ipad & ableton

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
sonik777
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ipad & ableton

Post by sonik777 » Sat May 17, 2014 2:06 am

Hi all, been using Live for a year now and finally got around to registering here.

So anyway I now have access to an ipad (version 2), though it's not mine and I don't know much about them.

I was wondering what exactly is needed to connect it to my laptop (windows 8.1) for use as a midi controller? I'm not looking to use the ipad for audio, just as a touch screen controller. If I go wired can I just plug it right into a free usb port? With the included 30pin-usb cable plugged in my computer recognizes the ipad and I have access to its storage.

I was reading about camera adapters and usb/midi adapters and what not and I'm a bit confused by what seemingly should be a simple 1 cable procedure, in my mind anyway :lol:

I also read about midi over wifi, but that sounds a bit of a hassle and wouldn't the latency & reliability be a bit rough?


For software I was looking at either Lemur, or Touch OSC. Any opinions on these, or other similar software are more than welcome!


Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks in advance!

sonik777
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by sonik777 » Mon May 19, 2014 2:22 pm

Bueller?

SLEEarts
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by SLEEarts » Mon May 19, 2014 3:04 pm

This is something I've been meaning to do for a while now. I've looked into this enough to know that a lot of people are happy with Lemur's control, and it seems to be customizable. If you get this up and running do let me know; I'd like to check it out.

TomViolenz
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by TomViolenz » Mon May 19, 2014 3:16 pm

Just from what I picked up on the forums: The camera connection kit is needed, the normal cable doesn't work.

As another software people seem happy with you should check out Touchable.

8O
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by 8O » Mon May 19, 2014 3:23 pm

Here's a recent and useful comparison between Lemur and Touchable: http://sonicbloom.net/en/touchable-2-vs ... omparison/

Relative to buying Live and an iPad, you may as well just buy them both. And TouchOSC. And my app. :wink:
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yur2die4
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by yur2die4 » Mon May 19, 2014 3:53 pm

Is your iPad wifi only? Or is it capable of doing wireless data through phone service?

If you're able to set your iPad up as a hotspot via USB, then you can use your standard USB charging cable.

What it does in that scenario is go back and forth between your app and iTunes to send network data. It is the same as using wifi but much more stable.



For midi through USB, it gets a bit trickier. With the Camera Connection Kit you can connect a midi device, and then that midi device would need to be connected to a midi device on your computer. So, two midi devices, a cam connection kit, And hoping your iPad supports that device.

When using the camera kit, it can be picky about which devices it'll accept especially based on how they consume power. Also I'm not sure of the version of your iOS would come into play. Chances are you'll need to also connect a powered USB hub.



Personally, I'm not sure what my opinion is yet on iPads on Live. I feel like it is placing another layer of complexity atop the actual Live interface. With Live 9 things have become even more messy with the Diffeent states of arming. The iPad can be extremely powerful on its own for creating sounds. It also supports midi input. With the right apps, you can use a hardware midi controller to have a lot of control over a synth in an app, record ideas, then dump your stuff into Live for further development. Or create iPad specific performances. Or simply use the iPad along-side Live in a live music/dj environment.

sonik777
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by sonik777 » Tue May 27, 2014 6:36 pm

The ipad in question has wifi and bluetooth, no 3/4g.

Can bluetooth be used for midi data? Both my laptop and the ipad have it.

Thanks for the responses.

yur2die4
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by yur2die4 » Tue May 27, 2014 7:18 pm

Bluetooth for midi is a very new thing right now. There are some apps that use it. A particular company which I forget right now is developing it. I think the app is called Apollo midi or something.

They want to do desktop and iOS Bluetooth midi. I hear it is pretty decent but, the biggest factor is the newness of your Bluetooth both on your ios device and your computer. Older versions of Bluetooth are just not capable.

I haven't experimented with this so, you'd have to do your own research on YouTube or something.

Jinsai
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by Jinsai » Wed May 28, 2014 6:08 am

My best advice: Don't wear yourself trying to get the ad hoc communication to work. Go for a hard wired approach, and the best/cheapest solution I've found is the iConnectivity box.

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ ... pBIxPw_wcB

Seamlessly route midi to and from the iPad. Also, allows you to treat the iPad as an audio interface, and just route the audio directly into your computer that way. Once you get it running, it's reliable. I think everyone who has an iPad and is using Ableton should have one of these. It's changed the way I do everything.

Once you get it, get the Lemur and Touchable apps.

edit: added bonus is that it doubles as a tiny portable 2x2 midi interface.

zeropoint
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by zeropoint » Wed May 28, 2014 11:46 pm

^^ yeah the iconnect midi 2+ (or 4+) is a must have if you own an ipad and want to integrate it in your daw workflow.

however as far as I am aware touchable 2 still does not work over a hard wired connection, unless you have a cellular capable ipadl and a tethering plan that allows the ipad to be used as a usb router. even then i'm not sure it would work via the icm 2+.

have you got T2 to work hard wired like this ?
MacBook Pro 17" 2.93Ghz 8G Ram, Live 9.6, OSX 10.11.3,Faderfoxes, Monome........

Jinsai
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by Jinsai » Wed May 28, 2014 11:57 pm

Touchable 2 doesn't connect via a hard wire connection? I was on the verge of buying it today after playing with it on my friend's iPad. I guess I just assumed. Does it communicate via OSC?

zeropoint
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by zeropoint » Thu May 29, 2014 2:13 pm

Nope. The devs have been promising news about the hardwired connection recently but it still hasn't arrived. No OSC either.

Here's a little feature comparison between T2 and Lemur + Live Control 2

http://sonicbloom.net/en/touchable-2-vs ... omparison/
MacBook Pro 17" 2.93Ghz 8G Ram, Live 9.6, OSX 10.11.3,Faderfoxes, Monome........

clydesdale
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by clydesdale » Mon Jun 02, 2014 1:40 pm

I don't think I'd buy an ipad just for Live, but I installed touchable2 on my daughter's ipad-mini over the weekend to try it out and it's pretty damn awesome. It's intensely icon based without help balloons so it's a little tricky to figure out at first but I was able to get about 90% comprehension just by experimenting. It does just about as much as a Push and an APC40 and then adds things like a unified device chain view where you can jump between any device on any track and then there is the X-Y pad device (kinda like a software Kaos pad but I assume more customizable) which is worth the $25 by itself. If you've already got an ipad, I can't see why you wouldn't just purchase it immediately.
LIVE 9.1.7 x64, PUSH w/PXT, APC40, KEYSTATION PRO88, Radium61
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yur2die4
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by yur2die4 » Mon Jun 02, 2014 3:47 pm

If you use a home internet router, this stuff usually works pretty well wirelessly.

When you start coming up with solutions on the go is where it gets extra fiddly....

jestermgee
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Re: ipad & ableton

Post by jestermgee » Mon Jun 02, 2014 11:16 pm

^^^Agreed.

I have used Touchable/2, TouchOSC, Griid into Live wirelessly on my home network to a Windows PC and have never had an issue. I really only use it as a mixer/transport controller mostly but occasionally mess around with clip launch or playing some notes to record and haven't really noticed latency or issues. Always just works. Meters are not really responsive but what can you expect really, happy enough it has meter feedback at all.

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