To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
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aioffermann
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To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by aioffermann » Sat Nov 17, 2012 1:12 am

How do you do it???

I'm curious how people are getting around RAM and/or CPU issues with big templates, especially templates that keep alot of devices/audio handy.

How?

I'd really like to learn the best way of being able to call up devices via midi clips. I.E., use a "128", keep the chain selector knob to it's max, and use the MIDI clip envelopes to choose which device to use.

I'd like to learn the best way to recycle material.

Personally, I'd like to have a "128" for each of my instrument tracks. In fact, for the kick, hat and snare tracks I'd like to have a drum rack with 4 cells being occupied by the same 128s. Then I'd like to have a bunch of audio tracks recording audio from their respective instrument tracks post mixer, and another bunch of audio tracks recording them pre mixer. Then another bunch of tracks recording the MIDI from the instrument tracks, post fx. This way I have a record of any happy mistakes.

But this is too much for 32-bit apparently! This would be my ideal way of working as I can keep recycling ideas very well. But in the mean time, how do you all recycle?

JuanSOLO
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by JuanSOLO » Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:00 pm

I may have 128 kicks to choose from, but every time I scroll through them looking for the right one I end up on 1 of 5 of my favorites.
Why do I waste all that time scrolling around?
Because somewhere along the way I thought more choices ment better workflow.

These days I am more create within these limitations, rather than I need everything I need to create.

for me nothing kills creative juices like opening the envelope editor, and trying to select chain number 113, or maybe chain 45, or maybe chain 33.

regretfullySaid
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by regretfullySaid » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:27 pm

128s are a lot more efficient if the samples are one audio file, that way live only has to reference one audio file instead of hundreds, no matter what size they are.
When I know I'm going to dedicated <128 samples to a macro knob I line them up on an audio track in the arrangement, usually to a grid setting where most are as equal apart as possible (like 1/2 bar) and consolidate it into one file. Then you can split up the file via slice to midi (only if they are ALL equally distanced apart), or you can slice by hand (not as tedious as you think) or a bit of both. Then you can drag them into a sampleror instrument rack and your computer will be way less sluggish.

I'm still on 32-bit with a somewhat hefty with a memory footprint around 1gb, though I've seen it dip to 800mb on occasion. Haven't had any crashes in awhile either.

To sample conservatives: It's still nice to have extra samples in a rack when you have a (sometimes momentary) randomize button for the drum macros.
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regretfullySaid
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by regretfullySaid » Sat Nov 17, 2012 8:47 pm

I explained it in the post RIGHT ABOVE you asking how I do it.
line them up on an audio track in the arrangement, usually to a grid setting where most are as equal apart as possible (like 1/2 bar) and consolidate it into one file. Then you can split up the file via slice to midi (only if they are ALL equally distanced apart), or you can slice by hand (not as tedious as you think) or a bit of both.
Consolidate, slice, drag into sampler, distribute chains, map to knob.

You already concluded you're going to stay in your safe zone just because you assume it's "a lot of hard work"
No, it isn't.
It takes about 15-20 minutes from dragging samples into the arrangement to having a macro knob switch through the samples.
Now I can hot swap BANKS of drum sounds into a cell and they're all ready made to scroll through if I like.

The whole reason I do it this way is because when I used individual samples it took Live forever to load and it ran sluggish as hell.
Then I came across this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UK2cdBmQlJQ
and did that and Live was running smooth again.
Then someone pointed out that you could just do the slices in arrangement (or slice to midi) so most of that youtube method is obsolete.
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regretfullySaid
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by regretfullySaid » Sat Nov 17, 2012 9:24 pm

Another nice thing with this is (regardless how many samples you have) when you have your drums linked to macro knobs is you can have drum "presets" in the same set.
I typically just use 8 drum cells in the rack so they each have a macro knob for scrolling (kik, snare, closed hi hat, open hi hat, misc, claps, shakers/perc and cymbals).
Clyphx has a command called "dev set". When you have dev set named in a clip, when you click it, it will copy the parameters of the 8 macros and store them in the clip like "dev1 set 0 0 48 34 72 3 10 56", a number for each macro knob.

If I want to have completely different drum kit all I have to do is have a clip with dev set, click it and it stores the settings.

"Dev set" is also a good way to make macros have defaults if the typical 0, 64, or 127 isn't suitable.
If you have a rack where you want the macros to default to 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 you can use that in a x-control script so you have a dedicated control to make that the macro default, which is handy if you have a button to randomize the macro knobs.

I'll just make a tutorial tomorrow if plans don't come up.
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matthews
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by matthews » Sat Nov 17, 2012 11:43 pm

shadx312 wrote:
Wicked share. Don't worry about the Funken dude, he'll end up copy/pasting your posts to his site once he realizes how awesome that technique is.

regretfullySaid
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by regretfullySaid » Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:13 am

And I wouldn't take it harshly, we all get sloppy sometimes.
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Vios
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by Vios » Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:47 am

I like the technique of using a rack with 8 instruments and 1024 samples. It especially works well with a lot of strange sounds. The vast majority of the time these strange drum sounds don't work well in a track, but when they do, they can make the track. I have a rack built from this technique:

Drum Rack – The Last Drum Rack That You’ll Ever Need

infernal.machine
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by infernal.machine » Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:30 am

I spent a few months last year hammering out 128s and making template sets.. but after creating everything, I hardly ever use any of it. Doesn't fit my workflow I guess.

I sometimes use my 128s, but usually I like dragging the waveform directly onto an audio track from the browser... I like working in arrangement view a lot better than working in a drum rack or sampler. For drums I've started making 8-16 bar audio loops and saving them in clip packs marked with the BPM and a description. That way when I sit down to write a tune, I can just drag in a ready-made drum beat, and once the track gets to a certain point, I chop it up and correct it so it fits perfectly. And for synth sounds, I've really found no method I like better than just saving patches in whatever VST and cycling through them.

regretfullySaid
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Re: To those who have big fat templates.. To those who recycle..

Post by regretfullySaid » Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:03 am

That's cool, it's not like I think this is the only way everyone should do things, just a preference.
I agree it can be a waste keeping a bunch of samples, especially when you keep using the same few. I do most of the time as well.
It's handy in a few different ways between performance and production, though.
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