APC40 v.s PUSH

[OzWozEre]

- then, for those versed in music theory, means the people who would actually understand and be able to use the scale layout of push, i doubt this could replace a conventional keyboard as that is what most of them are used to. all the others would just hit random buttons and get random notes - u can actually recongnize this behavior in the promo video!

Actually, this feature is was what excited me the most...

As someone who has a big 88 key controller I was looking to get one of those stupid-little-mini-keyboard-midi-controllers-thingys as a way to just have *something* small and neat in front of me to simply "enter notes into the DAW".

I'm not interested in playing piano or whatever when I'm making tracks/composing/arranging I just want a convenient input device, and this seems like a really neat way to go.

I also think the way the "keys" are shown on the device actually complement those who understand music theory (I'm not sure if that was your point) -- I find it quite refreshing...

... it kinda reminded me of this exotic input device that costs $1000+

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5CXEi1StWk

[JuanSOLO]

Someone made a good point over on the Maschine forum, that putting the encoders above the lcd screen is a bit of a silly idea as your arms are going to block the view of the screen.

my thoughts exactly..

fools,
it does not block the view, especially of the knob you are turning.

[esky]

I think they can live happily together side by side. For example the APC could use the nativeKontrol script and serve as a remote control for Live, Push is responsible for the performance domain...
I don't see any versus here if there is enough space on the table...

[Tarekith]

The APC40 for me was always a live performance tool, I never really had much use for it when writing in the studio (just the way I work). Push looks to be much more production oriented, I can definitely see using this while writing.

[h3rtz]

The APC40 for me was always a live performance tool, I never really had much use for it when writing in the studio (just the way I work). Push looks to be much more production oriented, I can definitely see using this while writing.

it's interesting to see how much the working styles seem to differ. most people (from what i recognized) saw the advantages of the two vice versa - push for performance, apc for production.

[JuanSOLO]

push for performance, apc for production.

I'm confused by that somewhat.
The APC40 doesn't offer much, it's ergonomically crippled and cheaply built.
It only began to excel with M4L patches, Bomes presets, and remote scripts.
If you had a NanoKontrol 2 (or any fader/knob controller) and a Push, the APC40 would be redundant.

ALSO, all the power lies in the programming, not the controllers.
The PUSH features will translate to ALL other controllers via remote scripts.
We will see some killer hacks soon after release of Live 9.

What makes PUSH awesome is that it's been designed to address those feature changes. A lot of great ideas from previous remote scripts have obviously been implemented.
If it does not come with waveform editing, it could be implemented as long as Live 9 allows for that, unless the LCD screen have waveform limitations?

If it does not already allow for putting FX on drumRack sends, I can already think of a workaround for that.

After 3 years of using and abusing an APC40 along with a lot of other crap, I'd say PUSH is meticulously thought out. And I bet after using it "as is" for over a year or so, it really will feel like you turned your Laptop into an instrument.

Again though, that is more about accessing Live 9, remote scripting etc, controllers are just the hardware interface.

Whats I really funny is the whole bitwig thing.
People are all about the Clip Automation, and bitwig was claiming that feature, with NO PROOF.
Ableton drops that video with proof and a bad ass controller to boot.

[Poster]

Someone made a good point over on the Maschine forum, that putting the encoders above the lcd screen is a bit of a silly idea as your arms are going to block the view of the screen.

my thoughts exactly..

fools,
it does not block the view, especially of the knob you are turning.

really?

just checked with Maschine by turning it 180 degrees;
not saying my hand fully blocks the screen but it's far from ideal..
also because you're blocking the other parameters..

[Mr-Bit]

hmmm look at screens then choose knob, you allready know which...er... knob your holding

[JuanSOLO]

just checked with Maschine by turning it 180 degrees;
not saying my hand fully blocks the screen but it's far from ideal..
also because you're blocking the other parameters..

funny because you can only look at one parameter at once.
human limitation.

[h3rtz]

push for performance, apc for production.

I'm confused by that somewhat.
The APC40 doesn't offer much, it's ergonomically crippled and cheaply built.
It only began to excel with M4L patches, Bomes presets, and remote scripts.
If you had a NanoKontrol 2 (or any fader/knob controller) and a Push, the APC40 would be redundant.

i think i read that you are heavily leaning towards an all-hardware solution and don't like looking at screens. in a performance situation i can understand that.

what i like about the apc40's layout is that it resembles pretty perfectly what you see on your computer screen - and thats where i look at during production. also, well, it already does have faders, which are handy in mixing situations from time to time.

but again, we might have different working styles (and levels) and who am i to not entirely embrace a plus of choice.

go pushy go.

[Brittney Sparse]

I've got an APC40 and the PUSH is going to sit nicely on the other side of my desk where the Maschine was going to go. For me the APC will handle the mixing and performance side and the Push will handle the production.

Simples

YES, EXACTLY! I've loved my APC40 since I got it but felt that in produciton it was lacking. I used it very little. Seems like Push will do nicely for me. I may be the only one to won it in Maine.

[condra]

I think the real question is PUSH vs Maschine

Push is dedicated hardware for controlling Live. It will get you away from the mouse more than ever before.

[OzWozEre]

I think the real question is PUSH vs Maschine

Push is dedicated hardware for controlling Live. It will get you away from the mouse more than ever before.

I think Push trumps Maschine simply because they are both Hardware/Software hybrids where:

Push < -- > Live (The *Actual* Daw)
Machine < -- > (Drums software) --> ??? (Where's the DAW?)

I'm pretty sure I can make all the beats I would want with Push+Live, it's the other 90% of production duties that I'm interested in too, and I think this is where Push is gonna rule.

It's like comparing Push+Live to Akai's Renaissance MPC + Software, it's a totally different ballgame

[JuanSOLO]

i think i read that you are heavily leaning towards an all-hardware solution.

most definitely based on what Live 9 offers.
I just got a Tempest, I use a SlimPhatty and a Korg Poly 800 for making sounds.
I am using all outboard FX, except for the Finger.
I was thinking about getting an Octatrack and replacing my laptop completely.
HOWEVER Live 9, and PUSH, look really amazing, and I know Live very well, I cant justify Octatrack anymore.
I also finally got my Ms Pinky live looping stuff working proper, thats probably the one thing that will always keep me using a Laptop in my rig somewhere, it's just too damn fun.

Thing is, I had been uber frustrated with the APC40 even after finally getting my rig/mappings to a place where I was playing it instead of configuring it.

There will be scripts for Machine to emulate Push, and vice versa.

[bartend7]

sorry but the push doesnt really excite me. To me it seems easier to look at the computer screen to change presets. also says its 6 lbs, which isnt that small to carry around. how is this supposed to help me with production/composition? by providing a step sequencer and melodic buttons. sorry, but i know how to play piano , so i'll stick to composing that way.
i want to use one in person before making any more judgements.