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 Post subject: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:08 am 

Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:05 pm
Posts: 377
Ok, so I'd like to try storing an Ableton set on a USB stick, as per suggested here :

http://www.harmonycentral.com/t5/Gear-Articles/Optimize-Ableton-Live-for-Laptop-Performances/ba-p/34645589

However.... I work in Arrangement View, and it suggests here doing a select-all in Session View ... "Select Live’s Clip View, and under Samples, uncheck "RAM" (Fig. 3). This converts all the audio clips to “disk” clips that “stream” from your USB stick.
Now when you play your Live project, all your clips will play out of the USB stick’s RAM, and your laptop’s hard disk and RAM can take a nice vacation. This technique really works—try it!"



So how do I work around this in Arrangement View?

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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:58 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:06 pm
Posts: 869
Shake that stick.

:x

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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:56 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:05 pm
Posts: 377
bump!!


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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:04 pm 

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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:39 pm 

Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:49 pm
Posts: 506
Location: Austin, TX
DO NOT STREAM FROM USB STICK - unless it's a high performance stick.

If you do this with a normal consumer usb stick, you may experience problems (I did this before and upgraded to Samsung 840 PRO SSD on USB3.0, which produces 5Gbps)

Regular consumer sticks have a 20mbs transfer rate while high performance sticks have a 80-150mbs transfer rate. Regular sticks will produce audible pops/clicks on your audio tracks/samples (in excess of 20 voices and/or 8 stereo audio tracks at 44.1k/24bit.

NAID on regular sticks will wear out after 1000 or so write cycles, thats why they are so cheap. NAID on high performance sticks wear out after 10,000 cycles (beyond 3 years with normal Ableton usage)

Examples of high performance sticks include Sandisk Extreme, Corsair Voyager GT, etc

Edit: Also, streaming from RAM is always more reliable than streaming from disk

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Last edited by miekwave on Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:46 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:05 pm
Posts: 377
miekwave wrote:
DO NOT STREAM FROM USB STICK - unless it's a high performance stick.

If you do this with a normal consumer usb stick, you may experience problems (I did this before and upgraded to Samsung 840 PRO SSD on USB3.0, which produces 5Gbps)

Regular consumer sticks have a 20-50mbs transfer rate while high performance sticks have a 80-150mbs transfer rate. Regular sticks will produce audible pops/clicks on your audio tracks/samples (in excess of 20 voices and/or 8 stereo audio tracks at 44.1k/24bit.

NAID on regular sticks will wear out after 1000 or so write cycles, thats why they are so cheap. NAID on high performance sticks wear out after 10,000 cycles (beyond 3 years with normal Ableton usage)

Examples of high performance sticks include Sandisk Extreme, Corsair Voyager GT, etc

Edit: Also, streaming from RAM is always more reliable than streaming from disk




This one? :
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SanDisk-16GB-Cruzer-Extreme-USB-3-0-Flash-Drive-Memory-Stick-Pen-New-Sealed-/370796388744?pt=UK_Computing_FlashDrives_SM&hash=item56552fe188

Also, will this method work in my instance do you think, storing my audio samples on the external stick? When you say streaming from RAM is more reliable than streaming from disk, do you mean the laptop's ram, or...? Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:48 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:05 pm
Posts: 377
miekwave wrote:


Edit: Also, streaming from RAM is always more reliable than streaming from disk



Oh - and do you know how to resolve my Arrangement view issue (streaming from the exeternal stick's RAM?)


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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:09 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:52 am
Posts: 272
Samples are samples

there is no difference weather the clip that references to the sample is in Session or Arrangement


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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:13 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:05 pm
Posts: 377
Asymmetricalmusic wrote:
Samples are samples

there is no difference weather the clip that references to the sample is in Session or Arrangement


No - I understand that. I'm specifically asking how to deselect the RAM button on ALL the audio clips I have in Arrangement view, as you can do in Session View.


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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:17 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:52 am
Posts: 272
That sucks, sorry man........

looks like you gotta do it one at a time in L9

for the record ....Live 7 lets you do exact this....as it should be

One more reason L7 is way better than any other Live!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:34 am 

Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:49 pm
Posts: 506
Location: Austin, TX
lolalola wrote:
miekwave wrote:


Edit: Also, streaming from RAM is always more reliable than streaming from disk



Oh - and do you know how to resolve my Arrangement view issue (streaming from the exeternal stick's RAM?)


Select all "AUDIO" track content in arrangement view.Deselect ram, then select ram again. Wait for the buffer to reach 100%. When it's done, ram is loaded, none of your samples or stems in arrangement view will stream from disk.

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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:07 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:05 pm
Posts: 377
miekwave wrote:
lolalola wrote:
miekwave wrote:


Edit: Also, streaming from RAM is always more reliable than streaming from disk



Oh - and do you know how to resolve my Arrangement view issue (streaming from the exeternal stick's RAM?)


Select all "AUDIO" track content in arrangement view.Deselect ram, then select ram again. Wait for the buffer to reach 100%. When it's done, ram is loaded, none of your samples or stems in arrangement view will stream from disk.



Right, but in Arrangement View it doesn't let you select all audio at once in that way. You seem to have to do it one by one.
Also, are you saying to have RAM selected, or deselected when running from an external drive?


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 Post subject: Re: Running Ableton from a USB Stick - quick question!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:06 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:55 pm
Posts: 575
For what you are trying to accomplish, you would want to click until the RAM button is no longer lit. When RAM button is on, it loads the sample into memory. I think the default is to stream the samples from disk.

This sounds like a horrible suggestion though. The performance from your internal RAM is going to be quite a bit more reliable than using a USB stick. If you don't have enough RAM in your rig to reliable load all of the samples, you might want to copy your set over to the internal hard drive.

While I'm not an expert, the following ideas come to mind that I've heard over the years:
-USB sticks have a finite read/write capacity
-USB sticks are more easily corruptable as they are inserted and pulled -- if you do this during a read/write operation, you could have a problem later on
-USB transfer rate is not as high as your internal disk or RAM, which may be a problem when streaming high quality audio.


Obviously the technology for USB sticks has probably come a long way over the years, so perhaps it will not be a big deal. Just make sure you test it thoroughly before going public, and good luck!

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