Windows 8 Touchscreens

AustinThumper · Post by **AustinThumper** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:43 am

I don't know if it has been mentioned, but the cakewalk ppl have been busy with this.

They are using a big-ass Planar screen, and its pretty slick.

I also like their reconfigurable GUI.

peter181 · Post by **peter181** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:44 am

mbenigni wrote:Fact of the matter is, Live sucks on Win 8 touchscreens right now. The faders seem to have some kind of bug where they will jump to any point you touch on screen, but if you try to drag, they immediately jump to max. It's weird.

Did you try the fix for Wacom tablets, which have the same problem?
https://www.ableton.com/answers/how-can ... -with-live

How's performance on the Surface in general? Do the fans get all revved up with Live or is it pretty comfortable, at least for sketching stuff out?

mbenigni · Post by **mbenigni** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:08 pm

[quote="peter181]
Did you try the fix for Wacom tablets, which have the same problem?
https://www.ableton.com/answers/how-can ... -with-live[/quote]
This must be the same thing yur2die4 was referring to. First I'd heard of it but I'll be sure to check it out.

[quote="peter181]How's performance on the Surface in general? Do the fans get all revved up with Live or is it pretty comfortable, at least for sketching stuff out?[/quote]
I haven't actually gotten far enought to say yet. The night I bought it I installed Live just to check out the UI issues, but today I'll actually be getting an audio/MIDI interface plugged in and seeing what's possible. I'm... cautiously optimistic, but if it doesn't cut it I have another 28 days to bring it back.

I don't think fan noise will be an issue - it's known to be very quiet even under heavy loads. It does get a little warm to the touch, but nothing to be too concerned about. I'm actually more concerned that MS may have capped the CPU clock too aggressively in order to maintain the low temps, resulting in slower performance even for a ULV i5.

Anyway, I'll keep you posted.

mbenigni · Post by **mbenigni** » Fri Mar 01, 2013 1:54 am

peter181 wrote: Did you try the fix for Wacom tablets, which have the same problem?
https://www.ableton.com/answers/how-can ... -with-live
Fixed! Thank you, thank you, thank you!!! Now all I have to figure out is how to deal with the sheer tiny-ness of everything. Zooming helps, but it's not quite there. I'm trying to figure out how to get fewer than 10 scenes on the session view right now, so I can leave Live up around 130% zoom. I think that might feel about right.

peter181 wrote:How's performance on the Surface in general? Do the fans get all revved up with Live or is it pretty comfortable, at least for sketching stuff out?

I haven't tested recording/ playing back multiple tracks or anything like that, but early tests with Guitar Rig, JamOrigin MIDI Guitar, and one of the Ableton Instruments active, latency is very low, and fan noise is nil. As I said, the Surface will get a bit warm to the touch, but it's basically silent.

So far I'm really impressed, but bear in mind I'm still in the honeymoon phase here...

peter181 · Post by **peter181** » Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:02 am

Glad that fix worked & thanks for your reactions! I hadn't seen any reviews of these with a cpu-hogging program other than Photoshop. Very into the idea of carrying around something lighter if I can still do somewhat complex stuff in Ableton and Bidule.

mbenigni · Post by **mbenigni** » Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:24 pm

peter181 wrote:I hadn't seen any reviews of these with a cpu-hogging program other than Photoshop. Very into the idea of carrying around something lighter if I can still do somewhat complex stuff in Ableton and Bidule.

Yes, it's very frustrating just trying to find benchmarks against the Surface Pro. The best you can do is look at specs for the various components and try to read between the lines, but there's no telling what MS has throttled back in hopes of maintaining the thermal envelope in that tiny chassis. I was torn between the Surface Pro (portable, and you know, just kinda cool) and something more powerful like the Lenovo Yoga with Core i7 and 8G RAM. I finally decided I'd never know whether the i5/4G would cut it unless I tried it myself. So far I'm really impressed, happily surprised. As I say I don't know how it would fair monitoring tons of tracks and plugins, but it's already proven out as having a lot of utilty for me as a performance tool. The rest will be icing.

I do have to admit, though, as much as I like the portability, a 10" 16:9 screen proves impractical for most tasks in a big hurry. Even 10" 4:3 would have been better IMO. Apps that are designed for the Modern UI should be great, but MS really should have done more to make the desktop more navigable for "legacy" Windows apps, e.g. pinch-zoom and drag should always be an option.

Meanwhile, Live is just kind of off when resizing via Preferences; it's hard to even describe. Anything over 125% just plows content off the bottom of the screen, even though it's a standard 1920x1080 resolution. Even at 125%, you have to play games with maximizing and restoring the window before the various sections within Live will resize properly. It's all a bit... random.

tone61 · Post by **tone61** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:08 pm

AustinThumper wrote:I don't know if it has been mentioned, but the cakewalk ppl have been busy with this.

They are using a big-ass Planar screen, and its pretty slick.

I also like their reconfigurable GUI.

Touch screens usually need more pixels for same functionality.
DAW usage could be nice if you had a screen like in this video:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-21632855

c33 · Post by **c33** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:45 pm

Touch is too messy and mostly unnecessary for desktops IMO. Gesture control is the future. https://www.leapmotion.com/

What we might be able to do in the near future with DAWS and virtual instruments via a device like Leap Motion is much more exciting than a desktop monitor with my greasy fingerprints all over it.

yur2die4 · Post by **yur2die4** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:59 pm

Gesture and touch are each unique concepts. The iPad has proven that there are Definitely uses for touch.

The problem is, figuring out the most universally effective applications. It really comes down to intuition and trial and error. Oversized screens seem like a somewhat backwards idea, but to each his own. Also, screens being propped up, yet meant for touch??? We need touch coffee tables or, devices meant to be set 'mostly' flat (angled slightly). Think, a deck of cards on a table. I hope the developers of these massive all in one touch screens (HP! Etc) will realize this.

Perhaps we can have those dinner tray type stands with adjustable height and a side tray for our beverage haha

#toofuture

tone61 · Post by **tone61** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:41 pm

I would not want to use something like that Leap Motion as the only input device when using computer for hours.
Using mouse is much better ergonomically.

A touch screen does not have to be as big as in the beginning of the video, but there are uses for touch screens
clearly bigger than what is common now in tablets - 10 inch.

c33 · Post by **c33** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 10:58 pm

I don't think most people would want the Leap to be their only input device, tone61.. but creatively speaking, gesture control devices like this are going to going to create whole new ways to play virtual instruments and make music with our computers. And even ergonomically speaking, if I have to choose between reaching across my desk to physically touch my monitor, which is currently 2+ feet/77 cm away from me, or raising my hand over something that could be the same distance as my keyboard or mouse, I'm choosing the latter.

Touch is great for ipads and tablets and smart phones (and I don't think the technology is going anywhere anytime soon).. but I feel like the desktop experience remains the most comfortable, and usually the most productive, computing experience, and I'm tired of websites, software applications, and now operating systems like Windows 8 catering to mobile technology that's, quite frankly, way behind.

tesla3090 · Post by **tesla3090** » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:42 am

Does anyone know of any demo videos or reviews of ableton on the surface pro? I was wondering how well it would work if you used the stylus as a mouse. I travel a lot so the surface looks useful, but I won't buy it until I can see a demo of ableton running on it.

redglass · Post by **redglass** » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:16 am

wjbuchanan wrote:Hi All,
Wondering if anyone out there is using Live with one of the new Windows 8 touchscreen laptops?

I quite fancy the idea of using one until Touch comes out...I'd like to launch clips, adjust filters, Analog/Operator settings.

Can anybody comment whether it's useful or not?

Cheers

+1 that would be great!

check this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhQU-RyUc4A

Brian Vistaunet · Post by **Brian Vistaunet** » Wed Jul 17, 2013 8:41 pm

I run Live 8 from a Lenovo Yoga 13. Works well, but the touch screen is pretty useless with it---I use the touch screen for some things but not for Ableton.

Currently my band uses an APC20 to interface with Ableton Live and I do think there is an advantage in having a device with buttons you can feel and figure out where you are with looking down. However, touch screen performance software would also be nice because it reduces equipment haul and you can whip your laptop out and perform something anywhere, anytime. So I'm all for the addition of that. Some will swear by it, some will swear by a physical interface, but I personally would probably use BOTH on an ongoing basis because there's an upside and a downside either way.

yur2die4 · Post by **yur2die4** » Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:36 am

I've got my eyes on the Yoga 2 Pro. I can't find anything about flat out performance and audio handling. :/ I want to be able to load up instruments quickly while the 'set' is playing, without any issues via Push AND Maschine. I'm just wondering if it'd handle that without any unsavory surprises haha

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