Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
TechnoLover
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Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by TechnoLover » Sun Dec 02, 2012 3:24 pm

Hi everyone,

I come with something quite usual but I am not able to get the exact result I am looking for...

I would like to get some help on the sound design point but also the chords... And I would like to be able to make it on one of the Ableton native VST. (such as Operator or Analog) I own some great other VST but when it comes to "learning" I find it simple to make it on Ableton.

It comes from a track I discovered a few weeks ago (I am new to techno but love it!) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_jyDWMCTQc

You can hear the stab start evolving at 0:30 (filtered) and you can hear it really clearly during the first break (at 0:50 - 1:00)

Some points :

- I think the chord used is a Gm7 but I am not sure at all...
- I tried to use a one oscillator saw wav with a slow filter envelope for the sound

If anyone can help me to build it (or share an ableton preset of it), it would be really helpful.

102455
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by 102455 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:24 pm


beatmunga
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by beatmunga » Sun Dec 02, 2012 5:33 pm

It's a standard minor chord on a synth - use a sawtooth wave with a quite quickly decaying lowpass filter envelope. Perhaps with the root note played in unison an octave or two down.

As made famous by Kevin Saunderson on 'Big Fun' in the 80s. He sampled it from Nitro Deluxe's 'Let's Get Brutal'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r1h2XmWXBI

Play the minor chord through some nice reverb, resample the results on to 1 key of your sampler, record a riff using one key at a time, and get filtering for Dave Clark style shenanigans.
mendeldrive wrote:NOBODY designs their own sounds... There is ZERO point in reinventing the wheel.

antarktika
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by antarktika » Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:00 pm

102455 wrote:Click here
$600 course to answer a question about making a specific sound? Seems legit.

beatmunga
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by beatmunga » Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:29 pm

antarktika wrote:
102455 wrote:Click here
$600 course to answer a question about making a specific sound? Seems legit.
Shameful, isn't it?

Never ceases to amaze me how many people are willing to shell out hundreds to 'learn' this stuff from an academic and yet resent paying a few quid to someone experienced in sound design to create a bespoke sound just for them.

Funny old world...
mendeldrive wrote:NOBODY designs their own sounds... There is ZERO point in reinventing the wheel.

TechnoLover
Posts: 236
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 12:57 pm

Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by TechnoLover » Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:28 am

beatmunga wrote:It's a standard minor chord on a synth - use a sawtooth wave with a quite quickly decaying lowpass filter envelope. Perhaps with the root note played in unison an octave or two down.

As made famous by Kevin Saunderson on 'Big Fun' in the 80s. He sampled it from Nitro Deluxe's 'Let's Get Brutal'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r1h2XmWXBI

Play the minor chord through some nice reverb, resample the results on to 1 key of your sampler, record a riff using one key at a time, and get filtering for Dave Clark style shenanigans.
I tried a gm7 on a saw wave oscillator (on analog & operator) but it doesn't similar to the sound I am trying to make...

beatmunga
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by beatmunga » Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:34 pm

Just a minor chord. Pick a key, play 3 semitones up and 7 semitones up.

If you're struggling with the sound design just pay $99c for 'Big Fun' by Inner City (which anyone who goes by the name 'TechnoLover' should own anyway) and sample it when it drops. You'll be in good company.
mendeldrive wrote:NOBODY designs their own sounds... There is ZERO point in reinventing the wheel.

TechnoLover
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Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 12:57 pm

Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by TechnoLover » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:01 pm

I own it both in digital & vinyl but I am really looking forward to build the sound myself :)

beatmunga
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by beatmunga » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:29 pm

TechnoLover wrote:I own it both in digital & vinyl but I am really looking forward to build the sound myself :)
But I've given you advice on this and it isn't working out for you.

Are you waiting for someone to just make it again on Analog/Operator for you, like the blip sound a few weeks ago?

A bit of a pattern emerging, here...
mendeldrive wrote:NOBODY designs their own sounds... There is ZERO point in reinventing the wheel.

TechnoLover
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Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 12:57 pm

Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by TechnoLover » Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:59 am

the blip sound helped me to understand how it works but trust me, I still had to keep working on it a few more days to get it sounding right.

i don't want people to make the stuff for me but I am someone who learn easier with concrete stuff than with simple theory (even If I read a lot of theory) ...

anyway, I won't be mad at you if you can't help, I understand it may be seen as a kind of lazyness, but that's not at all

oddstep
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by oddstep » Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:22 am

The issue is that time i spend helping you realising your ideas is time I don't spend on my own. Like you're realising... Getting sound design right is time consuming.

TechnoLover
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by TechnoLover » Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:18 am

I agree man, but everyone tell me "it's a simple sound"... It looks easy to make it in a few minutes. I've been spending almost all my production time to try to achieve it... But as I said it, if you guys can't or don't want to help, I understand it and won't be mad at all. Nothing forces you to spend your time for me! I know that, for workers, the free time is priceless :) (that's why I am a bit frustrated to focus almost all my time on details like this one, knowing it's something I should handle easily)

102455
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by 102455 » Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:32 am

The problem here seems to be that you want that exact sound.

Unless that artist happened to play it using the same synth(s) you've got, that's unlikely to happen.

Synths sound different. That's why there are so many.

Take the famous "Lately Bass" sound from the TX81Z. Lots of people here have tried to recreate it using Operator. They can't do it.

Why? Because although Operator is an FM synth, the parameters are different to the TX81Z.

You want an exact sound? Buy the synth, or use a sample.

Better still, make music using your own sounds and ideas. Forget about trying to sound like someone else. Be original.

:D

TechnoLover
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by TechnoLover » Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:41 am

I totally agree with you but this is a common sound in the detroit techno scene... of course, it has a lot of variations and I am sure it comes from a lot of different synths...

oddstep
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Re: Need some help on a known stab sound (techno/house)

Post by oddstep » Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:12 am

Fair enough. If lots of people are using the same sound its probably a sample or a synth preset. The quickest way to learn will be to go through presets for any synths you have, find one that is almost right and then experiment with its settings. Thats a major way I have taught myself sound design.

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