them in the session view, but that's just it... you're in the same boat. one way or another you have to organize them at some point by using a little manual type effort. automagic would require a change in the way Live works IMO.

how is Live supposed to know that you don't like take 7, 9, 13, 24, and so forth?? so if you are bringing in material that is already in its final bite sized (one shot, loop, etc.) form then you can arrange them by frequency range or sound... you know, like a library but what about recording audio?

i suppose you could set your temp directory to be your project folder

[starving student]

alas only guru has the ability to organize by frequency, hats off to angus for trying to wrangle that feature successfully

[dna598]

I was there too. We all left early.