kontakt versus sampler

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ian_halsall
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kontakt versus sampler

Post by ian_halsall » Fri Aug 17, 2012 9:44 am

I own Kontakt but I haven't used it for a few years and then I only used it with Cubase.

I am running up against the limitations of simpler and was thinking of using Kontakt again (I have forgotten how to use it so I need to relearn quite a lot) but then I thought it might be best to pay for Sampler and use that instead.

Does Sampler have any really cool features like auto slicing which are tightly bound to Live and which would be tricky in Kontakt?

Advice?

remute99
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by remute99 » Fri Aug 17, 2012 9:51 am

ian_halsall wrote:I own Kontakt but I haven't used it for a few years and then I only used it with Cubase.

I am running up against the limitations of simpler and was thinking of using Kontakt again (I have forgotten how to use it so I need to relearn quite a lot) but then I thought it might be best to pay for Sampler and use that instead.

Does Sampler have any really cool features like auto slicing which are tightly bound to Live and which would be tricky in Kontakt?

Advice?
Sampler has been languishing for a very long time and is really, really no competition for Kontakt. If it was free with Live I'd say yes, use it but the idea of paying for it, hell no.
Even Short Circuit gets more use here.
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ian_halsall
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by ian_halsall » Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:04 am

what's short circuit? apart from being a crap children's film

ShelLuser
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by ShelLuser » Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:49 am

ian_halsall wrote:Does Sampler have any really cool features like auto slicing which are tightly bound to Live and which would be tricky in Kontakt?
Feature wise Kontakt can do much more than Sampler but I don't think you can really compare these two one on one. Because Kontakt is a stand-alone sampler device / instrument. Meaning; it isn't tied to any particular DAW so it should provide every feature (closely) related to using a sampling device because it cannot rely on features provided by the underlying environment.

Sampler otoh sits on Live. As such it doesn't provide all the features which Kontakt has, simply because Live itself also fills in a lot of those blanks. Take the slicing you mentioned here; that's where Live's warping engine comes into play. Allowing you to chop up an audio piece and "slice to midi" puts all the samples into their own Simpler device inside the drumrack.

In short; Sampler has its zone editor, allows for sample layering, can apply modulation, filtering, specific playbacks (reverse, detune, volume, loop, etc.) and allows you control playback through incoming MIDI (for example; allowing velocity to determine the sample playback time)...

As said I don't think you can fairly compare this to Kontakt. All I can say is that Sampler sits nicely in the Ableton workflow, and if that's the workflow you're used to it could make sense to pick it up.
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ian_halsall
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by ian_halsall » Fri Aug 17, 2012 12:37 pm

that's what I thought - the slicing with simpler is a bit rudimentary one of the most noteworthy omissions in simpler is reverse and the inability to edit groups of samples in one go

so if you slice up something into 100 pieces and you later want to edit them all it's a real pain

i already have kontakt and I like it but I never used all the super funky features like filters and lfos and reverbs and stuff because they were all availiable in cubase pretty much

I like the live workflow and much as it pains me to buy another sampler I feel I may be going in that direction - On Direction - great band by the way!

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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by ian_halsall » Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:24 pm

checked out a few kontakt youtube vids - all came back to me - not buying sampler

yet...

glitchrock-buddha
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by glitchrock-buddha » Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:28 pm

If you already own Kontakt, do not buy another sampler. You don't need it. Although Kontakt is modular and can do very complex things like scripting etc., you don't need to know about all that. You just need to get your head around applying basic modulators like an envelope/lfo and applying that to, say a filter or the amp. That will give you the basic layout of sampler and traditional subtractive synths/samplers.

Kontakt has great slicing, pretty much the best out there and it's pretty easy to use (although there are a lot of little buttons, you only need to know a few). Slicing in Kontakt is better than with simpler/sampler because the slices stay in the same device, meaning it's easier to re-edit.

Kontakt also has pitch shifting indepedant of time duration, meaning you can sample a sound that has some rhythmic element and it won't get out of time up and down the keyboard when you change pitch. Sampler sorely does not have this, which has always boggled my mind since Live's entire paradigm was to be able to change tempo without changing pitch and vice versa, yet they didn't apply this basic principle to sampler, which is the most useful feature in a sampler these days.
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by ian_halsall » Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:41 pm

one thing that is nice about the slicing in live is that you can modulate the sample start and end of all the slices at the same time

and I can't remember if when you do this in kontakt it moves the start of the entire slice group or of each of the slices

or both

how is the interaction between live and vsts in general and specifically with kontakt?

I have always assumed that it would cause more problems than just using ableton's devices - more crashes, freezes etc..

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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by glitchrock-buddha » Fri Aug 17, 2012 3:10 pm

ian_halsall wrote:one thing that is nice about the slicing in live is that you can modulate the sample start and end of all the slices at the same time

and I can't remember if when you do this in kontakt it moves the start of the entire slice group or of each of the slices

or both

how is the interaction between live and vsts in general and specifically with kontakt?

I have always assumed that it would cause more problems than just using ableton's devices - more crashes, freezes etc..
No it's pretty much the same. The one thing about Kontakt is that you have to manually assign which controls are automatable in Kontakt before you configure them to be automatable in Live (Go to the auto tab in kontakt and drag the automation ID slot over a knob or control, then press configure in ableton device and touch that control in kontakt).
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ian_halsall
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by ian_halsall » Fri Aug 17, 2012 3:58 pm

ok, cool

back to kontakt it is then

condra
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by condra » Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:35 pm

I hate Kontakt.

The GUI is chaotic. It's a CPU hog. It's over complex for 99% of my needs.

For creative sampling, Simpler, Sampler, Drum Racks, and Instrument Racks are more than enough for my needs, and the tight integration with Live is amazing.

For a Rompler, I use good old Sampletank, maxed the fuck out.

Hermanus
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by Hermanus » Sat Aug 18, 2012 12:52 am

Sampler becomes interesting when you go to making LFOs interacting each others.
Set the start and lenght of your sample(s) to destinations, tweak a bit and have a long attack... Marvel at hand

But I kind of agree, you cant compare kontakt and sampler, not really the same thing

It's like comparing a room vs the whole building :lol:

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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by sparklepuff » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:48 am

Kontakt all the way, that kit is my jam. When I want to mangle up a sample and do granular synthesis with it Sampler is my go to. But for making music with beautifully crafted ensembles Kontakt is tough to beat. So many great third party libraries out there.
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mr.ergonomics
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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by mr.ergonomics » Sat Aug 18, 2012 12:27 pm

I have both and I use sampler way way more for my own samples, it's just so much faster and if you like to loop small sample-parts it's actually better at it.
The only thing I really miss is timestretching, so that samples at different pitches have the same length. and the drag and drop from audio into sampler is a killer feature.

and kontakts gui is bad, I do agree. I like the rack concept, but you should have the possibility to have two columns of racks instead of just one.

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Re: kontakt versus sampler

Post by Serra » Sat Aug 18, 2012 2:16 pm

kontakt has some gret libraries!

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