Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

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stevemac
Posts: 159
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 1:57 pm

Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

Post by stevemac » Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:34 pm

Hi guys,

I searched around and found a number of threads on using a BCR2000 to control Ableton itself, but I'm looking to map the BCR2000 to sylenth - most importantly, so that I can use multiple instances and the LED feedback changes as I navigate between each instance.

I did a number of searches but couldn't find specific instructions to to this. If anyone is able to point me in the right direction or explain the process, that would be fantastic. I guess I want an Automap equivilant for the BCR2000.

I have a hardware synth, which I love, but still depend heavily on sylenth and yearn to have the hands on control of hardware whilst having numerous instances open.

thanks so much for any help.

stevemac
Posts: 159
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 1:57 pm

Re: Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

Post by stevemac » Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:01 pm

Or perhaps a Launchcontrol? Smaller imprint, Automap easier, but no LED feedback :(

T0n1
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:23 am

Re: Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

Post by T0n1 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:10 pm

If you have Max for Live, you can try my http://www.maxforlive.com/library/devic ... 00-control devices.

Setting all up is a bit tedious, but it was designed exactly for that purpose, see the chapters "Multiple Layers" and "Total Recall" on the project page.

I recommend to begin with one Sylenth instance in an instrument rack. Configure all plugin parameters you want to control, map them to the required number of BCR2000Control device instances (one for each 8 knob group) and map their individual attach/detach buttons to one rack macro.

If it works as desired, save that instrument rack as a preset and drag as many instances into Live as you wish. Then MIDI map their respective attach/detach rack macro to individual buttons on the BCR2000. To navigate, each of them will attach that specific Sylenth instance to the BCR2000 knobs, and the LEDs will instantly reflect the actual parameter value.

You can even store multiple presets for an instance in a BCR2000Preset device and freely morph between them with a separate MIDI mapped knob on the BCR2000.

stevemac
Posts: 159
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 1:57 pm

Re: Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

Post by stevemac » Sun Dec 15, 2013 12:56 am

Looks interesting, is this emulating bluehand control essentially?

T0n1
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:23 am

Re: Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

Post by T0n1 » Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:06 am

It works with any MIDI controller sending/receiving MIDI CC in parallel to bluehand control (which overrides it), and overcomes its limitations:
  • The controlled device (or its track) doesn't need to be in focus, thus distinct devices can be controlled simultaneously.
  • Not restricted to 8 controls: Use 1 BCR2000Control device for 1-8 controls and add any number of BCR2000Control devices for >8 controls of the same (e.g. complex plugin) device.
  • Preset storage and seamless morphing between presets using Max' pattrstorage object.
  • The MIDI CC stream from the BCR2000 is routed through Live and can be recorded as clip envelope with the BCR2000Record utility device.

stevemac
Posts: 159
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 1:57 pm

Re: Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

Post by stevemac » Sun Dec 15, 2013 11:04 am

T0n1 wrote:Not restricted to 8 controls: Use 1 BCR2000Control device for 1-8 controls and add any number of BCR2000Control devices for >8 controls of the same (e.g. complex plugin) device.
Sounding good. Could you explain this section a little further - is this saying that i have to select a different bank for every set of 8 controls??


Re the Launch Control - am I correct in thinking that by simply using the configure button to show the controls I want to map, it will automatically assign these to the knobs (16 of them, and selecting bank 2 for the next 16)?

T0n1
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:23 am

Re: Sylenth, BCR2000 & little old me

Post by T0n1 » Sun Dec 15, 2013 1:58 pm

BCR2000Control itself has no concept of banks, these are used internally by the hardware to send different CC numbers for the same knob for each bank, making it look like different knobs for Live.

For the input part (hardware<->BCR2000Control), the m4l device only receives CC number/value pairs and assumes adjacent CC numbers for knob rows: In the screenshot on the BCR2000ControlMidi device in the middle you see "Base 89" and "Size 8" which means that all 8 knobs in the CC number range 89-96 are received - all other CC numbers are ignored. On the BCR2000 hardware, this happens to be the middle knob row (factory configuration). This "Base" mapping is done via MIDI learn.

For the output part (BCR2000Control<->VB3 plugin) you see the separately configured Track/Device/Parameter B_UP_16 (this can be assigned with mouse click), which is the first of VB3's parameters in its panel on the right side. Knob 2 maps to B_UP_513, knob 3 to B_UP_8 and so on. Plugin parameters can be freely arranged in Live to map to the desired knobs.

If you want to control e.g. 24 parameters with 3 knob rows on the BCR2000 simultaneously, you add two other BCR2000Control devices and set their input Base to CC 81 (top row) and CC 97 (bottom row) and map their output parameter e.g. to B_LO_16 and B_LO_1 in the panel (always the first parameter of the group such that they don't overlap).

But this somewhat complicated setup (you also need to configure all the plugin parameters within the device) needs to be done only once if you make a preset instrument rack out of it. For multiple instances of the same rack, "Multiple Layers" emulates bank switching, as only one instance is "attached" to the m4l devices, all others are "detached", and only an "attached" device actually transmits the controller values it receives to the plugin device. If a plugin device is re-attached after being detached, it transmits once its current CC values back to the BCR2000 hardware and thus giving LED feedback.


I don't know the Launch Control, and the Ableton Live Guide on Novation's Downloads section is very terse, but it seems to use traditional blue hand control, although for multiple devices, but I don't see immediately how to control >8 plugin parameters of a single device with its 16 knobs at once.

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