Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

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estevan carlos benson
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Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by estevan carlos benson » Fri Mar 08, 2013 5:02 pm

I need to better understand how the Live 9 library works. For example, why aren't my Max patches showing up? I have many of them that I use in Live 8 located in my live 8 library however they dont populate in the list in live 9. Suggestions?
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login
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by login » Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:52 pm

funken wrote:Tutorial here
Live 9's new Browser

If you still have any questions after reading that I'll be happy to try to answer them.

Regarding your specific question, no your Max For Live patches will not show up in Categories, initially they will only show in Places: Live 8 Library. Then when you re-save them in Live 9 they will show in various other places, as explained in the tutorial.
You are missing an important explanation: How do I get My presets and my instruments racks to show in categories?


In The user library, there is already a folder named "presets" which also contains folders for "audio affects, intruments and mid effects", and then inside of them folders for each one of the instrument or effect. Or if the program didnt create those folders go ahead and create them.

So when you make a new presets for analog put it in (for example) : userlibrary>presets>instruments>Analog>Bass>Newbasspastch

That way it will show your content in the categories side of the browser, eiother in Sounds, or instruments.

Also you can rack your vst's with presets you like, and put them in Userlibrary>presets>instruments>instrumentsracks>Lead>MYVSTPATCH, and it will show it in Sounds, and instruments in categories.

login
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by login » Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:46 pm

funken wrote:
login wrote: You are missing an important explanation: How do I get My presets and my instruments racks to show in categories?
That's a good explanation, but I did say exactly the same in the tutorial, with several pics to illustrate it.

IMHO found it's hard to understand this browser behaviour on your article.

Ascot
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Ascot » Sat Mar 09, 2013 11:51 am

Funken,

Completing these tutorials during your own time and for free to help people is simply not good enough.

I demand that you travel to our houses (at your own expense) to demonstrate :lol: :lol:

Thanks for the free tutorials they are most helpful 8)

Muze
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Muze » Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:52 pm

funken wrote:Tutorial here
Live 9's new Browser

If you still have any questions after reading that I'll be happy to try to answer them.

Regarding your specific question, no your Max For Live patches will not show up in Categories, initially they will only show in Places: Live 8 Library. Then when you re-save them in Live 9 they will show in various other places, as explained in the tutorial.
From my own experimentation with categories this statement seems to be incorrect:
You can get your saved presets to show in the Sounds Category. Just make sure they are within a folder with the same name as a Sounds category, eg Bass or Brass. If necessary just create a folder with the right name in your User Library. Don't use subfolders if you want to do this as they will stop the presets showing in Sounds.
You can use subfolders as long as they correspond to the categories in sounds. So for example in my user folder under presets/Operator I have a "Juice" folder and a "Mutations" folder so I can keep those patches all in one place, but within those folders I have categorised them into subfolders such as "Bass", "experimental" etc to correspond with the Sounds tab - it still picks them up and adds them to Sounds. Also it seems able to pick up new categories to a degree - e.g. I made a category "percussive" for some drum patches and that category was added to Sounds even though it wasn't there before, however when I changed it to "Drums and percussion" it disappeared again so there are limits to what it will allow. Some more experimentation will hopefully reveal more. I also noticed sub folder names don't need to be exactly the same as in the Sounds tab - for example I made a folder called pads not pad but it still recognised the patches and put them under pad.

Muze
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Muze » Sun Mar 10, 2013 10:38 pm

funken wrote:
Muze wrote:
You can use subfolders as long as they correspond to the categories in sounds. So for example in my user folder under presets/Operator I have a "Juice" folder and a "Mutations" folder so I can keep those patches all in one place, but within those folders I have categorised them into subfolders such as "Bass", "experimental" etc to correspond with the Sounds tab - it still picks them up and adds them to Sounds.
It seems to work if a preset is DIRECTLY in a folder with a 'correct ' name. So Minimoog: Bass: Minimoog1 would show, but Bass: Minimoog: Minimoog1 would not.
Muze wrote: Also it seems able to pick up new categories to a degree - e.g. I made a category "percussive" for some drum patches and that category was added to Sounds even though it wasn't there before, however when I changed it to "Drums and percussion" it disappeared again so there are limits to what it will allow. Some more experimentation will hopefully reveal more. I also noticed sub folder names don't need to be exactly the same as in the Sounds tab - for example I made a folder called pads not pad but it still recognised the patches and put them under pad.
I think you just struck lucky there, my folder called Muze doesn't show up. Shame really.
I suspect Ableton programmed it to accept certain additional categories but within a limited range of possibilities. I tried to add bells but that didn't work either, but it's possible there are others that might.

Rosko
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Rosko » Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:37 pm

What about creating a sub category for audio effects & the m4l patches, hate just having one folder?

mdk
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by mdk » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:12 am

The folder names you can and can't use seem to be defined in the 'VirtualFolders.cfg' file in the Core Library, mine is here :

C:\ProgramData\Ableton\Live 9 Standard\Resources\Core Library\Ableton Folder Info\VirtualFolders.cfg

You'll see each 'virtual folder' has a pattern associated with it which defines the names it'll detect from the user library and packs I presume.

Not played with it much yet, but have been able to add my own top level folder to the Sounds category.

In the xml file I added this :

<VirtualFolder Name="MDK" Patterns="MDK"/>

within the Sounds virtual folder group, then I created a directory :

C:\ProgramData\Ableton\Live 9 Standard\Resources\Core Library\Sounds\MDK

Now if I add MDK folders within the User Library (e.g. Presets -> Instruments -> Operator -> MDK) and add content then it shows up in my MDK folder in Sounds. It doesn't show up in the Instruments -> Operator section though. Not worked out how to sort that out or if its possible.

At least it's a start.

Before Live 9 the first thing I did was to delete pretty much all the factory content (presets, clips, samples etc..) because I never use them, hopefully I'll find a way to clear all the crap out of this version as well otherwise most of the browser is just clutter. I dont like clutter.
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Rosko
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Rosko » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:56 am

I hate it. Just seems like everything is all over the place. The user folder shouldn't populate the main folder unless you want it to & if it does should at least keep the structure of your folders & sub folders.

Dom Murphy
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Dom Murphy » Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:22 pm

So essentially, go to User Library > Presets > Instruments and add the following folders…

Ambient & Evolving
Bass
Brass
Effects
Exotic
Experimental
Guitar & Plucked
Mallets
Orchestral
Pad
Piano & Keys
Strings
Synth Keys
Synth Lead
Synth Misc
Synth Rhythmic
Vintage
Voices
Winds

Add them either into the root or within each Instrument. From then on, any device patches should be categorised into one of the above folders and it'll appear correctly.

D

beatz01
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by beatz01 » Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:48 pm

I hate the idea of the same content showing up in more than one location.Totally confuses me.

Angstrom
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Angstrom » Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:02 pm

mdk wrote:The folder names you can and can't use seem to be defined in the 'VirtualFolders.cfg' file in the Core Library, mine is here :

Not played with it much yet, but have been able to add my own top level folder to the Sounds category.

In the xml file I added this :

<VirtualFolder Name="MDK" Patterns="MDK"/>
<snip>
Heh, yeah, I wondered how many other people had started off down this route. I did a bit of that too. However, I realised that the work I was putting in to try and shape the browser to my requirements would likely cause further issues down the road. Also - that I was doing what I said I wouldn't ... wasting my time try to hack the program to make it work for me. It's simply easier to wait this situation out making music in Live 8, and just see what they come up with.

There are indications 'elsewhere' that they obviously have further plans for this thing.

mdk
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by mdk » Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:28 pm

Angstrom wrote:
mdk wrote:The folder names you can and can't use seem to be defined in the 'VirtualFolders.cfg' file in the Core Library, mine is here :

Not played with it much yet, but have been able to add my own top level folder to the Sounds category.

In the xml file I added this :

<VirtualFolder Name="MDK" Patterns="MDK"/>
<snip>
Heh, yeah, I wondered how many other people had started off down this route. I did a bit of that too. However, I realised that the work I was putting in to try and shape the browser to my requirements would likely cause further issues down the road. Also - that I was doing what I said I wouldn't ... wasting my time try to hack the program to make it work for me. It's simply easier to wait this situation out making music in Live 8, and just see what they come up with.

There are indications 'elsewhere' that they obviously have further plans for this thing.
That's as far as I got and similarly I don't intend to take it any further. I did have a quick dig around the actual database as well (its just an sqlite 3 db) but unless I have a day where im feeling particularly adventurous and decide to completely wipe out the core library and build it from scratch then im leaving it for now.

Let's hope they come up with a reasonable solution, although I do get the feeling that its more of a case of offering progressively optimised hammers when I just want a screwdriver. :)
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Angstrom
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by Angstrom » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:01 pm

mdk wrote: That's as far as I got and similarly I don't intend to take it any further. I did have a quick dig around the actual database as well (its just an sqlite 3 db) but unless I have a day where im feeling particularly adventurous and decide to completely wipe out the core library and build it from scratch then im leaving it for now.
I've done more than just have a quick dig around, I built a little prototype browser which queries the database in M4L. My intention being to allow the display of all of the information and attributes of the items, and to provide an interface for me to (for example) search for anything in the database on my own terms. For example: list anything which was created by me, in the last month.
They have some established meta keys and values and I was just appending those to my entries. Quite non-destructive to the schema, as it's the same as any new MP3 file would do when it was indexed. Also I added the facility to search my info texts, where I added an ability to add arbitrary tags.

But then I realised I was wasting my life, so I stopped.
Last edited by Angstrom on Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mdk
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Re: Can anyone explain to me how to the new Live 9 Library works

Post by mdk » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:14 pm

Angstrom wrote:But then I realised I was wasting my life, so I stopped.
Always an important realisation :D
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