research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
3dot...
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Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:10 pm

Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by 3dot... » Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:02 pm

I'm having huge problems with reaktor-fx (5.6) vst..

for the life of me... can't get the phase to align on the return...
dropping it in a return..
it seems to render even the live manual compensation useless
(at least for negative delay values)

now I can either live with it..
or stop using reaktor on the returns altogether ?
tough choice...

that Ableton sound everyone is talking about....
must be the "out of phase returns" sound...

for now..I'll give it a rest... (I'm hearing bees already..)
and try to judge my sounds objectively...
also try to record out of phase fx to audio and correct the alignment there..

I wonder if the new 'waves' plugin ("in-phase") could be a cure to this..
might be less than ideal... but TIMING seams to be Lives' MAIN WEAKNESS !!!
first the midi-sync jitter.. solved...but this here is a serious issue..
and we're 3 years in (!!!)

if I had more time I would thoroughly test it against other DAWS ..
and check more vsts...
but I'm doing this while I work... (which is a 'bother' to my process..in itself..)
I'm tired of bringing up (serious) troubles with L8 ...again and again and again andagain...

please Ableton...
can we please have a STABLE version of Live ? one with a high level of fidelity ?
the returns and sending tracks need to be IN PHASE... just like you'd expect from a regular ol' mixer..
and also... can you please acknowledge there is a problem(s) ?
maybe file it under "known issues" ... so all users will know this ?
(or maybe there already is... and I don't know about..
in that case please point me to that post..
so I can be updated about known technical issues of each version)

many thanks.

this "fragmentation" is beginning to really get on my nerves...
say you have timing issues...
you don't know if you should talk to Ableton...Native Instruments... or Cycling '74..
and you know the support drill ... but multiply it
(* how many comapnies are running in your set)
something is off with the software and you need to be the QA for a commercially released software..
all the while each software company drops the ball at the others' court..

I understand all the complexities of software programming..

but beginning to lean towards companies that have a but more responsibility..
and beginning to understand why digidesign is the "industry standard"..
for one thing..they don't promise what their software can't deliver...
this is why they charge a bunch for hd systems and get paid..
because the product is reliable !

as you can probably guess I'm a bit pissed..
as a sortof "ambasador" for my weapon of choice...
I find myself in the past few years making up excuses to explain these issues to other people..
no more..

rant to be continued :twisted: off to the bar...
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Valiumdupeuple
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by Valiumdupeuple » Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:56 am

Don't worry 3dot, in decades this pdc error will be the sound everyone's after, so vintage!
:D

carrieres
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by carrieres » Fri Mar 02, 2012 1:11 pm

this is very annoying, everyone else is doing it, why not us ?
Yamaha CS-30, Roland SH-1 and MKS70, Focusrite Scarlett 18i6, Yamaha FS1R, Oberheim Matrix 1000, Novation Remote 37SL, Alesis M1Active 520, Novation Launchpad PRO
Intel i7-7700HQ, Windows 10, Ableton Live 10 Suite
http://soundcloud.com/ccarrieres

shuutobi
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by shuutobi » Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:56 pm

I've noticed this a long time, I just started using devices 100% wet on sends, and accept their delay...
The Reverb and Saturator were the first to bring it to my attention.

:(
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ckluxen
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:05 pm

Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by ckluxen » Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:16 am

What about returns in drum racks? Do they compensate?
Besides has anyone tested 3rd Party Plugs in Renoise?

DangerousDave
Posts: 799
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Location: LA

Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by DangerousDave » Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:37 am

bookmarked
https://soundcloud.com/unearthproductions
beats me wrote:everybody around you thinks you’re a fucking idiot.

simpli.cissimus
Posts: 518
Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 5:33 pm

Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by simpli.cissimus » Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:16 pm

Where are all the great Live-trainer, supporter and defenders now ?

Usually they jump in right away and keep telling people how stupid they are
and that Live is totally O.K. !!!

Seems they don't read this thread...

...or been quietly learning another DAW... :mrgreen:

Reminds me of that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWKpLEJ ... =endscreen
Last edited by simpli.cissimus on Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
No! I'll never use the Push-App Live 9 !!!

ze2be
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Location: Mos Eisley

Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by ze2be » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:07 pm

Im getting latency on a project right now that sounds like an echo effect. Dont know what the heck im going to do, and its going to be released really soon.

Ill make shore to let the forum and Ableton support know about it after some further research with my partner. I have finished and released loads of similare tracks with the same hardware and software setup, so I dont really understand why this happens now.

If I pull up a send with nothing on it, no effects, it gets like 1/4th a second delay, thus it actually creates a delay effect on the sound running through it!
? ? ? ? ?

3dot...
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by 3dot... » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:20 pm

any m4l devices in there ?
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ze2be
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by ze2be » Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:59 am

3dot... wrote:any m4l devices in there ?
Nope..
? ? ? ? ?

3dot...
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by 3dot... » Wed May 23, 2012 6:33 pm

bump..
we're still on 8.3 :oops:
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hacktheplanet
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by hacktheplanet » Wed May 23, 2012 6:37 pm

simpli.cissimus wrote:Where are all the great Live-trainer, supporter and defenders now ?

Usually they jump in right away and keep telling people how stupid they are
and that Live is totally O.K. !!!
Probably because this is one of the few issues that seems not to be the same old subjective "problems" people have. ;)
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ze2be
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by ze2be » Thu May 24, 2012 1:26 am

Heres the post about my situation so far. I will write support in the morning.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=180529&start=0
? ? ? ? ?

pencilrocket
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Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by pencilrocket » Fri May 25, 2012 5:12 pm

As far as I know in every daw user doesn't mix dry sound with dry/wet sound. These dry parts cause phase issue unless you use zero latency effect. Most plugins have latency especially when they do oversample, complex compression and so on, and the latency can vary according to their paremeters.
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ze2be
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Location: Mos Eisley

Re: research...These Live Devices do not compensate delays :

Post by ze2be » Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:17 am

Bump ;)
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