OSX + Live Audio Performance

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by ansolas » Sun Oct 26, 2014 3:02 pm

Hi,
I have the following setup (Custom Mac):

RME Multiface II
OS 10.10
Intel I7-4770k
32 GIG RAM

I have a Project which induce 30% CPU.

Anything works fine at 512 samples which results in 13.2ms latency which is way to high to play Push with joy.

When I lower the latency to 256 Sampler , I keep getting clicks.
I even get clicks when I have a loop enable and the playbacks jumps to the start or
when I launch a scene on Push ?

In other DAWs I can even get stable audio up to >80% CPU load !

Disabling EIST in BIOS doesn't help

Playing Live @ 13,2ms latency is frustrating.

Any idea ?

M-bition
Posts: 122
Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 5:22 am
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by M-bition » Sun Oct 26, 2014 4:47 pm

How high is your sample rate ? If it is too high you will get clicks also.
Set it at 44.1 / 48

If you are using samples it can help using the same audio quality for each sample. Using different qualities at the same time or very high audio-quality samples may sometimes result in clicks n pops.

Load samples in RAM.

Maybe you are using a plugin or some device that can be a part of the problem. Try figuring out which one causes problems.

ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by ansolas » Sun Oct 26, 2014 4:50 pm

M-bition wrote:How high is your sample rate ? If it is too high you will get clicks also.
Set it at 44.1 / 48

If you are using samples it can help using the same audio quality for each sample. Using different qualities at the same time or very high audio-quality samples may sometimes result in clicks n pops.

Maybe you are using a plugin or some device that can be a part of the problem. Try figuring out which one causes problems.
Hi I have mostly VST's and just one audio tracks with effects on it
Sample Rate is here at 44.1 KHz :/

I tried deleting tracks after each other to find out which is causing the issue , but it seams also to happen at lower CPU Loads @ 256 Samples Buffer

M-bition
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Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 5:22 am
Location: The Netherlands
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Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by M-bition » Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:10 pm

Is Multi Core enabled in preferences ?
Routing is another thing I am thinking of.

ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by ansolas » Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:12 pm

M-bition wrote:Is Multi Core enabled in preferences ?
Routing is another thing I am thinking of.
Jip, I tried to disable it
deleted some tracks so that i get below 100% CPU load.
It still cliks :roll:
When I load the Project in the latest beta it even crashed.

Stromkraft
Posts: 7033
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Oct 27, 2014 1:18 am

ansolas wrote:Hi,
I have the following setup (Custom Mac):

RME Multiface II
OS 10.10
Intel I7-4770k
32 GIG RAM

I have a Project which induce 30% CPU.

Anything works fine at 512 samples which results in 13.2ms latency which is way to high to play Push with joy.

When I lower the latency to 256 Sampler , I keep getting clicks.
I even get clicks when I have a loop enable and the playbacks jumps to the start or
when I launch a scene on Push ?

In other DAWs I can even get stable audio up to >80% CPU load !

Disabling EIST in BIOS doesn't help

Playing Live @ 13,2ms latency is frustrating.

Any idea ?
What happens if you freeze tracks? What happens if you run this on another Mac or with another audio interface?
Unfortunately I think this may be a general issue. I've had them since Mavericks, but to a lesser extent than what you describe.
On the other hand, you can't expect OS X 10.10 to work fully on a home-built machine. I don't think that is the problem here, but your box is non-standard, if I'm not misunderstanding. This means there's always the possibility that something is incompatible with some software, like Live or the interface drivers. No-one have tested the software on your type of machine.

You need to do some CPU load analysis to check whether there are stray processes eating up your CPU cycles so that Live gets fewer than you think. I've had a few of those on my Mavericks machine.
Make some music!

Stromkraft
Posts: 7033
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Oct 27, 2014 1:26 am

ansolas wrote: deleted some tracks so that i get below 100% CPU load.
It still cliks :roll:
When I load the Project in the latest beta it even crashed.
Ehm, you said initially that the load was 30%. What is the actual load?
Make some music!

ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by ansolas » Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:13 pm

Stromkraft wrote:
ansolas wrote: deleted some tracks so that i get below 100% CPU load.
It still cliks :roll:
When I load the Project in the latest beta it even crashed.
Ehm, you said initially that the load was 30%. What is the actual load?
Read carefully :) it is logically than when I disable multicore support that the CPU Load will jump up to 100%

ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by ansolas » Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:16 pm

Stromkraft wrote: What happens if you freeze tracks? What happens if you run this on another Mac or with another audio interface?
Unfortunately I think this may be a general issue. I've had them since Mavericks, but to a lesser extent than what you describe.
On the other hand, you can't expect OS X 10.10 to work fully on a home-built machine. I don't think that is the problem here, but your box is non-standard, if I'm not misunderstanding. This means there's always the possibility that something is incompatible with some software, like Live or the interface drivers. No-one have tested the software on your type of machine.

You need to do some CPU load analysis to check whether there are stray processes eating up your CPU cycles so that Live gets fewer than you think. I've had a few of those on my Mavericks machine.
I tried freezing some tracks but there still was crackles below 512 samples I don't have another Computer to try.

Regarding "Drivers" I use a vanilla unmodified legit OSX 10.10 and the latest RME Driver.
Last edited by ansolas on Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.


ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by ansolas » Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:20 pm

Muzik 4 Machines wrote:wifi disabled?
I dont have wifi

Stromkraft
Posts: 7033
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Oct 27, 2014 1:37 pm

ansolas wrote:
Stromkraft wrote:
ansolas wrote: deleted some tracks so that i get below 100% CPU load.
It still cliks :roll:
When I load the Project in the latest beta it even crashed.
Ehm, you said initially that the load was 30%. What is the actual load?
Read carefully :) it is logically than when I disable multicore support that the CPU Load will jump up to 100%
OK, turning off cores is of course also something you needed to try. Generally, doing that will increase problems of the type you're describing. Live need cores.
Make some music!

Stromkraft
Posts: 7033
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Oct 27, 2014 1:43 pm

ansolas wrote:
Stromkraft wrote: What happens if you freeze tracks? What happens if you run this on another Mac or with another audio interface?
Unfortunately I think this may be a general issue. I've had them since Mavericks, but to a lesser extent than what you describe.
On the other hand, you can't expect OS X 10.10 to work fully on a home-built machine. I don't think that is the problem here, but your box is non-standard, if I'm not misunderstanding. This means there's always the possibility that something is incompatible with some software, like Live or the interface drivers. No-one have tested the software on your type of machine.

You need to do some CPU load analysis to check whether there are stray processes eating up your CPU cycles so that Live gets fewer than you think. I've had a few of those on my Mavericks machine.
I tried freezing some tracks but there still was crackles below 512 samples I don't have another Computer to try.

Regarding "Drivers" I use a vanilla unmodified legit OSX 10.10 and the latest RME Driver.
No friend with an original Mac?

it doesn't matter if your OS X is legit and you have the latest RME drivers, as no-one have tested their respective software on your type of hardware. You might get RME to help you out though. Have you contacted them?

If you want, you can PM me and I could test your project on my machine. I have the babyface, so maybe close enough.

Otherwise, CPU analysis is vital. Activity Monitor - > Processor tab and click on the processor graph at the bottom. A processor graph will start to plot. Start your project and check for CPU load connected to crackling.
Make some music!

ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by ansolas » Mon Oct 27, 2014 1:54 pm

Stromkraft wrote: No friend with an original Mac?

it doesn't matter if your OS X is legit and you have the latest RME drivers, as no-one have tested their respective software on your type of hardware. You might get RME to help you out though. Have you contacted them?

If you want, you can PM me and I could test your project on my machine. I have the babyface, so maybe close enough.

Otherwise, CPU analysis is vital. Activity Monitor - > Processor tab and click on the processor graph at the bottom. A processor graph will start to plot. Start your project and check for CPU load connected to crackling.
I like Macs but Apple do not offer a Mac with the specs I like to have or at a ridiculous price.
Besides that couldn't reuse my Multiface II with any recent Mac.

Do you have Serum and Zebra and Line 6 Podfarm Platinum 2 ?

mots
Posts: 223
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:07 am

Re: OSX + Live Audio Performance

Post by mots » Mon Oct 27, 2014 2:14 pm

Hi,

your machine is basically a beast ! check that one core is not 100%.

also check your machine with DPC latency checker : http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

when you lower your latency, you basically imply the need for a tighter timing.
if you see some jumps try disabling the device you dont need (or unplugging them) one after the other until you identified the problematic driver.

ableton should have a page about that really...

cheers,

henri

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