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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:24 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:51 pm
Posts: 257
nemoy wrote:
i'm just asking myself how clip real estate is so relevant, when you can just add unlimited clips and scenes.. that's all.


It's not as much about session view real estate as it is GRID real estate.. APC40, launchpad, etc..

Again, you can keep pushing the point that it's possible to do this by adding scenes but that gets messy and all of the sudden you are scrolling like mad to get around your gigantic live set.

If you don't need/like this feature request then just let it be, we're still going to keep asking :wink:

Here is the feature in Resolume 4, I'd imagine it could work the same way in Live, (remember vertical columns are "scenes" in Resolume)
Another thing worth mentioning is that if you were to launch Column 4, where there is an empty clip, the "Invert RGB" clip you see here would NOT be stopped.. I'm not sure if I would like this behavior or not so I would hope that there could be another option to go along with this feature request where you determine whether or not a stop button in other scenes will stop the clip or not. Which brings me to an entirely new feature request of "Ignore Scene Stop buttons" because sure you can remove stop buttons to achieve this it would also be nice if ONLY the stop button for that particular track could stop a clip (and also the Stop All button I guess)... okay now I'm just getting greedy :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:18 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 21, 2002 3:52 am
Posts: 722
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Because the APC40 only had 5 rows (and the Push only eight 8).
.........Duh....

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Last edited by Buleriachk on Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:18 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 21, 2002 3:52 am
Posts: 722
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
What TYLRbass said also. (He is a lot more patient than I am :-)

But it also is about the ability to organize your work in much more effective ways, especially when given the option. It boggles the mind why this isn't obvious to the most casual observer....

SHEESH!

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:54 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:52 am
Posts: 272
I would love to see this in the newest update!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:12 pm 

Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:22 am
Posts: 1401
+1
I don't especially mind having an extra scene for those clips but it would really clean the place up.

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:15 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:51 pm
Posts: 257
I'd hate to have to use a M4L device to do something so stupidly simple but this might help us out in the meantime..

http://www.maxforlive.com/library/devic ... g-launcher

I find that I only use M4L for the simplest of feature requests.. like tempo up/down buttons, or mapping buttons DIRECTLY to certain quantize values.

Sure the advanced stuff is great, but being able to create devices for missing features is why I really love max for live, my only problem is that I am not a programmer and the devices that I hack together are probably inefficient and I sometimes end up with weird quirks like having to press the + BPM button first before the - BPM button works :?

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:24 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 21, 2002 3:52 am
Posts: 722
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Consider - you're performing live, and you have multiple songs, each with 20 clips of bass and drums, organized into their own tracks, that you want to be able to swap out after the song has started, and the two songs are in 4/4 and 3/4, at different tempos.

This way you could dedicate one row to launch each song, and all the other rows are to switch combinations of bass and drum clips (and even individually, using Launchpad, APC40, or Push.

And one song per set is ridiculous, especially with long loading speeds due to multiple clips.

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:17 pm 

Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2009 1:45 pm
Posts: 345
...hmmm ok, i see your point...
resolume is maybe not a very good comparison, but i'll let it slide :)

I have my entire Liveset built in blocks of 5 scenes.
That way, i can just hit shift&down on the APC to get to the next song.
I get from song to song with just one push of a Button. (well, it's two buttons, but one action)
And if a song needs more than 5 scenes, i'll add a few.
Actually I always add 5. and if some of them aren't used, l leave them blank,
so that the next song is again just a shift&down on the APC away.

Just need to make shure all songs start at a scene, that is devidable
through 5.

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:22 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2009 7:05 pm
Posts: 360
i think the use of scenes in general is problematic. i much prefer to trigger clips independently, rather than an entire scene. but theres obviously a great range of approaches ;]


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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:27 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 21, 2002 3:52 am
Posts: 722
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
The point is that that solution is an entirely artificial, awkward, and unnecessary. What if you wanted to use clips from one song into another? Or as series of clips?

It is like a dog trying to stand on three legs. It is never done well, but one is surprised it is done at all.....

And there are many, many other applications of Live other than the 5 scenes for song restriction. It is an artificial limitation that simply should not be, and a waste of time and screen space doing a workaround that shouldn't be necessary in the first place.

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:12 pm 

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:49 pm
Posts: 16
Dunno if this helps, but there is a handy clip-mute function (at least as of L9). Just press 0 (Zero) to mute/unmute a selected clip (or note within a midi clip). A muted clip won't play on scene launch until you unmute and retrigger it. Simple way to create variations of a scene/midi clip.


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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:34 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 21, 2002 3:52 am
Posts: 722
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Now THAT is interesting, many thanks for the heads-up. Don't know if Clyphx will work with that command, but if it does (and I assume it will), one could automatically unmute the clip after a measure (or clip length), so it would be immediately available after launch, which would do what I want to do. I just checked, and the "muted" clip does stay that way when you save the set.

I didn't know about that, I must have missed it. Is that new in Live 9?

DrTone wrote:
Dunno if this helps, but there is a handy clip-mute function (at least as of L9). Just press 0 (Zero) to mute/unmute a selected clip (or note within a midi clip). A muted clip won't play on scene launch until you unmute and retrigger it. Simple way to create variations of a scene/midi clip.

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:41 pm 

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:49 pm
Posts: 16
Yep, it's a new feature afaik. Like it even better with muting/unmuting single notes. Eg. HiHats or shaker-hits: just select the line of notes in the midi-editor and mute/unmute the whole line.


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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:52 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 21, 2002 3:52 am
Posts: 722
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Yes, it is new (in "1.2.5 Improved Keyboard Workflow") in the "What's New" section of the manual.
(Actually, I had seen it before when I right-clicked a clip in Live 9; I didn't know about the "0" option, although I should have from the menu....)

However, a (Clyphx)) script will still required to turn (them) on after scene launch to be available (unless one points and clicks with the mouse), and others deactivated to prepare for the next scene launch. (Maybe a command to "Activate all Clips")?

I remember trying to do this with a Clyphx script, but the timing wouldn't work - the Clyphx command wouldn't activate/deactivate the clip in time to prevent it from launching.....

Still, it certainly is a step in the right direction.

(I kind of left the issue, since I've since been busy learning Maschine)

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 Post subject: Re: Only trigger selected clips on scene launch?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:16 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:02 am
Posts: 3491
Location: Menasha, Wisconsin
I don't see any harm in implementing this feature.

I'm curious about specifics for the number of parameters one might want for it. There is the obvious 'only launch directly, not affected by scene'.

But should another clip be playing on the same channel, is that clip supposed to remain playing, or should it stop at scene launch?

The huge benefit of having it available is pretty much that it is kind of like jamming on the Drum Rack, except at the clip level. No one wants to have to juggle between a clip mindset AND a Drum Rack mindset, especially when they might already be playing a lead along to the track.

But for organization purposes, I can totally see having rows of steady loop based material like kick, perc, bass. But also one shot and delayed material at the whim of the performer.

It would absolutely up the game for that extra bit of sheen.

Of course, ....there really still IS the option to do it via Drum Rack haha


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