what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
pencilrocket
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by pencilrocket » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:27 pm

if it were filter cut off you could tell the difference.
Image

snakedogman
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by snakedogman » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:54 pm

K1D1M35N wrote:
snakedogman wrote:Just to illustrate: Live's "fades" (that they already had) and New Feature: curved automation.

Image
You wouldn't hear a difference anyway, so why bother? Just for the smoother looks?

disagree, though of course it would depend on the parameter being automated. But I'd say you'd certainly be able to hear a difference between a parameter change starting very abruptly (second curve), or starting smoothly and gradually increasing (first curve). The right end of both curves is similar, so probably you would not hear much difference there, but the start of the curve is very different. I'm sure if I rendered both tracks from that image you would be able to tell them apart too.
Last edited by snakedogman on Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ian_halsall
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by ian_halsall » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:24 pm

hahahaha - I think your "wtf is this?" is better than my "it's rubbish"

Perpetual Rift
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by Perpetual Rift » Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:48 am

What blows me away is that you are supposed to hold ALT, click the envelope, then drag it in whatever direction you need to until you get the desired curve. There is even a change to your mouse arrow to indicate that you are holding ALT and that Live is ready for you to create some curves in your envelope.

WHY DOES THIS ONLY HAPPEN SOME OF THE TIME?

I am uncertain of what the circumstances are that allow you to do this. It only works some of the time for me and it really pisses me off.

ian_halsall
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by ian_halsall » Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:37 am

this bit is rubbish as well

su
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by su » Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:48 am

You can approximate the first curve in snakedogman's diagram with the new curves. Just takes multiple splines, which it sounds like is the point of some folks on this thread. In other daws, do you choose a shape (sine, square, etc), choose a starting point then drag out automation? Is that how it works?

K1D1M35N
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by K1D1M35N » Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:58 am

snakedogman wrote:
K1D1M35N wrote:
snakedogman wrote:Just to illustrate: Live's "fades" (that they already had) and New Feature: curved automation.

Image
You wouldn't hear a difference anyway, so why bother? Just for the smoother looks?

disagree, though of course it would depend on the parameter being automated. But I'd say you'd certainly be able to hear a difference between a parameter change starting very abruptly (second curve), or starting smoothly and gradually increasing (first curve). The right end of both curves is similar, so probably you would not hear much difference there, but the start of the curve is very different. I'm sure if I rendered both tracks from that image you would be able to tell them apart too.
Well as I'm not on Live 9 I wasn't specially referring to the picture, I thought with Live 9 you were able to bend the second curve the other way around (like the first one). Is that really not possible?

su
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by su » Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:45 pm

K1D1M35N wrote:
Well as I'm not on Live 9 I wasn't specially referring to the picture, I thought with Live 9 you were able to bend the second curve the other way around (like the first one). Is that really not possible?
Yes it's possible to bend the curve the other way, but the point as I understand it is that fades provide this nice s shaped curve in one go. To get a curve like the top one using the curves, you'd need to add multiple nodes/splines. 2 steps rather than 1


Coupe70
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by Coupe70 » Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:07 pm

Someone not been in the pre-release beta should just
post this curves thing as a bug in the beta forum.
"curves bug - not working as fade curves"
If enough people support this in beta forum they
perhaps think about it again - or at least explain
why they implemented it like they did...
Phongemeinschaft (Live-ElectroJazz / NuJazz)
Homepage - youtube - Like! :-)
Live 9 (32Bit), HP DV7, i5 2,53GHz, 8 GB RAM, Win7 (64Bit)

snakedogman
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by snakedogman » Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:31 pm

friend_kami wrote:http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qSgBy6n9le4

That's how it should be done.
doesn't look like they have curved automation, though the transformation tool looks interesting. But you see when he does the sine wave it generates an enormous amount of control points and little straight lines between them in order to approximate the curve. to be fair I'm only judging from the video but it seems like it would be very hard to tweak a "curve" like that afterwards except by just redrawing or transforming the whole thing. It seems like another "reinventing the wheel" solution but again I haven't used Studio One so can't really judge it.

mr.ergonomics
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by mr.ergonomics » Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:34 pm

friend_kami wrote:http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qSgBy6n9le4

That's how it should be done.
It's nice yes, but is absolutely not related to curves?!

cjhoffmn
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by cjhoffmn » Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:06 pm

I find the implementation of limited use. I disagree with the comment above about hearing the difference. You can very much hear the difference, especially in long curves.

pencilrocket
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by pencilrocket » Sat Mar 23, 2013 3:45 am

snakedogman wrote:
friend_kami wrote:http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qSgBy6n9le4

That's how it should be done.
doesn't look like they have curved automation,
I think so, too. It's not curve.
Image

Muzik 4 Machines
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Re: what is your opinion on the new envelope curves>

Post by Muzik 4 Machines » Sat Mar 23, 2013 4:13 am

K1D1M35N wrote:
snakedogman wrote:Just to illustrate: Live's "fades" (that they already had) and New Feature: curved automation.

Image
You wouldn't hear a difference anyway, so why bother? Just for the smoother looks?
there is a HUGE difference in those 2 fades, easy to hear

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