Who is actually happy with the direction Ableton is going?

[oddstep]

You reasonable types are all the same. Com'on look, the cup is half empty.

[re:dream]

I've been using Live since version 5, I think. I think it is awesome. I have no complaints about the direction they are going. I had some doubts when they added video functionality in 8, since I thought they were losig focus, but some people on this forum seem to think it makes sense. Live 9 is fabulous; I really like all the tiny little tweaks as well as the significant new innovations (e.g. some of the M4 L stuff)

My girlfriend however, is less impressed with Ableton. She's not seen a lot of me in the last while, and she blames them. Go figure

[beats me]

I'm fine with Ableton's direction.

I'm not happy with the direction of the internet.

[oddstep]

Yeah despite everything I have said. Max for live is great. Operator is great. Collision is so good it got repackaged as a vst... and we can finally record automation in session view. It's a big product with lots of different sorts of customer. Performing live without would be a really different experience.

[re:dream]

I'd much rather the problems that popped up in the beta get addressed before the software is even considered to be released. It's like "yeah we know there's bugs, but we want to make money NOW.. we'll fix everything later.." - well same thing happened with Live 8, and it was at least a year of beta releases since 8.0.1 before things became stable.. deja vu?

I find a lot of the comments around Live's release process strange. On the one hand they get a lot of flak for waiting so long to release 9. Then they get criticized equally heavily for releasing it too soon. I guess, with a lot of users out there you can's please everyone; and it seems to me they have pretty much been steering their own course & been quite responsive to most criticisms.

For me, plugin delay compensation is not an issue; and as for the video that the OP posted, I can't make head or tail out of it.

Fact is, with a piece of software like 9, where there are almost as many different ways of using it as there are users, there are going to be bugs and issues released when you release it into the market, no matter how much beta testing they do.


As far as I could tell, 9.0.1 was actually fairly stable; I did not enjoy my library seeming to disappear when it updated to 9.0.2 (they should have a warning message whenever it updates or something) but I have not complaints about the small issues they have addressed in the interim; and I don't see what is wrong with them releasing minor updates in an ongoing way as they discover and deal with issues.

One key thing I have done is to make sure I keep Live 8 around, and I am going to keep it on my computer for at least a year before I finally delete it.

[cotdagoo]

and I don't see what is wrong with them releasing minor updates in an ongoing way as they discover and deal with issues.

My issue isn't with the discovery of issues.. it's the fact that they knew about many issues/concerns before release, and rather than sticking it out an extra month (what's an extra month on top of 3 years since Live 8?) or so they're selling software they knew had issues.

The exact same thing happened with Live 8.. just not hoping for a repeat. I installed at least 60 betas of Live 8 AFTER it was released before it was even close to a solid product. Not saying Live 9 isn't stable, as the crash reports seems to be quite fewer - but there's a lot to be concerned about that wasn't addressed seemingly in favour of selling hardware like PUSH over fixing deeper issues with the program like PDC which have existed for many versions without fix.

Setting a software release date months in advance is partly to blame I'm sure. You can't expect all the bumps along the way, and how long it takes to fix them.

[Donnie]

Overall im happy with the direction they are going with Live. Naturally I have a few technical gripes but the new features suit me, Max for Live related user customization inside Live is exactly what I need, and APC / Push / hardware additions are applicable to my workflow. In the end Live is my one stop shop for both production and live performance and the more I can keep my head in one software the more natural and artistic it becomes for me. At this point I don't see anything else on the horizon that would cause me to stray from Live for awhile.

[Blendton]

WTF, still in "jerk-mode" for making a totally only-time-wasting, the same "monoscussion" game with too much players thinking the guy just before says bullshit so he deserves all that time you give, maybe believing your argumentation has a kind of moderator effect, PLEASE dudes...

I was scared before Suite 8 + M4L, about coding patches etc, I'm not scared anymore. Bonus : now bindled and with a sub-bundle of devices very effective. THANK YOU Ableton.

Dreamed about that OIC I couldn't ever afford, then an update ... it's installed and in constant exploration and use, THANK YOU Ableton.

[Blendton]

Something itching, why ? (to the person who injecting more time wasting, negative emulation in what has been s strong and efficient community for YEARS, at least as far from Live 5. You remember ? The period when one of those guys you must respect whatever you think about their realeases :

Alexander Coe, scene-named Sasha, the brain behind Xpander EP, Rabbitweed, one of the few brains efficient enough to emulate with some other A+ brains, to give us tools like a bundle with a user-frindly, but not a toy interface, + its Max buddy, which for Live users in 20xx was headscratching, I mean for most of them. Of us. Sasha made Involver, Fundacyon NYC, Invol2ver and just released since 03/17 Invol<3ver : these four state of the art records being sold after the performance. For the lasr I think He has aaddded some Traktor stuff but anyway : Invol<3er in loop-listening , THAT's what I call "totally mastering the tool to achieve a purpose, not before having everything already created : in fact I'm saying how a musician's brain works when it's far more than just focusing on what I had to "feel" and "make feel" to audience when I was a "just little classic piano and percus player", JM. Jarre and his father, and even Brian Eno were just like David Coppefield, doing magic tricks ...

Today, I'm not surprised being so happy with Suite 9, even having kept Suite 8 for 32 AND 64 M4L capable and different Ableton Suites

Guess what, despite my Pro-Tools 210 graduate, the fact that my first contact with a DAW was Cubase WTF it was at those tiimes where if we were talking about this kind of miracle (soft aimed for Live performances, able to outperform an obsolete "for producing in studio environment only", just in case there's again an issue with authorizing the soft, I guess that people who doesn't understand at all why they see Live/Suite 9" as a toy or regression, ... Iy like everyone on Windows 8 : "the end of a "PC-era" I saw once, seriously, it's just a thing named "CHANGE". It makes you scared and affects many people's capacity of judgment, in short if I play your troll game I'll say something like "OK, all monkeys have their periods at the same time, clean up and go back to work".

It is a real regression. Not from Ableton, from all Eric Cartmans invading our sharing for produce and perform better place.

Warm regards to all musicians, whatever they like or dislike Live/Suite 9, if they make sound they should agree we aren't in sandbox playground and maybe many of us feel like playing music is like a game or playing with a toy, but all these bugs who want to manage surveys : without judging it as bad or good for you, you can open a stupid topic AND be a fu**ing good and fun guy, but you are not in the right place here. So leave. If only posting that as a new topic was not neutral enough to keep my judgment clean from readers, I would ask Ableton_Staff to from now kick/ban every "even trying to" disturb what was still a peaceful and addictive way of discuss about WORK, without some guy talking about "Computers and OS / Software operation for dummies" false issues ...

I HATE Pro-Tools and can't bear any Cubase related thing, guess what, I never said it to their own community (in Digidesign's case being officially a customer, I just think that the DAW involved into a better post-production and for HDX stuff, every "managing huge scenes" or mastering with absurd but real mandatory things to take into account because a label wants you to work wiyh 1096Khz / 512-bit width samples minimum, sorry again for my "frenglish" writing style, absurd figures just mentioned help me to make your reception effective to me : stop trolling dudes, just work, figure out your liyyle bugs, if you have an easter egg even after easter, report the crash, BTW I prefer thinking about "Suite 8 from its launch to its "unknown" actual status : the 1st thing I see is working with who was "the dark side" before, the "Max/MSP way of do things", integrated into what was more "live purposes" aimed product Sasha used anytime anywhere, having put every "disc or whatever" stuff in a box, despite he always had been critized for being "obscure and sketchy", Sasha, go listen To the first Involver if not done yet, and just think it's live recording, with all sounds beings from Live's synths, mainly operator for added sounds in the whole mixed album.

I'd like to master like that, but never falling in "fan-thinking" and "mimetism" (is it the english word for "make like someone ? ^^) >>> after Involver I tried Live 5 with a dirty hacked version of Live, anyway I wanted to understand how ONE window allows some Sasha named guy to live-mastering Involver ... Listen to that 2004 mixed album and sorry for insisting, it's made from scratch, the trick being he was rewarded as a genious perfomer by Abe and some other "not Akai" manufacturer, with his unique "Maven" called big controller, dedicated for Live only nine years ago, he paid $1M for it BTW...


Pfff ... If you've just reach that : THE END ! >>> that's good thinking. less words. more work. bye dudes

[Machinesworking]

It's OK. It's not necessarily the direction I'm headed in, but it's making them money and their fans are all mostly happy with it.
It's still close enough to where I'll upgrade and stay on board.

A small list:
Digital Performer has a slightly better paradigm for multiple songs in a single set.
Mainstage switches between mapped to your controllers instruments quicker, and with less headache.
Bitwig is poised to offer an 'in house' Max for Live equivalent, which in the long run should offer advantages.
Dedicated audio pitch/time editors get better results.....
etc.

That said Ableton still offer most of this under one hood, and it's a mature product, I'm not going anywhere anytime soon.

[Blendton]

It's OK. It's not necessarily the direction I'm headed in, but it's making them money and their fans are all mostly happy with it.
It's still close enough to where I'll upgrade and stay on board.

A small list:
Digital Performer has a slightly better paradigm for multiple songs in a single set.
Mainstage switches between mapped to your controllers instruments quicker, and with less headache.
Bitwig is poised to offer an 'in house' Max for Live equivalent, which in the long run should offer advantages.
Dedicated audio pitch/time editors get better results.....
etc.

That said Ableton still offer most of this under one hood, and it's a mature product, I'm not going anywhere anytime soon.

Yeah, I forgot saying that Live is, as some smart ablemate called with the perfect word for it, "an infrastructure". And we like it. That's why just writing words like "digi 201" or talking about vaguely "DAW Wars episode <enter your number>", ... Well OK, no digi on my setup because of the Win8 upgrade, lot of "work" you know, doing max imum a dozen clicks, waiting between, and fuck that Mbox it's not welcome enough to waste a USB (no hubs, 4 ports, doing with that). Cubase 6 installed, must update all stuff, and have mentioned a "7" upgrade but didn't find enough pros to assume all the cons by trying to like what I don't like, taste & colors you know...


I've been in front , I mean had the experience on Mainstage way of working, good experience, and didn't look at Digital Performer despite knowing it's existence. As from my debuts to your DP mention I didn't plan to look at it but now I want to : always give interets thoughts to what is well appreciated by the community. I'll check that.

The Bitwig case is for me another topic. What I state as real and / or evident about Bitwig : it's interesting, promising, I don't need it, will love it or not, or just continue to think Ableton doesn't want nor need to become a "dongle or we prevent your WTF you do with it, do do it if you don't plug that shitty USB dick in THAT port you know drivers etc ...

We still enjoy Ableton's products without being veaten by hackers, since they finished the work while some >variable here< made you unable to work : once you have lived the case, that's a kind of perpetual fear and victimism feeling about what "work_tool_name here_warning_I may have my periods when I'll decide it's the f***ing best and fun moment to make you professionaly vegetative" >>> sjort : Customer rights and duties >>> some can see what I mean, some didn't read all the line because they know that feeling.

Since Bitwig's founders are still say liie "in good terms" with their previous coworkers, since Live design, fronts, in fact about half everyone can confirm to be "exactly the button or symbol used for Live" >>> I feel its a business plan from Abe.

Live, and precisely Suite with the now bundled Max for Live, with the 32/64 choice option, is big enough. Maybe trying to do some changes induced all that "debate material", in fact even before Abe's announce forn beta testing a 9 one, I didn't feel or had any thought about the need for an upgrade, I thought "well, only a x64 flavor could be missing, and I enjoy and thank Abe to not allow that choice , as Cycling'74 until they scheduled their first Max x64 iteration with a sync to Abe's agenda, they are now in a deal which smells solid and proved to be kind of never seen innovation in music production, working with patches inside Ableton Live ??? I surely would have had a LOL mode folloewd by youu know that sort of "loop-brainstroming" way to think, which I find very unpleasant ^^. (Less is more mode lol)

BTW who cares about my opinion , saying some sheeps already go to bitwig.com every sunday like if they were something impossible to do from a silence to what you want to be head and audible, I see bitwig as Live's brother, very similar, but changing the workflow, until you need to switch to the other one for one of numerous steps we must achive in order or not, we all work and thing differently... But not that answering a mate is boring, less blahh and more "easter ending means back to work", so to do like some dudes ...

Use Live, or not, Push... "push it, now", weird, when I write that, I ear the "shit" word in my head. Interesting, helping, etc ? What I thinnk about pros and cons of change in my workflow (just the cons in fact, there are some I had to solve until Ableton revision, since 2001 the ONLY and UNIQUE f***ing bullshit thing able to prevent me to write or perform just one time but the enough one, M-Powered with "never will figure out" why that crap didb't want to do its authentication stuff like always, and worked well like "poof" without reason, then we all have our "Hate THIS ONE WHY ? Don't know, that's life, don't like, that's it, bye". In my case it's Cubase and not Pro-tools although only the last one put me in trouble, I mean the Mbox not seen as it is by PT8...

End of usejess writing for tonight, after all, blahh blahhh "lounge style" not "how to sound that sound" focused is allowed on a topic focused on <please remember me what "COMPROMISED WORKFLOW" specific theme I should presently try to solve, or at least help <needing_help_mate_name here>

LOL >>> I never say lol. But since the topic doen't expose "solve quick my well exposed real issue because my workflow stopped" >>> all positive exchange, even endless and subjective/weirdos ones) are enjoyable since no real musician in a real bad situation loses time by our fault. But I wouldn't have wrote all that sterile post two years ago on that forum, it's that realease, change, indexer bug (solved, but still need peace in order to be efficient and solid, need preparation before doing what we want in the new Library/Browser feature which can be a real advance if correctly done, and a nightmare if we some dude do silly things with an evolutive database we could disable if Abe allows us to, for the moment no "OFF" choice, do with it, it's not cool from some guys not trying to understand why they see or encounter annoyance where some other, unlike me, doesn('t even click on these topics, because if your sound materials and way of manage your library is prepared before installing, and if you give time to the indexer fir completing it's task, then, why should I repeat these words everyday since 9's realease ??? Or the "Bitwig xase", even below-average thinking people could guess it won't replace or kill Live, my opinion being that the two can become a solid tandem.

Cheers

[tintala]

I am mixed about it.. I was skeptical about the new browser, but wow, I love how it brings up EVERYTHING relevant to my search first of all, alos Max for live is great addition to Suite, and 64 bit which has turned my ram, ssd and software into a ferrari... I no longer have the audio buffering or memory crashes YAAAAY!

I like the structure of arrangement view with the 4 bar sections that are 2 tone, dig that.. and all the other convert midi to audio and vise versa very cool.

But what I hate is the fact that I cannot use multi monitors, would love to have session and arrangement views on separate monitors..

[Blendton]

I am mixed about it.. I was skeptical about the new browser, but wow, I love how it brings up EVERYTHING relevant to my search first of all, alos Max for live is great addition to Suite, and 64 bit which has turned my ram, ssd and software into a ferrari... I no longer have the audio buffering or memory crashes YAAAAY!

I like the structure of arrangement view with the 4 bar sections that are 2 tone, dig that.. and all the other convert midi to audio and vise versa very cool.

But what I hate is the fact that I cannot use multi monitors, would love to have session and arrangement views on separate monitors..

I may be wrong but can say with a bit of "doubt-just in-case-", I "met" some tool allowing that, a patch for Max for Live if I'm right.

You could ask to a "far more than average" member here, named funken or consult his webpage bu googling : macableton

I think it was there, if not it could have been on nativeKontrol webpage, I remember having view a video showing the patch allowing key/midi assignment for that purpôse.

You know, until a week after my boxed was shipped, I found the answer to what was "no solution so no bothering others" : I wanted to open more than one folder/subfolder at the time, like in Windows Explorer in fact, and when reading the printed manual, saw the "you sucked for a while dude" answer : keep-press Ctrl (Win) / Cmd (Mac) while browsing. ^^

If the feature is absolutly impossible no worry to have : german people is pretty reliable when customer needs are obvious and "more than often" ask ... Or BTW the solution will be coded by some "just like you" but gifted in coding things, like these guys who create little tricks to expand APC40 Launchpad etc possibilities so...

Cheers

[skatr2]

blendton! put down the coke. holy shit!

[Blendton]

blendton! put down the coke. holy shit!

Done on october 2009.

But that was close : I'm the only French guy taking 4 x 40mg Ritalin LA capsules a day, offers by the highest authority in these cases, because in France, in theory it's illegal to swallow even one each morning when older than 18

Anyway even without legal speed 100% therapeutic certified and legal, I'm often unable to escape that "berbose mode enabled" state, sorry anyway if you find it disturbing, I leave now.

And just in case, try to be careful with coke too dude,