DRUM RACK VS INDIVIDUAL AUDIO SAMPLES

[TomViolenz]

How do i put a drifferent effect on each separate drum sample in the rack and automate them?

Open the chain/pad view in your drum rack and drop an effect after your Simpler/Sampler.
In the automation section of the clip view the effect should show up as a seperate device with all its parameters.

[SensualPanda]

For jamming or live performance, I prefer drum racks or maschine.

But in terms of production, I feel like I have much more control using audio directly. MIDI is just an extra step I don't need.

[aldred09]

For jamming or live performance, I prefer drum racks or maschine.

But in terms of production, I feel like I have much more control using audio directly. MIDI is just an extra step I don't need.

I can't even get my maschine to work in ableton.

[H20nly]

*bookmark*

@ Tom V.

[aioffermann]

One major advantage of working directly with audio is fidelity in relation to tuning. Stretching audio in repitch mode to tune in the same manner as Simpler/Sampler is waaaay cleaner and rid of artifacts, especially when pitching far, far down. Pitching far down in Simpler/Sampler usually results in a loss of bass, but pitching down via Repitch keeps all the bass

[Tarekith]

I always found using the samples directly works better for me, one less layer of abstraction in the writing process. And I generally dislike using midi and prefer to work with audio, but that's just me.

You know simpler can be set up to re-produce the audio sample perfectly? ie good enough to phase cancel with original audio - just needs a 1 sample track delay adding to the drum rack/simpler track, envelope set to no envelope, play the midi note for the full sample duration, vel=0%, vol=0dB.

I spent ages thinking I lost something using simpler especially with kicks, so I used to paste a lot of drum samplers as audio (especially kicks) instead of sticking them in a simpler in a rack. After some actual testing I discovered that simpler and the track can be setup to perfectly re-produce a sample in live 9 at least) - oh well

Nice to have the envelope shaping and nice to know for certain that it can play the sample exactly as it was.

Good to know. Not quite sure what that has to do with what you quoted me saying, but thanks for sharing none the less!

[aioffermann]

I always found using the samples directly works better for me, one less layer of abstraction in the writing process. And I generally dislike using midi and prefer to work with audio, but that's just me.

You know simpler can be set up to re-produce the audio sample perfectly? ie good enough to phase cancel with original audio - just needs a 1 sample track delay adding to the drum rack/simpler track, envelope set to no envelope, play the midi note for the full sample duration, vel=0%, vol=0dB.

I spent ages thinking I lost something using simpler especially with kicks, so I used to paste a lot of drum samplers as audio (especially kicks) instead of sticking them in a simpler in a rack. After some actual testing I discovered that simpler and the track can be setup to perfectly re-produce a sample in live 9 at least) - oh well

Nice to have the envelope shaping and nice to know for certain that it can play the sample exactly as it was.

Good to know. Not quite sure what that has to do with what you quoted me saying, but thanks for sharing none the less!

Hahahaha yes, ditto. Good info but that seemed out of left field

[Khazul]

Good to know. Not quite sure what that has to do with what you quoted me saying, but thanks for sharing none the less!

Ah - the bit that prompted me to post this was that Ive come across a lot of people who will only use audio pasting for main sounds in a rhythm because they felt they lost something from the sound when they used a simpler - especially from kicks and snares. Ironically it was usually the more experience older school producers I know who tended to do this, and in some cases they got into the habit long ago in some other daw and never got out of it when it could let them do stuff quicker.

Sometimes it only when you can show them that actually the audio is or can be exactly the same do they go back to using simplers and a drum rack etc. So just mentioning really for those who might have got into audio pasting only it because of a perceived problem with simpler/sampler or whatever. Perhaps at some time in the past simpler really was bad - I don't remember noticing it and Ive allways liked the freedom to tune the envelope of a sound to the groove.

As for me I tend to use a mix of both - main rhythm done in a rack and the audio 'fiddly-bits' - reverses, sounds that need to be end synth or start-end synced and other odd stuff pasted as audio. There are creative merits both ways.

[rtcardinal]

I prefer to work with audio where ever I can, and keep the in the arrangement view for context's sake. I like being able to visually see where my parts (especially drums and bass) line up or fall against each other, and quickly resample layers together. I also like having precise envelope control with fades on each sound. When my parts are in audio, and tight, I usually have to use less processing to glue things together in terms of mix.
If I do end up using midi or drumracks/samplers, I usually just stick a single midi note in a clip, and edit it like an audio clip in arrange view.

That being said, for things like hats and more detailed percussion, I like using battery 4 or drum racks (more battery 4 now), each instance loaded with a similar group of sounds. This is the kind of stuff that I normally apply 'grooves' to, or do detailed velocity programming.
But the meat and potatoes kick, snare, one shot percussion, etc, are usually left to audio clips in my world.
Sometimes I'll toss a bit of random 'spice' samples into a drumrack/battery instance, and process them all in one go. I usually resample that to audio quickly, though.

I never have an entire kit in a drum rack or battery. I used to do this when drum racks first came out, but I find it's just too much information in one place, and it's a bit too abstract in terms of context. It's very easy to get 'lost' in the midi editor, and lose track of where things fit in the whole of the tune, and I find that I take on a more 'set it and forget it' mentality. I always found that when I tried to get all of my drums in one or 2 racks, I had a harder time getting solid ideas down and finishing tunes. It's just too finicky for me.

[aioffermann]

I never have an entire kit in a drum rack or battery. I used to do this when drum racks first came out, but I find it's just too much information in one place, and it's a bit too abstract in terms of context. It's very easy to get 'lost' in the midi editor, and lose track of where things fit in the whole of the tune, and I find that I take on a more 'set it and forget it' mentality. I always found that when I tried to get all of my drums in one or 2 racks, I had a harder time getting solid ideas down and finishing tunes. It's just too finicky for me.

Damn, now I really wanna try doing my drums as just audio. I have those same exact sentiments about drum racks. It's one of the biggest blocks for me in finishing tracks right now (well that and time of course ) Interestiiiiiiing.