What is the absolute best computer for Ableton Live?

[studiojohnny]

Greetings,

I'm in the market for a new computer and sound card for Ableton Live. I want the best possible setup, with a priority on low latency, high track count, high plugin count, 96/24 recording.

Money is no object. This is for a pro studio installation. I'd like a studio-quality rig like my Nashville friends have with their giant ProTools rigs. (And maybe I just need to switch to ProTools, which is something I'm considering. I like ProTools. But I love Ableton Live for EDM production and would prefer to have a rock-solid Ableton Live machine that could hang with even the best pimped out ProTools rig.)

1. Feasibility — Is this even possible? Is this the wrong approach? Should I just use Ableton Live for writing, then bounce stems and move to ProTools for studio sessions when recording live talent?

2. CPU — I understand that CPU is the primary factor in determining the maximum number of tracks and effects. So seemingly the new Mac Pro would be a good candidate. Presumably I should just go for the highest configuration: 2.7GHz 12-core with 30MB of L3 cache. Correct? Or is there some way that computers can be grouped into a render farm? Like a rack of computers for super-computing levels of CPU power?

3. DSP — How else can I squeeze out more FX processing power? I'd like to get some DSP cards like the UAD-2 Octo, but I see that they're PCIe based and with the new Mac Pro, everything is Thunderbolt. Will these still run well even with a PCI expansion chassis? Are there other DSP cards I should consider? Is it too early to say?

4. Sound Card — Are there specific sound cards or types of sound cards that are lower latency than others? Which have the lowest latency? Is there a clear leader in the field? What's industry standard for studio Live rigs?

5. OS — I'd strongly prefer to stay in the Mac world and don't wish to get into a Mac vs PC debate, but if the harsh reality is that I need to switch to PC then I'd like to hear that. (That being said... in all the studios I've ever been in, from NYC to LA to Nashville, I have never seen a PC. So I'm dubious.)

I very much appreciate anyone willing to lend their expertise!

Kindly,
John

[beats me]

This is for a professional studio application so money is no object.

New Mac Pros just released. Starting at $3,000.

[TomViolenz]

I have no expertise on this sort of system (unfourtunately), but why would you not go 64bit?!
Unless you have some 32-bit legacy plug-ins, that can't be replaced, there is no downside to using 64 bit. But a lot of upside in never having not enough Ram.

I would go with the Mac pro 12 core as well, because more is always better

Now I'll just go back to my corner and dream of your machine, preferably with either 3 cinema displays or some of the new 4k Dells

[beats me]

Should also be mentioned that the new Mac Pros are really new, Mavericks is still fairly new, and it seems like Ableton is still sussing out some issues with Live 9. In the long haul I don’t think you can go wrong with a new Mac Pro, but don’t think you were lied to if you go that route and Live doesn’t work flawlessly from day 1.

[Dragonbreath]

So from they way your talking im assuming that budget is not a concern.

I would recommend you get the most CPU power you can get in a mac pro. At least 8 gigs of ram.

For sound card if latency is a big concern then you for sure need to go with something from RME. the UFX is prob a good choice. Probalby anything from RME is pretty good though.

Unless you specificly want the UAD plugins I suggest you wait on the external DSP, you might find you got plenty of CPU to spare

Its allready been mentionned but Maverick is new so compatiblity and stability might not be there straight from the get go

[H20nly]

mine.

mine is the best.

[login]

I would make a custom PC with two xeons, SSDs and whatever.But maybe is cheaper more convenient to get a mac Pro

Soundcard? RME Fireface UFX or one form the PCI family.

DSP? LOL.

[Khazul]

Whatever mac pro you can afford. If going with Live rather than a PT HD system, then RME are good for low latency - the obvious ones to look at being the UFX or madiface XT.

I wouldn't bother with UAD unless you have a pressing need to use some of their plugins. Eventually computer CPUs will probably out perform them and you end up with another expensive upgrade and partial re-purchase ('cross-grade') of your current licenses.

For personal EDM production it all sounds like overkill, but if setting up a semi commercial studio, then it seems an odd post - such people usually have half an idea of what they want/need etc based upon existing gear, existing production preferences etc.

[Khazul]

[double post]

[TomViolenz]

Well, I would think not all hobbiest are poor...

If I had the money, I would waste it on gear as well, no matter if I needed it or not

[Dragonbreath]

Seems like he pretty much allready knew what he wanted but maybe wanted comfirmation on some details and suggestion on best sound cards for latency.

[Angstrom]

It very much depends on your budget and the circles you move in. For example - my more professionally minded friends who engage with fancy big name performers and studios, they all have really nice protools setups as a basis. I mean, theres a room in their cellar filled with io patchbays. If you are that person. If you have a story about the time you met Quincy Jones, and you've done some work with Nile Rodgers, then just do this. Get a nice room, get a solid protools setup.

Then...
Install live on it, use the HD i/o as your output. Oh, and also install Live on your macbook.
This method will render you immune to professional scorn.

If however, you are like one of us mortals with a budget constrained in the mere thousands, then that's another story.

[Tagor]

maybe something like this wouls suite you
http://www.musiccomputing.com/

[studiojohnny]

...For personal EDM production it all sounds like overkill, but if setting up a semi commercial studio, then it seems an odd post - such people usually have half an idea of what they want/need etc based upon existing gear, existing production preferences etc.

First of all, I just want to thank everyone for their feedback. This is my second post here ever and I appreciate that total strangers are willing to lend their time to help a fellow producer.

I understand that this does sound like an odd request. I probably shouldn't have used the word "pro" but it is "pro" in the sense that I am a professional producer and make part of my living from licensing tracks. I have clients with ridiculously insane deadlines. I may get an email that says, "Hey man, I need a 60 second track for a TV commercial that's in the style of Diplo (fake example) and we need it in 6 hours. We're also bidding this to two other producers. Whoever we pick, we have a budget of X dollars." So I have to fly like the wind to hit the deadline. (The ad industry movies so fast. It is truly absurd.) The more options I can give my clients, the better chance they'll pick me over another producer. So I use Ableton Live's session view for the songwriting stage. I love session view. It is the main thing keeping me in Live rather than ProTools. In essence, I'm writing and mixing simultaneously. Once everything is sounding good then I'll bring things over to the Arrange view for final tweaks. But I need to be primarily in the music side of my head. Everything grinds to a halt for me mentally when I have to start bouncing tracks during the writing phase. So I'd like to build a dream machine(s) in order to hopefully never hear stuttering or latency again. I just want to click record and have it work.

The reason I'm asking for help is simply because I don't know what I don't know. If someone with more expertise sees a flaw in my plan then I'd love to be told that I'm wrong and corrected before spending the money.

This is my current tentative "shopping card". Any input or corrections are most welcome.

Computer
Mac Pro 2.7GHz 12-core (for home)
15" MacBook Pro Retina 2.6GHz Quad-core i7 (for the road)

Soundcard
UA Apollo (for home) - The extra DSP processing is very appealing.
UA Apollo Twin DUO (for the road)

DSP
UAD-2 OCTO Ultimate (for home and on the road)
OWC Mercury Helios PCIe Expansion Chassis (to use the above DSP card via thunderbolt with either computer)

Does this seem alright? Are there other DSP options I should be considering? In theory, as long as I use the UA plugins first and then spill over to the CPU plugins, I should be able to do quite a bit before having to up the buffer size and run into latency issues. Is there anything else that can be done? I know I can always grab more DSP cards if need be. Is there anything else? (I just read an article on OWC that confirmed that the new Mac Pro CPU is upgradeable. Hmmm...) Also is there a particular version of OS X that is known to be the most stable for Live?

Thank you all again for your help. I really appreciate it.

John

[TomViolenz]

Also is there a particular version of OS X that is known to be the most stable for Live?

Snow Leopard 10.6.8

The only problem with it is, that more and more new audio software released in the last few month needs at least 10.7 to run. Live is not one of them though.

Mavericks (the last version) is still unreliable.
So a good middle ground could be Mountain Lion.

But I'm still on 10.6.8 and it's rock solid!