Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Buleriachk
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Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Buleriachk » Sun Mar 23, 2014 4:15 pm

I had been searching for this program for some time, and feel that it deserves a shout out in addition to those who have already mentioned it in other threads. My original search was for a "chord effect rack" based on Live's Midi chord effect (which is practically useless in real time for chord progressions, because it relates the root note of the incoming midi to the root of the chord being played).

The program Cthulhu:

http://www.xferrecords.com/products/cthulhu

solves this problem, allowing you to specify eight note chords to any key or pad you like.
The only thing it is missing is a matrix representation of the chords on a pad controller, but the keyboard works great, once you figure it out. It is also ridiculously inexpensive at $49.

So, for instance, you can specify a chord progression by a simple sequence of midi notes, which will generate the complex notes of the chord, which can, in turn, be recorded as separate midi notes.... (You need to configure separate tracks, of course, but it is to do in Live....

My interest is in strumming simulation (which still remains a controller issue - although note repeat might work, but it sounds artificial - maybe I can figure out how to use it with Real Guitar), primarily, but the program includes an arpeggiator for those interested (I may be more interested as I learn how everything works).

(I think) the program will also arpeggiate incoming midi chords, so you can use the progression to re-generate futher arpeggiator sequences....

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Bottom Line: If you have any interest in chord progressions, this program is a no-brainer for Ableton Live; it is what their "Midi Chord Effect" should have been in the first place...

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(Not only that, but their t/s was instantaneous and excellent regarding an installation issue).

dave dove
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by dave dove » Sun Mar 23, 2014 6:00 pm

this too:
http://fabriziopoce.com/progressive.html
has a guitar mode

dave

Timbeaux
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Timbeaux » Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:02 am

#reminder

Tagor
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Tagor » Mon Mar 24, 2014 3:37 pm

nice running :-)
i already know it will end up in complete chaos mixing this with J74-Progressive

Buleriachk
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Buleriachk » Mon Mar 24, 2014 4:13 pm

Launchpad95 and the Native Kontrol programs are excellent for their applications, but they don't provide the ease of general chord creation access to chord progressions in performance as Cthulhu (which is both controller and root independent for assignment to pads).

That is, both are subject to Push and Live's limitations in chord voicing and performing.

Cthulhu is independent of both DAW and controller (but works just fine as a Vst in Live), and is founded on the fundamentals of chord production (and includes a nice arpeggiator to boot).
dave dove wrote:this too:
http://fabriziopoce.com/progressive.html
has a guitar mode

dave

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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by dave dove » Mon Mar 24, 2014 6:59 pm

was just trying to be helpful RE: the guitar strumming thing
no derail intended

dave

Buleriachk
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Buleriachk » Mon Mar 24, 2014 7:41 pm

dave dove wrote:was just trying to be helpful RE: the guitar strumming thing
no derail intended

dave
Understood, and the good thing about that Launchpad95 user mode that is that there is a representation of the guitar neck that preserves the standard tuning for of the six strings (i.e., the B second string (not present in Push scales, AFIK).)
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For guitar, IMO, some of the best alternatives are from Musiclab, but they also has is own limitations in standalone and/or vst; e.g. no capo(local transpose), so strumming is problematic.

However, Cthulhu works great for triggering their samples when they are used as vst instruments:

http://www.musiclab.com/

The samples can then be sent through whatever additional processing you like (e.g., Guitar Rig, or Live's Amp or other effects)
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That said, one may be able to use a keyboard with their strumming to generate individual midi notes, which can then be fed into Cthulhu; not sure about this, it is in my future folder for testing. (i.e., key up/down strokes and record the out-of range individual notes and then transpose down, similar to note repeat).

Update: I don't think you can do this live, but one may be able to do it after the fact by creating notes at the pitches used for strumming and merging them with the one-note inputs to RealGuitar. But I haven't tried it yet. (See the following post... I'll be watching closely). I imagine it would be done by introducing a slight delay between the individual notes to create a difference between up and down strums... Maybe use a second controller independent of Cthulu and RealGuitar to do the strumming (so in a different track)... ?

One could then define different combos of up/down strokes to emulate rasgueados, and assign the strokes to different keys, so one could play triplets by selecting a key range, etc...
(a down stroke would play the chords with notes slightly delayed from low to high pitch, and an up stroke would play the chords from high to low).

Such a device might exist as a separate VST effect would sit between the output of Cthulu and the input to the synth (e.g. Real Guitar). Maybe it already exists as a strummer VST?
Last edited by Buleriachk on Mon Mar 24, 2014 8:32 pm, edited 6 times in total.

ezelkow1
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by ezelkow1 » Mon Mar 24, 2014 8:06 pm

At some point strumming may come to cthulhu as well. Its come up a fair amount of times on the xfer forums and its a known feature request. id have to look back to see if steve said he was working on it or not, I believe he might be after he finishes up his next plugin

Also if you havent, check the forums, new versions get posted in there and not your account. He makes a fair number of feature additions and fixes before doing an official release, i.e. lfotool has had all sorts of new filters, waveform view, and other features added before it became 'official'. I think some of the stuff added to cthulhu was a latch mode, CC triggering of various changes, a few other things dealing with chord learning

dave dove
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by dave dove » Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:13 pm

k...
j74 progressive isn't launchpad95 though
i have played a little with cthulhu
but being a non-musician
all i hear is 'tekeli-li'

dave

Buleriachk
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Buleriachk » Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:23 pm

If you're a non musician, I can well imagine what you hear...

One of its applications I just discovered:
With Cthulhu running as a vst in live

Create a set of chords for a progression: e.g. E7->Am (two piano keys in Cthulhu).
Create an arpeggio using the two or three lowest notes of the chord (if you use a tonic Am + 2nd inversion for E7, the notes will be close and smooth). Then assign a bass vst to the output, and set an arpeggio (with "retrigger" and clock "on"

Play with creating arpeggios with a limited number of notes in the window.... instant bass lines that sound great with that progression.....

Then experiment with changing the bass sounds...

Very, very easy to create bass lines that way....

(But you DO have to know what an E7 and an Am chord is.... :)
dave dove wrote:k...
j74 progressive isn't launchpad95 though
i have played a little with cthulhu
but being a non-musician
all i hear is 'tekeli-li'

dave

dave dove
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by dave dove » Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:31 pm

Am yes. E7 no.

dave

Buleriachk
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Buleriachk » Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:36 pm

dave dove wrote:Am yes. E7 no.

dave
A good start for your next research project. Who knows, maybe you'll even get to the Circle of Fifths (or the Circle of Fourths.... someday, anyway :)

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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by dave dove » Tue Mar 25, 2014 1:34 am

hahhaha
no
sound collage me....

dave

tech44
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by tech44 » Tue Mar 25, 2014 1:42 pm

There are a few chord tool racks on our site here.

As well as Cthulu presets: here.
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Audiobombs.com: Free ableton racks, soundsets, touchosc templates and more.

Buleriachk
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Re: Chord Generator - Cthulhu

Post by Buleriachk » Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:01 pm

Interesting; I had the feeling that someone else was working this issue... :)
tech44 wrote:There are a few chord tool racks on our site here.

As well as Cthulu presets: here.

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