Finding the note of a random sound

[plox]

How do you guys take a random sound and tune it properly to the sampler?

I may be wrong here however...
-Take random sound ; in this case a grain stream of a field recording
-Analyse this with melodyne editor
-In melodyne change scale to c major
-Highlight all information of sound and double click to conform it to desired scale
-In Melodyne i find the 'base note' (the lowest note in the freq analysis) - and move this C3 (other information stay relative to this base n...
-resample back into ableton
-Make C3 the 'default' note in sampler after importing it

Am i doing this completly wrong?
How would you guys go about doing this?

My aim is to take a random medium to short sound and tune it so it plays like any instrument would..

Just simply importing a sound into sampler doesnt tune it obviously,
The above method doesnt seem to always provide the desired results... Ide like to take any sound no matter it timbre-pitch etc and tune it correctly.

Thanks!!

[spfanok]

How do you guys take a random sound and tune it properly to the sampler?

I may be wrong here however...
-Take random sound ; in this case a grain stream of a field recording
-Analyse this with melodyne editor
-In melodyne change scale to c major
-Highlight all information of sound and double click to conform it to desired scale
-In Melodyne i find the 'base note' (the lowest note in the freq analysis) - and move this C3 (other information stay relative to this base n...
-resample back into ableton
-Make C3 the 'default' note in sampler after importing it

Am i doing this completly wrong?
How would you guys go about doing this?

My aim is to take a random medium to short sound and tune it so it plays like any instrument would..

Just simply importing a sound into sampler doesnt tune it obviously,
The above method doesnt seem to always provide the desired results... Ide like to take any sound no matter it timbre-pitch etc and tune it correctly.

Thanks!!

That's an expensive method haha.

I'd just use spectrum. Group the sampler with an operator patch and just do it by ear and check with spectrum.

Sometimes it helps to pitch the sound up 3 or 4 octaves so you can actually hear the tune of it a little easier.

[fishmonkey]

there is no completely foolproof method of working out 'the' pitch of any sound, as pitch is a subjective thing.

musical pitches are often talked about in relation to actual wave frequencies, however there isn't a direct correspondence between the two.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitch_%28music%29

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitch_detection_algorithm

[plox]

there is no completely foolproof method of working out 'the' pitch of any sound, as pitch is a subjective thing.

musical pitches are often talked about in relation to actual wave frequencies, however there isn't a direct correspondence between the two.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitch_%28music%29

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitch_detection_algorithm

So i guess a good method here would be to first FORCE the sound into a pitch (or close to)

- thanks

[fishmonkey]

there is no completely algorithmic way of doing it, you need to use your ears.

even knowing the lowest frequency in a sound will not necessarily tell you its perceived pitch.

[plox]

yeh i realise this...
you can get pretty close with anything though cant you?

hmm so transposing it to a new scale can be a good first step? - this would shift the harmonic content of the sample into one that matches the scale -

[regretfullySaid]

[beatmunga]

I don't like, and have never liked, the new fangled fancy modern phrase which you crazy kids use all the time these days, but shadx312, you really have just made me..ahem,.. "laugh out loud".

(oh, and +1 on using your ears)

[regretfullySaid]

Glad to be of service

[dna598]

In all my years (decades) doing music I have never ever heard of a "random grain stream of a field recording"

This is not star trek mate lol.

Seriously, just get a guitar or a piano and find the note that you have specified using YOUR EARS.

Then put that sound on the same note in a sampler. End of story.

[fishmonkey]

hey, the picture made me laugh too, however in fairness he/she never wrote "random grain stream", the example of a "random sound" was a "grain stream of a field recording".

and "grain stream" is the term used to describe how a sound is represented in granular synthesis...

[regretfullySaid]

It doesn't sound like his original plan is off really, but if melodyne is conforming the content into the scale then why should you have to move the base note when it should already be there? Then I'm assuming you're matching the rest of the notes from melodyne to the sampler and filling in the gaps by stretching some of the zones? Are you sure melodyne has rendered the desired results before bringing them into sampler?
Maybe someone else could answer this off hand, but would there be an issue with how some of the Root Notes are assigned in Sampler?

In another defense I don't think this is a matter of simply matching the most prominent freuqency of the whole recording to C, because the audio is split up in melodyne so all the prominent frequencies are shifted to match the notes they're closest to in a scale (ie polyphonic vs monophonic)

Showing it on youtube sounds like a good idea to pinpoint where the problem is.

I mean, if melodyne is doing it's job then it should be forcing the content to the closest pitches, no?

[chapelier fou]

use your ears. !
One way is to create a track with an operator for instance, and compare them when playing the same note.

[oddstep]

The lowest note of a melodyned audio sequence wouldn't have to be the scale note. If the processed sequence had b as its lowest note playing that 'melody' from c could create some serious atonality if it was stretched a pitch range on a sampler as part of a composition in c major. Tuning by ear is the only way.... If it sounds good it is good.

[plox]

Thanks for the responses. I tend to agree.

The lowest note of a melodyned audio sequence wouldn't have to be the scale note. If the processed sequence had b as its lowest note playing that 'melody' from c could create some serious atonality if it was stretched a pitch range on a sampler as part of a composition in c major. Tuning by ear is the only way.... If it sounds good it is good.

yeh i was thinking this too... i have been tuning by ear since forever as the technology was never present to do the job for me (lazy). So i guess i was just curious as to whether there was a shortcut these days with progs like Melodyne and Pitchmap. Agreed matey, if it sounds good it sounds good
These pitch correction progs have some amazing applications though dont you think? especially with dissonant samples!

It doesn't sound like his original plan is off really, but if melodyne is conforming the content into the scale then why should you have to move the base note when it should already be there? Then I'm assuming you're matching the rest of the notes from melodyne to the sampler and filling in the gaps by stretching some of the zones? Are you sure melodyne has rendered the desired results before bringing them into sampler?
Maybe someone else could answer this off hand, but would there be an issue with how some of the Root Notes are assigned in Sampler?
In another defense I don't think this is a matter of simply matching the most prominent freuqency of the whole recording to C, because the audio is split up in melodyne so all the prominent frequencies are shifted to match the notes they're closest to in a scale (ie polyphonic vs monophonic)
Showing it on youtube sounds like a good idea to pinpoint where the problem is.
I mean, if melodyne is doing it's job then it should be forcing the content to the closest pitches, no?

yes man exactly! The root note is the main problem here. However in saying this, when melodyne 'corrects' the sound to put it to scale it forces it in a new direction on the sampler and when mixed with the originl, acts as somewhat of an in-key harmony. Sounds good. The main problem is finding what note its closest too, as mentioned by the majority this is done by ear. But i do think theres a way in finding what the note of any sound corrected in melodyne is.

Original sample -> analyse in meoldyne -> correct to Cm -> what note is it now?

In all my years (decades) doing music I have never ever heard of a "random grain stream of a field recording"

This is not star trek mate lol.

Seriously, just get a guitar or a piano and find the note that you have specified using YOUR EARS.

Then put that sound on the same note in a sampler. End of story.

heh.. really? you havent heard granular synth/processing before? take a field recording and process it using something like RTGS-X or Henke M4L grain processor etc.. pretty standard.
..been doing instrument method since i started... looking for new way..
but thanks for the tip

hey, the picture made me laugh too, however in fairness he/she never wrote "random grain stream", the example of a "random sound" was a "grain stream of a field recording".

and "grain stream" is the term used to describe how a sound is represented in granular synthesis...

legend... cheers